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Cedar Park Dad wrote: I meant more, why is it ok that a citizen has to feel threatened for no good reason? I take issue more with that philosophical view than with the cop's actions in the OP. I'm not threatened if an officer walks up with his hand on his sidearm-I doubt I'd even be able to see it, but I understand being wary. I am concerned with the view though, that citizens feeling threatened - for no justifiable reason - is ok.

I'll note, again my intereactions with police in the last two decades have been minimal, but at no time did I feel threatened in any manner or that the police were acting in any matter except absolute professionalism.

And if I wouldn't of felt threatened? What if the op is just paranoid about cops or upset that the cop didn't view him as a "good guy". The part that is the problem is there were no actions reported that were inappropriate by the officer in the op post. Just some negative adjectives and his interpretation of what the officer must be thinking. t's not OK that citizens feel threatened for no reason. It's if there was good reason to feel threatened by the actions of the officer.

mojo84 wrote:
Like I said, both ways? If action is justified by "feelings" alone, maybe the OP felt threatened by the nervous cop's actions of preparing her weapon to be drawn. If there was any other indicator that the OP may have been a danger in addition to having a chl, I could understand why the cop was so nervous and extra causious. Based on the op, I don't think the level of nervousness was warranted.

OK he felt threatened. So? The officers actions were objectively ok so what are we complaining about here? I mean I know more about the officer based on her being an employed police officer than I do about some random guy on a chl forum. He can't even say what she did wrong just that he feels bad about how it happened? Sure you can second guess and wonder about anything but come on.

mojo84 wrote:

EEllis wrote: Sure. And tone and body language is so subjective and when you are there you can be so positive but can't necessarily say why you know something. I just figure, by the description given, that at worst the cop was a bit overcautious for the OP taste. There doesn't seem to be any real activity that anyone could complain about except she had her hand near or on her gun which may just be how she was trained. Being so new she may still follow all her academy training to the letter. I guess my point being if that is something to complain about then why would people listen when something wrong does happen.

Shouldn't this go both ways? I think when officers see someone they stop acting overly nervous, it brings suspicion and doubt into their minds. When a cop is acting overly nervous, it should be concerning to the person with whom they are dealing. It doesn't appear based on the post, the OP did anything to justify a higher level of alertness or caution than normally would be justified on a traffic stop of a citizen.

Cops should always be alert, attentive, cautious and aware when stopping individuals. Preparing to draw their weapon just because someone hands them their ID's when asked, doesn't seem to warranted.

You're trying to take my statement somewhere it was never meant to go. I was referring to the fact that even using colorful, and a bit hyperbolic, language it's hard to point to anything the officer did that is actually, well, wrong. I wouldn't want to dismiss the OP's concerns because sometimes you have to be there and I wasn't but we are mainly talking about the was she made him "feel" and not what she actually did. For all I know she was real concerned but so what. Her actions were not in and of themselves wrong so now we have people complaining because the cops don't treat CHL's like some sort of police reserves like some on here think they are? Even taking the OP's statement at face value it seems to me there is just so much more to worry about that a cop who dislikes or is concerned about CHLs but doesn't do anything but act cautiously when encountering one.

handog wrote:Reaching for and releasing the retention on the pistol was a hostile act meant to intimidate. Such an action could only be justified if the LEO was in fear for her life or bodily injury. To require a CHL to present his license upon a traffic stop then interpret that as a threat is absurd.

Hey Strange is new. I'm just sayin........

JSThane wrote:

EEllis wrote:All I heard is how the OP interpreted the officers "Tone". I did not hear one bit of inappropriate behavior on the part of the officer just that the OP wasn't happy with how he viewed the actions. Personally I don't care how a cop pulling me over feels. Where they reasonable professional?" Did they stretch it out and take up to much of my time? If given a cite is it something the officer could believe I did? I don't care if they are scared to wetting their pants at finding out I have a chl until they pull me out a gun point.

It is possible to be "completely professional" and still engage in behavior that can potentially escalate an encounter. I know of incidents here where exactly that happened; body language and obvious nervousness on the part of the officer agitated the driver, which in turn agitated the officer, who misinterpreted... it's a bad loop to get into.

I'm not going to fault either the OP or the officer here, as by his own description, the OP did everything "right" and the officer is a newbie, without the seasoning of experience to lessen the nervousness (but hopefully never to lull into complacency). It is a good learning experience, though, for everyone, readers included. You never know who you're going to encounter, behind the badge or in front of it.

Sure. And tone and body language is so subjective and when you are there you can be so positive but can't necessarily say why you know something. I just figure, by the description given, that at worst the cop was a bit overcautious for the OP taste. There doesn't seem to be any real activity that anyone could complain about except she had her hand near or on her gun which may just be how she was trained. Being so new she may still follow all her academy training to the letter. I guess my point being if that is something to complain about then why would people listen when something wrong does happen.

All I heard is how the OP interpreted the officers "Tone". I did not hear one bit of inappropriate behavior on the part of the officer just that the OP wasn't happy with how he viewed the actions. Personally I don't care how a cop pulling me over feels. Where they reasonable professional?" Did they stretch it out and take up to much of my time? If given a cite is it something the officer could believe I did? I don't care if they are scared to wetting their pants at finding out I have a chl until they pull me out a gun point.