Search found 10 matches

by G.A. Heath
Tue May 10, 2011 10:33 am
Forum: 2011 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably
Replies: 317
Views: 122989

Re: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably

PATHFINDER wrote:I do appreciate many of the concerns about HB 2756. I have some concerns of my own. I haven't spoken with anyone who wouldn't prefer some major changes. I am not in a position to address the pre-file history of HB 2756. I was not associated with Lone Star Citizen's Defense League that early on in the effort.

Charles - the majority of pro-right to carry supporters in Texas are troubled by the unnecessary, distracting, and apparently ever escalating personalization of this debate. Reasonable people can disagree on strategies, and timing in remedying constitutional defects in Code sections, but our efforts need to be focused on discussion, research, and education. The integrity of one's professional life merits respect. As an active member of LSCDL, I feel that you are entitled to an apology, particularly if you, or any of your professional associates were in fact subjected to any annoyance. Personal offense is always ill-conceived, never productive, and invariably plays out as a spit directed into a head-wind.

The Texas Constitution always has the FIRST & FINAL word on legislation. Acts of the Legislature do not "define" the Texas Constitution. What I call "Neo-Reconstructionism" is rooted in the philosphy that enacted laws can pretend to "amend" the Constitution through the agregate codification of elitist preferences into the front-lines of public policy. This trend has been going on for 135 years in Texas, and reflects a confluence of varied self-interests attempting to ram through legislation during an extremely brief time window. The adoption of the Texas Constitution in 1876 was more than a bench-mark in the history books. It is the very foundation of Texas law.

The Texas Constitution reserves the right to carry (even handguns) openly in lawful defense to every citizen. Acts of the Legislature , decisions by Texas courts, and law enforcement procedures must respect, and reflect that fact. HB 2756 is Representative Lavender's bill. We should know by tomorrow whether the House will have a chance to even consider the measure. If the bill is placed on the House calender, further discussion will be warranted. Based upon my discussions with Representative Lavender's office, the 30.06 concerns frequently expressed on this forum can be addressed - if and when the bill moves forward.
Why was this bill even presented in it's current form if you haven't spoken with anyone who wouldn't prefer some major changes? I understand that you know nothing about the prefile history of the bill, due to you not being involved then, but I would think that with your position you can learn about it and educate those of us who are interested.

Shane McCrary (President of LSCDL) is one of the most active people in the "personalization of this debate" and has called for people to commit criminal acts. I have a screen shot where he posted his request for people to harass Mr. Cotton at his work place which is, as Mr. Cotton pointed out, a violation of State and Federal Law. Now with this blight on their record, while Mr McCrary remains in his position, can LSCDL legitimately act in the interest of law abiding citizens?

Can you please specify where in the Texas Constitution it provides for open carry and how that interacts with the authority of the state legislature to regulate the wearing of arms?
by G.A. Heath
Fri May 06, 2011 12:07 pm
Forum: 2011 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably
Replies: 317
Views: 122989

Re: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably

I actually discussed this bill with an elected peace officer (still required to be TCLEOS certified) and basically this is how he envisions things happening at first.
<complainant> He can't carry a gun in here, we have a no guns sign on the door.
<officer> That is not the right sign. You have to post a VERY specific sign, or give them a written note with very specific wording, or simply ask them not to enter while carrying.
<complainant> What is the right sign?
<officer> The language and requirements are in Texas Penal Code section 30.06
<complainant> Thank you.

The important thing to note is that the people afraid of a man with a gun will not give that man verbal notice, nor will they give them a handbill/flyer/whatever that qualifies for TPC 30.06 notice after all that would require approaching an armed man who they are afraid of and potentially upsetting them. So in essence you will see ignorance increasing the call volume to LE, which will prompt them to advise businesses on how to properly post. And that I assure you will lead to more businesses posting a compliant 30.06 sign.
by G.A. Heath
Tue May 03, 2011 10:31 am
Forum: 2011 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably
Replies: 317
Views: 122989

Re: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably

At this time I'm neutral on the bill. I would prefer it if 30.06 was left alone, but I will not oppose the bill as it currently stands. Keep in mind that does not mean that I will support it because I don't, its still a step backwards regarding 30.06. Now if the bill gets amended in a negative manner (which is possible) then I will oppose it. They way this bill is written we could see a lot of potentially bad amendments being attached to it so it needs to be watched for that.
by G.A. Heath
Tue May 03, 2011 10:09 am
Forum: 2011 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably
Replies: 317
Views: 122989

Re: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably

johnferg69 wrote:WOW! Just proves the simplest things get complicated as soon as lawyers get involved. I'm reading this and more confused and pessimistic than ever. No wonder we can't get oc passed in this state, even the pro-gun crowd is trying to do each other in. I've been waiting and looking forward to getting a oc passed but there's people on here that would rather shelved it because of wording or personal preference than see our 2nd amendment rights expanded. The law may not be perfect, what law is, but you'd thing the least we could do is back it even if it needs tweaked later. You think the gun-grabbers would shelf a law prohibiting our rights because it wasn't perfect?
Just the thoughts of a lowly trashman!
(I know I'll get flamed, its ok! I have 2 exes, I'm used too it) LOL :thumbs2:
We want to see our rights expanded, or better yet restored, here in Texas. I will say that a badly written bill that expands our rights slightly is a danger when it can be amended to restrict our rights further, and this bill can be amended to do so. So lets say that HB356 (would require Texas Residents to have a Texas License) was attached to the OC bill as an amendment, would you still support it? Or lets say someone found a creative way to attach HB2807 (Assault Weapons Ban) as an amendment to this bill, would you still support it? Or lets say that in an effort to kill the bill by the anti-gun crowd it is amended so that the minimum age to qualify for a license becomes 35 years of age, would you still want it passed? After all it may not be perfect but it does expanded our rights slightly in some areas at the expense of restricting them in others.
by G.A. Heath
Sat Apr 30, 2011 11:30 am
Forum: 2011 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably
Replies: 317
Views: 122989

Re: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably

Jescd1 claimed earlier in this thread that the bill was originally a constitutional carry carry bill but that the evil TSRA/NRA/<insert latest target here> rewrote it between the bill to kill it. Rep. Lavender filed the bill as it currently sits, the bill has not been edited by anyone other than the author(s) with LSCDL/OCDO and possibly Rep. Lavender and his staff. The TSRA and NRA are watching this bill because it can become dangerous if amended by anti-gun forces, however as the bill sits right now the NRA and the TSRA appear to be remaining neutral on it. My understanding is that they are not supporting it nor are they opposed to it, as it currently sits.
by G.A. Heath
Sat Apr 30, 2011 10:38 am
Forum: 2011 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably
Replies: 317
Views: 122989

Re: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably

I'm not too sure why they are attacking anyone who isn't anti-gun at this point, their bill is making progress even with the flaws it has. But, like last session, the personal attacks have begun as have the attacks on the NRA and TSRA. The falsehoods and accusations have started leading me to wonder if there is a way to drop coyote bait for them to prevent the further spread of rabies.
by G.A. Heath
Fri Apr 29, 2011 11:08 am
Forum: 2011 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably
Replies: 317
Views: 122989

Re: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably

jecsd1 wrote:And... Contrary to popular belief HB 2756 was indeed drafted as a simple constitutional OC bill with NO mention of amending 30.06. I have personally spoken face to face with the author of the bill and representative Lavender and they have told me that it was fooled with in League Committee by "people" that may or may not be associated w TSRA, to hurt it's chances of passage.
How did this bill get to what it is now from something that would simply Strike handgun from TPC 46.02, Strike 46.02(a-1), and modify 46.035(a) to apply to licensed/unlicensed carry (or better yet strike it as well)?
by G.A. Heath
Fri Apr 29, 2011 10:53 am
Forum: 2011 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably
Replies: 317
Views: 122989

Re: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably

Hoi Polloi wrote:As it is written now, a 30.06 is required to keep out open carry. If that provision is struck, any gunbuster sign will be sufficient for open carry while a 30.06 will be required for concealed carry. My question is if a 30.06 sign would be one of the many signs that would keep an OC out as well under the updated version. I ask this because the 30.06 sign says it applies to license holders, who will be the only people who OC under the updated version, too.
Sec. 30.06. TRESPASS BY HOLDER OF LICENSE TO CARRY CONCEALED HANDGUN. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder:

(1) carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, on property of another without effective consent; and

(2) received notice that:

(A) entry on the property by a license holder with a concealed handgun was forbidden; or

(B) remaining on the property with a concealed handgun was forbidden and failed to depart.

(b) For purposes of this section, a person receives notice if the owner of the property or someone with apparent authority to act for the owner provides notice to the person by oral or written communication.

(c) In this section:

(1) "Entry" has the meaning assigned by Section 30.05(b).

(2) "License holder" has the meaning assigned by Section 46.035(f).

(3) "Written communication" means:

(A) a card or other document on which is written language identical to the following: "Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by holder of license to carry a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code (concealed handgun law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun"; or

(B) a sign posted on the property that:

(i) includes the language described by Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish;

(ii) appears in contrasting colors with block letters at least one inch in height; and

(iii) is displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public.

(d) An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor.

(e) It is an exception to the application of this section that the property on which the license holder carries a handgun is owned or leased by a governmental entity and is not a premises or other place on which the license holder is prohibited from carrying the handgun under Section 46.03 or 46.035.
It specifically says concealed in 30.06(a)(1)(A) so unless concealed is stricken from 30.06 then it would apply to concealed only. This bill as it currently stands does strike concealed from 30.06
by G.A. Heath
Fri Apr 29, 2011 9:29 am
Forum: 2011 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably
Replies: 317
Views: 122989

Re: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably

Hoi Polloi wrote:
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Hoi Polloi wrote:So would a valid 30.06 ALSO prohibit open carry under this bill since the open carry people will be CHL holders?
Correct.

Chas.
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
jimlongley wrote:So, if there was 30.06 sign, but not a gun busters sign, OC would be OK but not CC?
Correct. Herein lies the danger in terms of the willingness of the legislature to require property owners to post two different signs. Two "big ugly signs" would never pass; but leaving 30.06 along and allow open-carriers to be subject to TPC §30.05 is hardly an onerous burden. The generic "no guns" decals are small, cheap, and easily applied.

Chas.
Is it me or are these answers contradictory? I'm reading one to say a valid 30.06 sign would prohibit open carry while the second response says it wouldn't prohibit it?
For the first, If the bill passes as it currently is then 30.06 will apply to both. If the 30.06 provision is dropped from the bill and it passes then the second would apply.
by G.A. Heath
Thu Apr 28, 2011 7:39 pm
Forum: 2011 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably
Replies: 317
Views: 122989

Re: HB 2756 Open Carry bill reported favorably

<sarcasm>You mean it made it out of committee? I thought the TSRA, NRA, CHLforum, and others were conspiring to kill every chance for OC... Killing it in committee provides the best chance for success, so are they conspiring to let it pass so they look like they support it now?</sarcasm>

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