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philip964 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 30, 2020 8:28 am Annual deaths in America down for the year so far.

Flightmare wrote: ↑Fri Sep 11, 2020 10:42 am

striker55 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 9:49 am

strogg wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:25 am

striker55 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:56 am Read a vaccine will be available in November https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2 ... pdates-us/

It will definitely not surprise me if the vaccine comes out a week before elections. At this point, the vaccine is being produced in full capacity despite it not being approved yet. This is in stark contrast to the 2009 H1N1 pandemic when production of that vaccine didn't start until after its approval, and there was next to no inventory to go around for a long time afterwards. I also heard that this vaccine will be distributed by the military, mainly to streamline logistics.

I was thinking how would the vaccine become available? Using social security numbers maybe with some kind of lotto for the numbers?

striker55 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:56 am Read a vaccine will be available in November https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2 ... pdates-us/

MaduroBU wrote: ↑Tue Aug 04, 2020 12:50 pm

Grayling813 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 04, 2020 11:06 am

MaduroBU wrote: ↑Tue Aug 04, 2020 10:36 am Masks help. How much masks help or when they help is matter of debate, and the differences between a circumstance where "my mask kept me from getting/passing along COVID" and "my mask was a nuisance that did nothing" are hard to spot. Unless you have perfect, real-time data not only of COVID carriers but also of the state of surrounding viral particles integrated into a real-time map of the fluid dynamics of the air surrounding all of those people (in which case you should immediately volunteer your services to the CDC), you CANNOT know when wearing a mask is saving a life and when it's a hassle. Anyone who carries a gun for safety (I assume most of us) but fails to wear a mask is displaying a startling failure to appreciate risks akin to living in a fallout shelter while failing to properly ventilate it.

You can ignore gun safety rules and probably not shoot anyone. You can leave your finger on the trigger, sweep people, shoot at marginal backstops and assume that guns are empty and the vast majority of the time, those behaviors won't result in a fatality or injury. However, the extreme harm associated with having a piece of lead/copper forcibly inserted into a human body is such that adopting safety measures which only rarely prevent prevent harm (i.e. vs behaving unsafely) means that safe behavior is still worthwhile. The cost of safe firearm handling is minimal, but the benefit is both enormous and unpredictable. Likewise, the cost of wearing a mask is minimal but the benefit is enormous.

Masks are more effective if the potential spreader wears it, and we are all potential carriers. You don't know if you have COVID, and neither do I. If you know today, you don't know tomorrow or next week. Much like gun safety, you are more likely to save another life than your own, and we all depend upon one another to gain that benefit. If the guy in the lane next to you is a moron and accidentally shoots you, wearing a vest to the range might save your life, but it would be far better if he were simply trained, careful and safe (i.e. not shooting you at all).

Please don't make me call your family to tell them that I can't do anything more and to pray. Please don't make me call someone else's family to tell them that I can't do anything more and to pray. It's miserable for me and it's far worse for the people who don't get to see someone they love ever again.

bull....total bull. Equating wearing masks when experts can't agree that it even helps to gun safety which everyone agrees prevents injuries/deaths.

To be clear, I'm not equating them; I am saying that wearing a mask until we have herd immunity is orders of magnitude more important. The odds that you ever draw your carry weapon in self defense pales in comparison to the odds that wearing a mask protects you or someone else. The agreement of experts is WHOLLY IRRELEVANT. The opinions of scientists are merely opinions; only reproducible data and well-reasoned interpretation thereof are science. The science universally shows that wearing a mask and washing your hands drastically reduces (50-94% reduction) the two principal means of spreading COVID or any other respiratory virus. Feel free to work your way down the list, as most of the articles are free: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=m ... d+efficacy. Don't listen to what the news networks say that the expert say (the news networks are completely useless for this because they 1) never understand the science and 2) always have at least one axe to grind), but instead look at their data directly. Listening to FOX and CNN to learn what "experts" say about ANY kind of science say is akin to learning firearm handling from Die Hard.

Do you have any scientific evidence showing that following Cooper's Rules saves lives? I don't, but I'm still willing to follow them on the (unfounded) belief that they almost certainly keep people safe. So if we are willing to do something for the sake of safety for which we have no evidence, how could we refuse to do something for the sake of safety which has been repeatedly shown to stop the spread of a virus that has killed more than 150,000 Americans?

philip964 wrote: ↑Mon May 25, 2020 3:50 pm https://apple.news/AlR6wBxg7Rei-deDTRl3ihw

Truth from the mouth of the New York Times.

Coronavirus is a blue state problem.

03Lightningrocks wrote: ↑Thu May 21, 2020 2:29 pm IMHO, there is only one way this virus stops. Heard Immunity. That will never happen while everyone hides in their living rooms. Even a vaccine won't stop it. Not unless 300 million people get the vaccine, and we know that is not going to happen. So at some point all this over reaction has to be brought back in check and everyone will to get back to life again. Now that we all know 99% of the people who get it will be just fine. We also know that 80% of the deaths are in people over 65. It is time to get a grip! This virus does not justify the extreme PARANOIA that is centered around it.

imkopaka wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2020 1:05 pm

srothstein wrote: ↑Thu Mar 26, 2020 12:31 pm I found this article on why we should not be trying to flatten the curve. Interesting read.

https://www.pensford.com/why-flattening ... rS7gYJ6fPE

Good article. I feel the same way.

With our 149th Annual Meeting scheduled for next month in Nashville, we realize many NRA members and meeting guests have questions about the coronavirus (COVID-19) and the potential impact on our convention.

We have been closely monitoring updates from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and Tennessee Department of Health. In fact, earlier today, a state of emergency was declared in Tennessee.

Therefore, we have reluctantly decided to cancel this year’s NRA Annual Meeting, planned for April 16 – 19 in Nashville. This applies to all events and scheduled programs, including the NRA-ILA Forum.

RoyGBiv wrote: ↑Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:24 pm

strogg wrote: ↑Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:02 am

Rob72 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:38 am

Excaliber wrote: ↑Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:49 am
IF the numbers and severity reports we're hearing now were true, I would agree with you.

However, I have serious doubts about both of those. China would not have shut down their industrial production and devastated their economy for somewhere around 3K deaths - that's a number they'd hardly notice.

I also saw videos from Chinese medics and citizens of young people dropping dead in the streets, doctors collapsing in hospitals, and stacks of corpses in a single clocation that far exceeded the daily death count they fed to the public before those citizen communications were stomped on.

I don't think Italy is imposing quarantine on their whole country because a few hundred folks have the sniffles either.

I see a much more significant threat here than the "don't worry" line we're being fed would indicate.

Bear in mind that China and India have the highest rates of parasitic infections and smokers than other semi-industrialized nations. Poor sanitation, tight living quarters, etc.

Italy is "not that bad", but they have most definitely been staggering along for quite sometime in the wake of the EU debacle.

Yes, China and Italy would. Why? Because the more dense your population, the less available advanced healthcare is, and if you are genuinely trying to slow the spread of a disease, that is what you do. The greatest threat to our overall well-being at the moment is network news and their collective fear-mongering.

I will point out the obvious- if I desired to see that a large cross-section of America was exposed and (ideally) infected, I would encourage people who are already ill with respiratory issues to congregate with other such people, knowing that statistically, sooner or later, there will be a perfect storm of concurrent infections. People watch the news. They have a seasonal cough/cold, so they're afraid and go to the ER for testing. So do 200 of their not-so-closest friends.

Never attribute to cunning that which is more adequately explained by stupidity...but the end result is the same.

We should also consider South Korea's numbers. They have unique properties of being reliable and having one of the only universal healthcare systems that work due to their consolidated population and economic situation. They also test over 10,000 people per day for surprise flu. That's 4x more per day than the US has tested throughout the entire outbreak. The numbers coming out of the country are very promising. As the test gets more sensitive, they capture lighter and lighter infections. So far, they do have a large number of infections. They also report a low mortality rate of about 0.6%. With that in mind, we are seeing a statistical mortality rate of < 0.5%, which focus on the elderly and folks with preexisting chronic health problems. To compare, the common flu has a mortality rate of 0.15 to 0.2%. In other words, the surprise flu has a statistical mortality rate that is only 2-3x more than the flu, not tens or hundreds as people are led to believe. Also, the target for surprise flu is geared more toward the elderly than the regular flu.

That information is what we should react to. For the vast majority of us on the board who are not in the elderly crowd, we may just have to deal with another flu-like illness. Not a big deal. Extra prep around that is either not difficult or nonexistent as we are already prepped for worse things. To put it in perspective, a healthy non-elderly adult will be twice as likely to die in a car crash this year than of the surprise flu. Think about that for a bit. As for the elderly in this group, there is more to worry about. I'm not part of that group, so I can't speak for those of you who are. But for those who are who are also going a little "crazy" over it, I won't judge, and I will pray for your health throughout this and the next winter outbreak. Yes, I'm pretty certain it will break out again around October-November. Things like this always do. It will be worse, but by then we'll know exactly what we're up against.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_S._Fauci

Dr Fauci was just on Hannity. He said the fatality rate of the flu is 0.1% and covid19 is currently between 2.5 and 3%,with 10% of cases being serious. That's 25 to 30x the mortality rate compared to the regular flu.

We have our first case in Tarrant County today. The patient had been treating themselves for the regular flu for a week, before presenting at the er today and testing positive for covid19. That means that person has been living outside containment for 2 weeks spreading the virus.

The only good news is that tomorrow it will be in the 80s and the virus only lasts about 8 hours on 86 degree surfaces. Sorry, can't find that link right now.

Rob72 wrote: ↑Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:38 am

Excaliber wrote: ↑Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:49 am
IF the numbers and severity reports we're hearing now were true, I would agree with you.

However, I have serious doubts about both of those. China would not have shut down their industrial production and devastated their economy for somewhere around 3K deaths - that's a number they'd hardly notice.

I also saw videos from Chinese medics and citizens of young people dropping dead in the streets, doctors collapsing in hospitals, and stacks of corpses in a single clocation that far exceeded the daily death count they fed to the public before those citizen communications were stomped on.

I don't think Italy is imposing quarantine on their whole country because a few hundred folks have the sniffles either.

I see a much more significant threat here than the "don't worry" line we're being fed would indicate.

Bear in mind that China and India have the highest rates of parasitic infections and smokers than other semi-industrialized nations. Poor sanitation, tight living quarters, etc.

Italy is "not that bad", but they have most definitely been staggering along for quite sometime in the wake of the EU debacle.

Yes, China and Italy would. Why? Because the more dense your population, the less available advanced healthcare is, and if you are genuinely trying to slow the spread of a disease, that is what you do. The greatest threat to our overall well-being at the moment is network news and their collective fear-mongering.

I will point out the obvious- if I desired to see that a large cross-section of America was exposed and (ideally) infected, I would encourage people who are already ill with respiratory issues to congregate with other such people, knowing that statistically, sooner or later, there will be a perfect storm of concurrent infections. People watch the news. They have a seasonal cough/cold, so they're afraid and go to the ER for testing. So do 200 of their not-so-closest friends.

Never attribute to cunning that which is more adequately explained by stupidity...but the end result is the same.