TexasCHLforum.com

[b][u][color=#FF0000]handog[/color][/u][/b] wrote:

The Annoyed Man wrote:The bottom line is this: you HAVE rights, but the state chooses to control how you express them. Whether or not that is acceptable in light of the Constitution is an argument for another thread, but I'm not talking about ideology here, I'm talking about objective reality that we all have to deal with. We have had at least one member I can think of (handog) who learned a VERY expensive lession, even though he broke no laws, and in the end was not ever convicted of anything......ALL because a hysterical citizen and a squad of overzealous cops in a "progressive-minded" city had a very poor understanding of the law.

An arrest record with a gun will follow you around for life even if the charge is dismissed. Recently, while attempting to cross the Canadian border I was deported and banned from entering after a brutal pat down and interrogation. Thanks Round Rock PD

From the horse's mouth himself! Dude, that sucks.

Voodoo95 wrote:Thank you so very much. You've given me amazing information. Everything you have said, I will work on. I'd love to learn more about de-escalating a bad situation because that seems to be the best route. After all I don't have to worry about getting hurt or hurting someone if there is no fight. I have recently started taking Krav Maga lessons and unfortunately they haven't taught these things. Thanks for giving me a second chance.

Voodoo95, Andy gave you some good stuff. When you get around to taking the CHL class, conflict resolution and deescalation are a mandatory part of the class. But, even without taking the class, some of it is just common sense, everyday stuff that you probably already know and maybe practice, but just never thought about it much. Stuff like, treat other people with friendly, polite respect, and in most cases, it will be returned to you (the Bible calls it, "do unto others as you have them do unto you"). EVEN IF the other guy started it, it is ALWAYS cheaper, easier, and less painful to walk away if you possibly can. Who cares what some punk thinks about whether you backed down or not? In most cases, you'll never see that guy again, so if he mocks you as you walk away, it doesn't matter. You'll never have to deal with him again. Who is he to you? Nothing. That's who. When you think about it that way, it is easy to shrug off insults that really don't matter.

If you can afford it, find a CHL instructor who will let you take the class, even though you're too young to get the license. You'll not only learn about the conflict resolution/deescalation stuff, but you'll also learn about the legal use of force and use of deadly force in Texas. Not sure where you live, but Charles Cotton, the owner of the owner of this website who could rightfully be called the "father of CHL in Texas", is a Houston area attorney who sometimes teaches "use of force" seminars which are highly informative about the legal aspects of self-defense. You may not carry a handgun around, but you do have a shotty, and you can certainly have a pistol in your own home - so it is a good idea to be as informed as possible about the legal consequences of a self-defense shooting. If you are involved in one and it is a righteous shoot, you will probably get off scott-free, but not without a lot of hassle and expense before it is over, so it pays to be SURE of your legal standing before you pull the trigger.

And, just like Andy said (and despite some braggadocio you'll hear on the Interwebs), if you do have to shoot someone, even completely righteously, it will likely be a traumatic experience which will take a while to get over. You will get over it—if you are certain that you were in the right—but getting over it is usually a process, and there's no ignoring it or pretending it doesn't exist. Denial isn't a healthy mental state. You don't want that, so it pays to be absolutely certain that you had no choice.

But keep learning. One of the characteristics of a good warrior is that he is always learning. He's never too proud to admit that he can always learn more. You see, being a warrior involves training of the mind as much as it does training of the body.

Good look with it all.

C-dub wrote:

AndyC wrote:Ok, youngster, I need to apologize to you too - I probably read something in there late at night that you didn't intend.

Now, I'm not "Ye Ultimate Warfighter" but I've been through some stuff (as have a number of others here) and some of that learning might be valuable, so I'm going to write something up for you that I want you to pay attention to - I'll post it later. Everything I'm going to tell you has a point, so don't skim it looking just for "the good bits".

I'm not a youngster, but I am a few months younger than you old man.

I'll also be waiting.

Yer both a couple of punks.

b322da wrote:

jmra wrote:

Voodoo95 wrote:Yeah I've been following that. I don't want to cause any one alarm. I just want to protect myself. I live in San Antonio and now that I've been able to actually go out and experience the world, I've noticed that my city has quite a bit of gang violence and just violence in general. I try to avoid trouble as much as possible but already I've been in situations where I've had knives pulled on me and been ganged up on. Is it possible and wise to find a way to let's say keep my gun on a sling and covered up by a jacket? It'll be hellish during the summer, but my discomfort is a small price to pay for my life.

Some suggestions/advice:
1. Take some type of defensive courses (those that teach self discipline along with defensive maneuvers are best).
2. Learn how to use and carry non lethal defensive materials.
3. Choose your friends wisely.
4. Stay away from alcohol and places that serve it.
5. Nothing good happens at 2:00am.
6. Don't do or say anything you wouldn't do if your Momma was standing next you.

If you live by the six items above the likelihood that you will survive the next two years with the ability to still get a CHL will be extremely high. Not many 19 year olds today are mature enough to accept the above advice. Hopefully you are.

I might add one more at the top of the list:

Join the Army. And your problem is solved.

Jim

Jim nails it!

What AndyC said about "don't go stupid places" was adequately expanded in Jumping Frog's "Iron Triangle", and both were extensions of my statement that it isn't a wise thing to carry around a shotgun, even if it is legal, because you have no control over how someone perceives your intent.

What you are going to find here on this forum is a pretty big group of people whose collective wisdom about carrying a firearm is based on many years of actually carrying a gun.....lawfully. And by the way, AndyC's experience is hard earned, growing up in a country a LOT more dangerous than the streets of San Antonio. Listen to him.

The bottom line is this: you HAVE rights, but the state chooses to control how you express them. Whether or not that is acceptable in light of the Constitution is an argument for another thread, but I'm not talking about ideology here, I'm talking about objective reality that we all have to deal with. We have had at least one member I can think of (handog) who learned a VERY expensive lession, even though he broke no laws, and in the end was not ever convicted of anything......ALL because a hysterical citizen and a squad of overzealous cops in a "progressive-minded" city had a very poor understanding of the law.

This is the REAL environment some of us exist in, and by the way, San Antonio is not exactly a hotbed of conservatism. So that is a city that I would be far less likely to tote a shotgun around in than, say.... San Angelo.

In the motorcycling world, there is a saying: "There are lots of old riders, and lots of bold riders; but there are no old, bold riders." Carrying a firearm is like that. There are lots of people who have carried for years and stayed out of jail. There are lots of hotheads who are easily riled up who have stayed out of jail for years. But there are no easily-riled-up-hotheads who carry guns for years without staying out of jail. That's kind of what AndyC was getting at with his "wind in your ego" comment. There are a lot of compromises all of us who carry wind up having to make. You'll hear over and over again, "nothing good happens after 10:00 p.m." and stuff like that. Do I have a right to go pretty much anywhere I want to while carrying? With some clearly defined exceptions, the answer is YES. However, is it SMART to GO to some places? Maybe not. Your job when carrying is to avoid having to use your gun, and that necessarily means avoiding the kinds of places and situations in which the odds of having to use your gun go up.

And, as Jim pointed out, if you join the Army, this difficulty with getting a CHL at age 19 goes away. Of course, by the time you get out of basic and sent off to wherever, it may be to a state that does not allow anyone under 21 to get a carry license, or worse yet, to a state that simply doesn't allow people to carry at all. Only you can decide of that risk is worth the effort it will take for a chance at a Texas CHL. You would still be doing a great and worthy service for your country.

Alternatively, you can keep a shotgun in your car, avoid the Iron Triangle of Stupidity (thank you Mr. Froggy, I'll be using that in the future.....with proper attribution of course....), and be patient.

One last comment..... You mentioned in a previous post trying to carry your shotgun around under your coat. Don't. That would be rushing straight into the center of the Iron Triangle of Stupid. The law says you have a right to openly carry your shotgun (as long as it is not done in a manner to cause alarm). Concealing it may be legal, but it is a singularly bad idea. Your filter ought to be: "how will I be able to explain this to a cop?" Yes, it is legal, but most cops are going to suspect you of bad intent if they ever discover you to be concealing a shotgun under your coat during an "interview".

Bottom line: either be patient, or join the military. You've only got 2 years to go. That may seem like a long time to you now, but when you're in your 60s (like me), 2 years won't last nearly long enough.

Voodoo95 wrote:I do own a shotgun already and I'm very responsible with it. I'm having to learn everything about firearms by myself because my family has been anti gun until very recently. Also just to put anyone's fears to rest, I've never had any trouble with the law. My only problem with my gun is that, well I can't really carry it anywhere.

Well, I know 2 years must seem like forever from your standpoint, but all you can do is be patient. My son was the same way. I gave him and his fiancé (now wife) their CHL class for Christmas a few years ago. It will come.

BTW, you can legally carry your shotgun around, it's just a REALLY bad idea. You are allowed to carry a loaded long gun in Texas, but you are NOT allowed to carry it in a manner intended to "cause alarm". The trouble is, with all the antigun knuckleheads running around, you HAVE to know that one of them will be alarmed if he sees it, even if that is not your intent. So, best to not carry it around openly unless you intend to use it. If you've been following the news lately with some of the chowder-heads in the open carry protests and all the bad press they have generated, we don't really need a lot more of that going on until AFTER the legislature has finished this year's meeting.

Unless you are active duty military, you can't get a CHL until you are 21. You cannot buy a handgun at age 19, however, you can buy a long gun at your age. You may also have a pistol in your possession (home/vehicle) if you're over 18, but in my opinion, I think that it is probably a bad idea.......NOT because you're not trustworthy with it or because you're breaking the law, but rather because a police officer might not be very understanding if he finds it in your car for some reason. That's just my 2¢, and I'm sure that others may not agree with me.