Howdy:
I do not agree with Lightning Rocks. I am very grateful that you posted that. As you stated, it is for learning purposes and will be benificial to anyone who has a CHL. I do not think you drew your weapon prematurely. You did what you felt like you needed to do at the time and none of us can say we will do anything different given the immediate circumstances. There are quite a few predetermining factors that we dont know as we were not there. All of us can say what we would have done or should have done....thank you.
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Return to “Would it have been justified?”
- Sat Jul 11, 2009 1:16 pm
- Forum: General Texas CHL Discussion
- Topic: Would it have been justified?
- Replies: 77
- Views: 10368
- Wed Jul 01, 2009 10:46 pm
- Forum: General Texas CHL Discussion
- Topic: Would it have been justified?
- Replies: 77
- Views: 10368
Re: Would it have been justified?
Here is a small story of a man just last week in Odessa who chose to shoot a few people who were attempting to burglarize his vehicle....not much to the story. I would like to know more about the time of day and if the man was charged with anything. I may be mistaken, but this is not simple theft. Nor was it simple theft in the OP either. Simple theft is a person just walking off with your lawnmower when you go inside. Breaking into your home or vehicle is considered burglary. Now we cant use deadly force to stop simple theft in the daytime, we can use deadly force to stop a criminal from committing burglary or getting away after committing burglary if they are running away with your property and there is no reasonable way to get it back without placing yourself in harms way....
In my opinion, if they were not running away with your property, you would not have been justified in shooting them. Now if you just walked outside and popped them in your car while they were in there, I think you would have been legally justified. Who knows if they had a gun. You could have walked out there without drawing your weapon and they could have drew down on you and maybe shot you. Now as far as morals are concerned....that is a completely different story. You were legally justified, but would it have been worth it? Who knows. Only you can say that. I have a $2,500 competition stereo system in my car. I sure would feel justified and angry enough to pop some knuckleheads for breaking my windows, stealing my stereo, or potentially stealing my car. However, I don't think I want the headache of what could potentially come after that. Not to mention the nightmares and unknown guilt that may arise....I don't know...tough call. Sure am glad it turned out as well as it did for you. Below are all the important pertinent legal codes regarding burglary and the use of deadly force with burglary..
Sec. 9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property:
(1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.41; and
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or
(B) to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property; and
(3) he reasonably believes that:
(A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or
(B) the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury.
Here is the penal code regarding burglary of a vehicle.....
Sec.A30.04.A A BURGLARY OF VEHICLES.A (a)AAA person commits an
offense if, without the effective consent of the owner, he breaks
into or enters a vehicle or any part of a vehicle with intent to
commit any felony or theft.
http://www.newswest9.com/Global/story.a ... =menu505_2" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Vehicle Owner Shoots Burglary Suspect
Posted: June 25, 2009 09:31 AM
Chasity Grooms
Chasity Grooms
ODESSA - A would be car burglar gets blasted with a bullet.
The shooting happened at the Woodlands Apartments in Odessa on Wednesday.
Police say a man spotted two people breaking into his car, so he fired two shots.
19-year-old Chasity Grooms avoided the bullets, but her partner, 20-year-old Abram Vigil took one to the leg.
The car owner held the pair until officers arrived.
Both are charged with burglary of a vehicle.
The case now goes to a grand jury.
In my opinion, if they were not running away with your property, you would not have been justified in shooting them. Now if you just walked outside and popped them in your car while they were in there, I think you would have been legally justified. Who knows if they had a gun. You could have walked out there without drawing your weapon and they could have drew down on you and maybe shot you. Now as far as morals are concerned....that is a completely different story. You were legally justified, but would it have been worth it? Who knows. Only you can say that. I have a $2,500 competition stereo system in my car. I sure would feel justified and angry enough to pop some knuckleheads for breaking my windows, stealing my stereo, or potentially stealing my car. However, I don't think I want the headache of what could potentially come after that. Not to mention the nightmares and unknown guilt that may arise....I don't know...tough call. Sure am glad it turned out as well as it did for you. Below are all the important pertinent legal codes regarding burglary and the use of deadly force with burglary..
Sec. 9.42. DEADLY FORCE TO PROTECT PROPERTY. A person is justified in using deadly force against another to protect land or tangible, movable property:
(1) if he would be justified in using force against the other under Section 9.41; and
(2) when and to the degree he reasonably believes the deadly force is immediately necessary:
(A) to prevent the other's imminent commission of arson, burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, theft during the nighttime, or criminal mischief during the nighttime; or
(B) to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property; and
(3) he reasonably believes that:
(A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or
(B) the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury.
Here is the penal code regarding burglary of a vehicle.....
Sec.A30.04.A A BURGLARY OF VEHICLES.A (a)AAA person commits an
offense if, without the effective consent of the owner, he breaks
into or enters a vehicle or any part of a vehicle with intent to
commit any felony or theft.
http://www.newswest9.com/Global/story.a ... =menu505_2" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Vehicle Owner Shoots Burglary Suspect
Posted: June 25, 2009 09:31 AM
Chasity Grooms
Chasity Grooms
ODESSA - A would be car burglar gets blasted with a bullet.
The shooting happened at the Woodlands Apartments in Odessa on Wednesday.
Police say a man spotted two people breaking into his car, so he fired two shots.
19-year-old Chasity Grooms avoided the bullets, but her partner, 20-year-old Abram Vigil took one to the leg.
The car owner held the pair until officers arrived.
Both are charged with burglary of a vehicle.
The case now goes to a grand jury.