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apostate wrote:

jmra wrote:

apostate wrote:Praise the Lord!
and pass the ammunition

So we can shoot the horse instead of beating with a baseball bat.

What do you think this is, a Jane Fonda movie?

Man, I'm a Vet. I don't watch Jane Fonda movies.

apostate wrote:Praise the Lord!
and pass the ammunition

So we can shoot the horse instead of beating with a baseball bat.

Oldgringo wrote:Why is this so difficult? If your church doesn't want your legal CC, it doesn't want you. Life as we know it is short, move on and don't belabor the issue as in .

See, don't you feel better already?

Bullwhip wrote:Verbal/oral/whatever (not a sign): it's he said/who said what?

Nobody is getting arrested because someone claims they told him something unless it's a trespass notice in front of the cops.

C-dub wrote:I'm not sure what the current membership of my church is, but as of 2006 we had over 6,200 registered families. I seem to remember hearing about at least 6,500 a couple of years ago. I would consider our church to be medium sized. I am a regular member and we greet, speak with, and shake our priest's hand after every mass. I can also meet and speak with him almost anytime he's at the church.

Joel Osteen's Lakewood church has a membership over 45,000 locally and something well over 100,000 worldwide. They can seat over 16,000 at each service. Now, that's a MEGA-church!

Not sure how it's done everywhere but we don't look at how many people we have "registered" (members). Depending on the membership requirements and how often the books are updated to remove those who have moved or passed on, some church's membership numbers can be many times the number of people who actually attend consistently. We look at the average Sunday morning attendance. For us that runs about 2800.

I don't have any trouble getting face time with my pastor. As long as I am standing in my driveway with two cups of coffee at 6:00am on Sunday morning he will slow down enough for me to jump in.

For those who don't get up that early on Sunday, our pastor makes himself available to greet everyone in a "connections" area in the concourse after each service. It's a fun time for the "Eyes and Ears" team.

wgoforth wrote:Church minister here....yes, to be told verbally is permenent until told otherwise. BUT, I have never considered security anywhere to be anyone of official staff to be authorized to give such notice. For ME, I would play shut mouth, check my concealment, and carry until such time as board member, minister, etc tells you not to. IF you feel you could talk to them about it, well and good. Downside is you risk being given verbal notice.

I'm not sure I completely agree with that statement. I would agree that if you, the Pastor, gave me verbal notice as long as you remained in a position of authority within that church (and did not communicate to me that it is now ok to carry) that I could no longer legally carry in that church. However, if you were to leave that Church, once you are no longer in a position of authority, the verbal notice is no longer valid. Even if you stated that the board directed you to give me verbal notice, unless there was something in writing from the board stating that they directed you to do so, once you are no longer in a position of authority the notice is no longer valid.

To suggest that verbal notice is for enternity would be the same as suggesting that if a 30.06 sign were errected for a day, anyone seeing that sign could never enter the establishment again even though the sign was removed at the end of the day and never errected again.

kjolly wrote:If given verbal notice it is the same as seeing a 30.06 sign. You can never carry in there again.
I might request a hearing before the church board and point out as example the other church shootings,or more likely find another place to worship that respects your 2A rights.

I don't know that I agree with your statement. I would agree that if you have been given verbal notice that you cannot carry there again as long as the person who gave the verbal notice remains there in a position of authority.
Example: restaurant manager some how knows you carry and gives you verbal notice. The next month head office completely replaces management team and the person who gave you notice is no longer in a position of management. I believe that since there is no posting and the authority that issued the notice has been removed the notice would no longer be valid.
I would say the same thing with a church. If a pastor came up to you privately and said I want you to leave your gun in the car and the next week he leaves to pastor another church the notice is no longer valid.

bat1 wrote:Humm, I've been reading the thread "Looking for a New Church" viewtopic.php?f=7&t=46406 and did not want to hijack the thread, so I stated a new one..

I have similar problem, at least one LEO, if not more, is always at the Church, and is known to be the security, Now the question is, IF a CHL is told with a verbal 30.06 notice (none posted), of course they would leave and dis-arm, BUT would you consider this a "one-time" verbal notice, and could you show up at the next meeting armed again.. ?

Or is a one time verbal notice a ok, you can never carry there again?

Also, can a off duty LEO give you a verbal 30.06 notice, if he is NOT on the staff ?

Also, would this be a your word against my word? BAT

Above you say "if" you are given verbal notice. Questions:
1. Have you been given verbal notice?
2. If you have been given verbal notice:
A. Have you verified with staff that this individual has the authority to speak for the church?
B. What prompted the notice?
C. How did he know you had a CHL?
D. Are you the only person who has been given notice?
3. How many people normally attend a meeting?
4. How attached are you to this church? How deep are your roots?

I think the answers to these questions will better help others understand the situation and influence any advice they may offer.