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mr surveyor wrote:don't mention bacon ..... you don't want to be guilty of major thread drift, do you?

I think that concern went out the window a while back.
I like my bacon wrapped around a nice steak. And don't even think about cutting off that fat. That's the best part.

Now that was just cheesy.

pbwalker wrote:

RX8er wrote: Oh, and you can see the forum on T_B_M computer in the background.....

That looks like a Windows machine...What a shame! You need a Mac.

I've got a Mac and one day I'm going figure out how to use it!

[youtube][/youtube]

I can feel my cholesterol rising just reading this stuff. Along with my blood pressure.

RX8er wrote:

03Lightningrocks wrote:

RX8er wrote:

jmra wrote:

mr surveyor wrote:mmmmmm.....bacon

It's too late for breakfast. Or is it too early?

Another great thing about Texas....

Whataburger and breakfast is 11 to 11.

We also have Waffle House! 24 hour bacon!

Let's go, I'm in!

Don't tempt me.

mr surveyor wrote:mmmmmm.....bacon

It's too late for breakfast. Or is it too early?

TexasLookout wrote:Another fact of price gouging is . At the gun show less than two months ago. Purchased RWS sports line for less than $16 a box of 50 . Now same company re-seller retailer selling the same box for $26.00 as a matter of fact the Retailer is located in San Antonio . So you tell me if that is not a fact I do not know what is. Considering RWS is not a USA munitions firm what is the reasoning behind a 50 % + increase in cost.

Another perfect example of hearsay devoid of any facts whatsoever.

TexasLookout wrote:I sense hostility in responses from my claims. Being in marketing and commerce myself I still stand by my claims. And also I wait for your Facts and respect all your replies. I am simply not going with the general opinions.

My Facts are based on what I see at the stores and online. I also hear only hearsay statements with out proof. I have attached a model of marketing and accept more "critical thinking" on everyone's part.

Let us not rush to arms nor draw swords as it will do nothing but divide us.

You haven't presented any facts whatsoever. Your statements are the epitome of hearsay.

RX8er wrote:Like I said, I know the QC guy for Federal, actually I think he might be ATK and work with all the ATK lines, not just Federal. He said they are running at max capacity and unless they buy more machines and more space, they cannot produce any more than they are now. And this would take a long time to see any direct influence on us. The major producers have very tight contracts with the big box stores and they cannot change their prices based on supply and demand but can when their suppliers do. I am simplifying what would otherwise have been a very long conversation with him and its a bit more complex than this. Let me talk with him and see if I can get him to do a webcast or something.

Forget the webcast. Tell him to ship a pallet or two of ammo to my house!

pbwalker wrote:I'm still waiting on information around this statement...

The Ammunition Manufactures are withholding, delaying shipments, by means of controlling the Inflated Cost of Current Ammunition

Me too. I'm not holding my breath.

TexasLookout wrote:Yes my concerns are for the independant businessman ,and consumers.

I walked into Walmart last week in the afternoon. Picked up Winchester 100 rd value pack $40.77 and for sure it was old stock. Several months back I paid $37 so that's about 10% increase for old stock. I can see why the indepedants need to increase retail cost to offset lower volume sales.

As far as 3 shifts to produce munitions I haven't heard of a company that would not not hire more help vs. Paying overtime and benifits yet.

Didn't they see this coming from the last few years?

I'm not crying here as we have purchased at on-sell prices last year.

And for sure the market is being munipulated.

If you think Walmart still has old ammo stock I have to wonder what planet your living on.
The reason you run 3 shifts in stead of just adding more people to 1st or 2nd shift is because your equipment is already running at capacity for those shifts. The only way to increase production is to add a third shift so that the equipment runs more hours per day.
The only other way to increase production is to expand facilities. No one is going to do that until more is known about what congress is going to do (or what Obama might try to do). If they do nothing then the demand decreases and then expanded facilities would not be needed.
With all due respect, I don't think you are understanding all of the dynamics at play.

K.Mooneyham wrote:

jmra wrote:

G26ster wrote:

K.Mooneyham wrote:Something I haven't seen anyone add on this topic is labor costs. Since the big manufacturers are running three shifts, well, they have to have human beings working on those other shifts...and that means paying more salaries, too. I know a lot of the equipment is automated, but I'm pretty certain there is more to operating an ammunition factory than just a couple of folks pushing buttons. I'm not saying this because I think that labor is a HUGE portion of the price increase, but that it is a multi-layered problem.

I said this nine posts down:

"Something to consider though, is that if ammo makers are increasing production to keep up with demand by adding shifts or overtime, that costs money! I'm sure that will factor into the price. I'm not saying that is the only thing driving up the cost, but I'll bet it's a good part of it."


Maybe you and I are the only ones that think that.

Nope. I mentioned labor cost and overtime in the 4th reply post on this thread. A lot of people get it.

My apologies to both jmra and G26ster...I have a bad habit of "scan reading". Comes from looking through huge tech manuals too much, I think.

No apology required. It obviously did not register with the OP so it needed repeating.

G26ster wrote:

K.Mooneyham wrote:Something I haven't seen anyone add on this topic is labor costs. Since the big manufacturers are running three shifts, well, they have to have human beings working on those other shifts...and that means paying more salaries, too. I know a lot of the equipment is automated, but I'm pretty certain there is more to operating an ammunition factory than just a couple of folks pushing buttons. I'm not saying this because I think that labor is a HUGE portion of the price increase, but that it is a multi-layered problem.

I said this nine posts down:

"Something to consider though, is that if ammo makers are increasing production to keep up with demand by adding shifts or overtime, that costs money! I'm sure that will factor into the price. I'm not saying that is the only thing driving up the cost, but I'll bet it's a good part of it."


Maybe you and I are the only ones that think that.

Nope. I mentioned labor cost and overtime in the 4th reply post on this thread. A lot of people get it.

I think you (the OP) are making some invalid assumptions.

First, you simply do not know if manufacturers have raised their prices or not. Just because you see an increased price on the shelf does not mean that the manufacturer has raised his prices. It may simply be the retailer capitalizing on the demand to maximize profits.

Second, if manufacturers are having to crank up production and pay a lot of overtime then their costs are increasing which might well mean a price increase in order to maintain profit to cost ratios.

Third, as demand increases demand for raw materials are also increased which results in higher costs for those raw materials. This can have a huge impact on profit margins and what each level in the distribution chain must charge in order the maintain profits sufficient to survive financially.