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I'm using 'Accidental' here as in 'did not intend to do so'..

So I'm pretty sure that someone who is trying to grab or catch a falling handgun is not 'intentionally' trying to pop off a round when doing so

joe817 wrote:
(I had to think long and hard on this). In all honesty? I'd have to say no. IMO, chances of the impact of the falling gun hitting the floor and discharging, is greater than the chance catching it and cushioning the impact. I guess I'd have to say I'd try to catch it, IF AND ONLY IF I was in a place where people were near by. If I was in a room by myself(eg: in my bedroom and the family at the other end of the house), then I'd probably let it fall and just get the heck out of the way.

It is an eminently potentially deadly situation, what ever you do.

Note: This is ONLY my opinion, and I'm NOT recommending that you do what I would do.

And this is where we disagree. I believe that grabbing for a firearm while it's falling can very likely cause a violation of the 4 rules, eg, you might put your finger on the trigger & squeese it as you're trying to catch it, therefore, in the case of some handguns with only a trigger safery, WILL cause it to discharge.

If you let it drop, chances are will only discharge if it lands perfectly on the muzzle (if it does at all), and in that case, it would only discharge stright down into the floor. To me, that is about as safe of an AD as you can have.

Granted, each firearm is different.

I'd have less trepidation of trying to catch a 1911 as compared to a glock, but I still would not try it.

To AD a Condition 1 1911 while it is falling, you would have to do 3 things. Disengage the slide safety, depress the grip safety, and pull the trigger. Unlikely? Sure.. still possible? Yes, especially if the slide safety got accidentally disengaged in the holster (common issue).

To AD a Condition 1 Glock, all you would have to do while it was falling was grab and pull the trigger. Thats it. Would DEFINATELY recommend not even attempting to try to catch a falling Glock.

An XD is in the middle of that. No Slide safety, but still a grip safery and trigger safety.... so each one is different.

joe817 wrote:I believe that any gun, can go off at any time, announced or unannounced, when dropped.

To believe anything else, is to lull myself into a false sense of security and start disregarding the rules of gun safety.

That's how I feel and I'm unanimous in that statement.

That's a good way to go ;)

However, the question is, do you agree with my saying that "if it's falling, let it fall. Don't grab for it"?

To me, the chance of AD/ND is only increased by attempting to catch a falling firearm.

Liberty wrote: I know, I know we are not supposed to speak of 1911 or Glock frailties. But shucks .. They ain't perfect. Haven't seen the perfect hand gun yet! If I ever find it I probably couldn't afford it anyway.

If there was a single perfect handgun, everyone would own it :)
And then what would we argue about.. color?

Reading the original 1911 discharge thread, I still have my doubts, however, the main point from Wayyyyy back in the beginning remains.

If it's falling, don't grab for it. The worst that some guns will do, if dropped perfectly on the muzzle, is fire directly at the ground. While a ricochet or shrapnel from it hitting the ground can cause injury, It's a whole lot less of an injury then you trying to grab it when it's falling, and shooting someone directly.

_NO_ Modern guns should discharge when dropped on their side, magazine/grip, rear, etc.
If it does, I wouldn't carry it. Plain and simple.

Both my 1911's I currently own are Series 80's. One's a Colt, other's a Kimber. Both have FP Locks. Neither should fire _At All_ no matter how hard I drop/throw/etc them at any solid surface.

Liberty wrote:

dicion wrote: Then again, if it was a 1911 instead of some piece of BT, it would require both the trigger AND the grip safety to be pressed, in opposite directions of eachother, to fire, not to mention the thumb safety...

I'm not sayin'.. I'm just sayin.

This is not true, 1911s without a firing pin block can potentially go bang when dropped. This includes the original design 1911s, and There was a thread about a Rock Island Armory 1911 discharging in this forum

This is true, which is why I added this:

...or if they do, it will ONLY be if they hit the floor muzzle first (letting the physics of gravity & momentum do the work of slamming the firing pin into the primer), which means, the round will fire into the ground, which generally is the safest direction it can fire.

However, the lowest distance testing that I saw that was done (which I can't seem to find right now), that supposedly caused it to discharge, showed that the gun had to be dropped, muzzle first, from like 15 feet in order for the pin to overcome the firing pin spring, and hit the primer hard enough to cause it to go off.
I Can't think of any way possible for a 1911 to accidentally fall 15 feet in a bathroom stall.

References:
http://www.sightm1911.com/lib/tech/iner ... charge.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://yarchive.net/gun/pistol/1911_ine ... harge.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://books.google.com/books?id=8bKqoP ... t&resnum=3" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There's also many more out there that I could not find real quickly.

Most of these tests show that they were not able to actually get it to go off. I personally think that if 1911's did discharge from a short distance drop like this, then they were not maintained properly, or the firing pin spring was incorrect for the purpose. Also, The Firing Pin spring is supposed to be replaced every 3000 rounds or so. If it is not replaced on scheduele, then it could weaken and make it easier for the firing pin to strike the primer in a drop.

Thats one of the things you just have to mentally train yourself to do.

If a handgun falls, slips, whatever out of your hands/off your table/etc. DON'T REACH FOR IT, just LET IT FALL. 99% of them will not 'go off' when they hit the floor, or if they do, it will ONLY be if they hit the floor muzzle first (letting the physics of gravity & momentum do the work of slamming the firing pin into the primer), which means, the round will fire into the ground, which generally is the safest direction it can fire.

Reaching for it just introduces the possibility of you sticking your fingers into the trigger guard during your attempt to grab it, possibly pulling the trigger.
Then again, if it was a 1911 instead of some piece of BT, it would require both the trigger AND the grip safety to be pressed, in opposite directions of eachother, to fire, not to mention the thumb safety...

I'm not sayin'.. I'm just sayin.