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Jusme wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:56 am

fickman wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:47 am This is a mess. I am extremely unsympathetic to the shooters even if there is an avenue by which a shrewd attorney may cobble together an effective defense. Their temperaments subvert everything we are trying to accomplish on this forum.

BEGIN WILD SPECULATION BASED ONLY ON CURRENTLY AVAILABLE PUBLIC INFORMATION

Were I a juror, I would find them guilty of murder.

I feel strongly that they were not standing their legal ground, but rather that they entered the alley to be the armed enforcers of the neighborhood dumpster rules. They go into the alley with the intent to enforce their side of the dumpster dispute, they refuse to deescalate / walk away / defer to governing authorities, and throughout the video - they make it apparent that they want the fight and are looking for an excuse to make good on their threats. I'd go so far as to say they went into the conflict thinking they could bait him into crossing their line in the sand. These two wanted to shoot somebody and (again - my own speculation) probably thought they'd gotten their legal defense airtight by trying to use all of the self-defense magic words. I wouldn't be surprised if they both have years of posts on AR15.com about how tough they are.

I hope they get the longest sentence possible; if nothing else than for the message it will send to other mouth-breathers who think their gun elevates them to a new power strata. I'll be disappointed if they get away with lower charges.

There are other ways to have a "dumpster rule" enforced. No one, elected, them "dumpster monitors". Rather than try to speak with the person reasonably, about it, they took it upon themselves, to remove the offending item, and toss it onto, the other guys property. Then, they armed themselves, to confront him, about it when he put it back. I don't have much sympathy, for the victim either since, he could have also deescalated, the situation, by walking away, and contacting the police. Too much stupidity, coming together in one place. I don't see them, getting much sympathy from a jury, when they have to answer, as to why they were there in the first place, rather than just report, a dumpster violation. JMHO

Somewhere there's a lawyer chomping at the bit to file a wrongful death suit against both the Millers.

K.Mooneyham wrote: ↑Sun Sep 23, 2018 7:48 am

Beiruty wrote: ↑Sun Sep 23, 2018 1:57 am Someone was killed over trash. That is so stupid even to walk out armed and try to sort it out. Can't a call to non-emergency PD line help?
Both shooters, would face long time in jail.

Yes sir, that's what I don't understand. If the now-deceased man was illegally dumping, then why not just call the police about it?

Reports I read stated the dispute was caused by the shooters removing two mattresses from a dumpster in the garbage alley. It appears to have happened a couple of times. The dumpsters are common to the customers of the city garbage collection. There's another alternative which is curb pick up, but I doubt that option would be available to neighborhoods with alleys. Maybe the history of the dispute will come out at trial. I believe the two shooters knew the victim from previous encounters was very volatile and may have purposely provoked him by taking the mattresses out of the dumpster again. In one report the wife said the mattresses were put in the dumpster because the city wouldn't pick them up if the were not in the dumpster and perhaps the shooters thought otherwise or that they took up too much space. It's all speculation at this point. However, two guys showing up in a common, public area with guns to confront an unarmed man is ridiculous and the father has his finger on the trigger the entire time ; several times you can see it twitching. At one point the father tells the victim he'll shoot him if he comes within 3 feet and then moves forward himself.???? It's also unfortunate the victim somehow got the bat, but from viewing the video with stop and start his hands were empty for most of the encounter. He turned away I'm guessing reacting to the first shot and then both shooters had their way with him. The father even racked the slide of his pistol and shot again, then the son blew the back of his head open. A defense attorney made the comment, "they wanted him dead". Tombstone has the "Gunfight at the OK Corral", which was actually an alley, too, so maybe this movie should be "Showdown at the DA Corral"

WildBill wrote: ↑Fri Sep 21, 2018 4:00 pm

puma guy wrote: ↑Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:32 pm

WildBill wrote: ↑Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:17 pm This incident happened on September 1st, but I just saw it.
An argument between neighbors ended up with one dead and two people arrested.
The tagline from ABC11 Eyewitness News Houston is:
"Abilene father and son charged with killing neighbor allegedly over fight about garbage"

It's a very sad situation with three egos and two guns.
What is your opinion of what will happen in court?

https://abc13.com/video-shows-deadly-sh ... s/4304099/

Based on this video and another report I read anda photo from behind showing the victim unarmed I'd say the Millers are toast.

This story stated that the victim was "seven or more feet away" from the shooter holding a bat. When he raised it he was shot.
https://www.reporternews.com/story/news ... 383106002/

I read that. He was handed the bat sometime after the two showed up with guns and the shirtless guy pulled his out and confronted him him about putting two discarded mattresses back in the dumpster which the two guys then removed again and dumped on his "property." This appears to be a garbage alley which normally is not private property but it's not clear or explained in the article. I don't know legally if raising a bat at a man with a gun from 7 feet legally justifies deadly force or not. Guess the courts will decide. No word yet from the relatives who were present when the two perps showed up armed. I saw the Miller's bond was raised from $25,000 to $250,000 each, also. The fact they showed up armed is very telling as to their intent and he didn't have the bat when they came armed to confront the victim.

WildBill wrote: ↑Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:17 pm This incident happened on September 1st, but I just saw it.
An argument between neighbors ended up with one dead and two people arrested.
The tagline from ABC11 Eyewitness News Houston is:
"Abilene father and son charged with killing neighbor allegedly over fight about garbage"

It's a very sad situation with three egos and two guns.
What is your opinion of what will happen in court?

https://abc13.com/video-shows-deadly-sh ... s/4304099/

Based on this video and another report I read anda photo from behind showing the victim unarmed I'd say the Millers are toast.