One of my chief problems -- in retrospect -- was that I had only one level of force to apply if words didn't work. If I'd had pepper spray, or a cane, I might well have used it to try to stop the two strangling Yellow Shirt. As it was, if words were unsuccessful, I would have had no option open except to shoot. All three were large men, and all were about 30 years younger than me, so I was not confident that I could jump into the fray empty-handed. I would not, by the way, ever consider using the pistol as a striking instrument. It would be difficult to justify a situation where "pistol whipping" was appropriate, but shooting was not.
Ya'll have had some very insightful replies, and I believe that a discussion like this helps me (and others, I hope) to think about such a situation and to perhaps try to decide if there's a "trigger" action which would justify taking action.
Regards,
Dirty Bob
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Return to “No-Win Situation: I'll mind my own business!”
- Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:25 am
- Forum: Never Again!!
- Topic: No-Win Situation: I'll mind my own business!
- Replies: 21
- Views: 4775
- Sat Jul 16, 2011 11:49 pm
- Forum: Never Again!!
- Topic: No-Win Situation: I'll mind my own business!
- Replies: 21
- Views: 4775
No-Win Situation: I'll mind my own business!
Scary incident on Monday, May 30th:
I was walking home from my mother-in-law's house, where I was helping out by changing out a hose bib. I had a "Jack Bauer bag" with me, with a few wrenches, a screwdriver, teflon tape, etc. Holstered in appendix position was a Kel-Tec P-11 in a Galco "USA" IWB holster, and I had a P-32 in my back pocket in an Uncle Mike's pocket holster.
As I rounded a corner about 1/2 block from home, I saw three young men in a front yard, in some kind of very animated discussion. Let's call them Yellow Shirt, Gray Shirt and Black Shirt. I was across the street and about 1-2 houses away.
Yellow Shirt turns to me and yells, "Sir, please call the police." At that point it got ugly, with a 2-on-1 fight that went into a side yard. I got on the phone and told police dispatch of a 2-on-1 assault, along with descriptions and the address.
Some neighbors were trying to intervene at this point, but I saw no good reason to get closer to a violent situation that I didn't understand.
I was backing off to a further distance when one of the two grabbed a garden hose, whipped it in a loop around YS' neck and began strangling him. This was the point where I felt an urge to intervene. I felt like I couldn't watch a murder take place in front of me. I was starting forward when one of the neighbors started hollering at the strangler and for some reason the two guys let go and backed off for a moment. YS took advantage of this and jumped into a car that was parked there and sped away. I was still on the phone with the dispatcher and gave the plate number and description.
Several neighbors had moved into the situation by this point, and the GS and bull were telling their side. I heard "...slice the fat off that <deleted>." yelled by one of them. I decided I was better off away from there and went home.
After reaching home, I called the dispatch to clarify one point, and to give my name and address. At that moment, two units flew down our street and whipped around the corner to the scene of the assault.
I think I did OK, in that I tried to be a good witness and stayed out of the situation. What spooks me is that a situation like the attempted strangulation looks like a no-win for a person like me. I had absolutely no idea what was going on, but there I was, tempted to pull a gun on the two guys strangling YS.
I've been thinking of it quite a bit, and the thing that keeps coming back to me is: "Intervene, and you own the results." For all I know, YS is a pedophile who was caught in the act by the other two, or perhaps they're all in the same family and this is just one of their many drunken brawls. It's entirely possible that I could have seen YS take the stand at my murder trial, to testify about how the three of them were just clowning around, when this maniac with a pistol walked up and pulled a gun, then shot his cousin.
I think my steps should have been:
1. Move to cover
2. Call police
3. Stay put long enough to be a good witness
4. Leave when YS sped away in his car
I will mind my own business, I will mind my own business, I will mind my own business.
Keeping my nose out of the lives of others,
Dirty Bob
I was walking home from my mother-in-law's house, where I was helping out by changing out a hose bib. I had a "Jack Bauer bag" with me, with a few wrenches, a screwdriver, teflon tape, etc. Holstered in appendix position was a Kel-Tec P-11 in a Galco "USA" IWB holster, and I had a P-32 in my back pocket in an Uncle Mike's pocket holster.
As I rounded a corner about 1/2 block from home, I saw three young men in a front yard, in some kind of very animated discussion. Let's call them Yellow Shirt, Gray Shirt and Black Shirt. I was across the street and about 1-2 houses away.
Yellow Shirt turns to me and yells, "Sir, please call the police." At that point it got ugly, with a 2-on-1 fight that went into a side yard. I got on the phone and told police dispatch of a 2-on-1 assault, along with descriptions and the address.
Some neighbors were trying to intervene at this point, but I saw no good reason to get closer to a violent situation that I didn't understand.
I was backing off to a further distance when one of the two grabbed a garden hose, whipped it in a loop around YS' neck and began strangling him. This was the point where I felt an urge to intervene. I felt like I couldn't watch a murder take place in front of me. I was starting forward when one of the neighbors started hollering at the strangler and for some reason the two guys let go and backed off for a moment. YS took advantage of this and jumped into a car that was parked there and sped away. I was still on the phone with the dispatcher and gave the plate number and description.
Several neighbors had moved into the situation by this point, and the GS and bull were telling their side. I heard "...slice the fat off that <deleted>." yelled by one of them. I decided I was better off away from there and went home.
After reaching home, I called the dispatch to clarify one point, and to give my name and address. At that moment, two units flew down our street and whipped around the corner to the scene of the assault.
I think I did OK, in that I tried to be a good witness and stayed out of the situation. What spooks me is that a situation like the attempted strangulation looks like a no-win for a person like me. I had absolutely no idea what was going on, but there I was, tempted to pull a gun on the two guys strangling YS.
I've been thinking of it quite a bit, and the thing that keeps coming back to me is: "Intervene, and you own the results." For all I know, YS is a pedophile who was caught in the act by the other two, or perhaps they're all in the same family and this is just one of their many drunken brawls. It's entirely possible that I could have seen YS take the stand at my murder trial, to testify about how the three of them were just clowning around, when this maniac with a pistol walked up and pulled a gun, then shot his cousin.
I think my steps should have been:
1. Move to cover
2. Call police
3. Stay put long enough to be a good witness
4. Leave when YS sped away in his car
I will mind my own business, I will mind my own business, I will mind my own business.
Keeping my nose out of the lives of others,
Dirty Bob