TexasCHLforum.com

Papa_Tiger wrote:

Liberty wrote:Most people in Texas are comfortable with an armed public, and this is why we have come so far.

I would probably disagree with that statement. At least in the dense metropolitan areas. That is why the number of 30.06/07 signs went through the roof this past year. My opinion is that posting 06 indicates an attitude of "Icky guns! why do you need that?!?" and 07 indicates "I don't care, I just don't want to see it for my sake or for the sake of my other customers."

I understand that there is still a lot of antigun sentiment, But I believe we have we have come a long way, and that while we saw a lot of signs go up, Some have come back down after they have met with customer disapproval or education. Just because a few places put up signs doesn't mean that most people aren't understanding of our cause, the vast majority of retail allow guns.
This doesn't mean that we should rush into things either, We need to mitigate negative responses before we actually pass laws. Education is the answer; Maybe we can get TV ads like NRA produced for the Trump campaign. Maybe we need more facts and figures.

Syntyr wrote:

Liberty wrote:
My suggestion to compare Arizona to Texas though wasn't to imply that it should be easier to pass the implementation, but rather we that we should be able to use data from Arizona to judge the success or failure of open carry. This might not be the time to pass Constitutional Carry, but it is the time to start making the case for it.

Liberty,

Totally agree on the validity of your statement. But the problem is the very statement itself requires that legislatures and their constituents use logic and think about an issue instead of using their feels. Unfortunately a majority of people nowadays rely on their feelings and even mentioning the word gun evoks a fight or flight response in them. Dont know how we get past it but I wish we could...

Education! It's worked in past, but it takes time. Most people in Texas are comfortable with an armed public, and this is why we have come so far.

Jusme wrote:

Liberty wrote:How has constitutional carry worked out in Arizona, They have a couple of large cities, I haven't seen any statistics. But I also haven't seen any big movement to get rid of it. It seems to work there, how is Texas different?

Texas is different due to population density and left wing factions at work in the big cities. Arizona's largest city is Phoenix, and it has a population of 1.4 million. The rest of the state is pretty sparsely populated, and the prevailing attitudes there are not nearly as left leaning as any of our large cities, like Houston Dallas, San Antonio and Austin. There was resistance from the left in Arizona with open and unrestricted carry, but they didn't have the numbers.

I'm not suggesting that Texas gun owners are less responsible, it is just the political climate here is vastly different than Arizona's

I don't agree with your population assessment, although I don't have any facts or figures at hand. Tuscon is a college town that to me is as liberal as Austin. and The city of Phoenix is as dense as the sprawled out Houston with a very large population of Hispanics (legal and illegal). Although the towns and unincorporated parts around Arizona are very conservative. Maricopa County tends to be pretty conservative, but they don't have a lot of support from the city of Phoenix itself. I think it's fair to make comparisons, on how constitutional carry would work.

The difference is the culture, The people there have always had exposure to guns and the open carry. Open carry there has not only been allowed but people there have actually done it. Years ago there were bars where folks actually checked their guns. We weren't even allowed to conceal carry until 1996, and open carry until very recently.

My suggestion to compare Arizona to Texas though wasn't to imply that it should be easier to pass the implementation, but rather we that we should be able to use data from Arizona to judge the success or failure of open carry. This might not be the time to pass Constitutional Carry, but it is the time to start making the case for it.

How has constitutional carry worked out in Arizona, They have a couple of large cities, I haven't seen any statistics. But I also haven't seen any big movement to get rid of it. It seems to work there, how is Texas different?

TexasTornado wrote:I'd be curious as to the % of registered voters amongst LTC holders as compared to the general public. We might be a numerically small minority, but I'd wager we aren't as small of a minority at the polls.

I'm sure it's pretty high, which is one reason why the NRA is so influential that its actually feared by some law makers.

G.A. Heath wrote:I think we can strengthen pre-emption by using the property rights angle. We have state agencies that require businesses to post, two I know of are the Department of Family and Protectives Services along with the Department of Ageing and Disability Services. These are often private facilities that are required to prohibit firearms in order to be licensed by the state, even if the property owner doesn't wish to, and they are required because of rules made by a state agency rather than a law passed by the legislature. DFPS requires day care providers to prohibit firearms unless the day care is prohibited by the fines for signs law (I believe I still have this from them via email). DADS requires nursing facilities to prohibit concealed carry.

Interesting that a department such as DFPS can demand of private agencies something that is illegal for themselves to do.