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OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 9:54 pm
by JJVP
Toledo police Lt. Randy Pepitone wanted to make sure Annie Huddleston was all right inside her central Toledo home.

Ms. Huddleston thought the man outside prying open her front door lock Thursday was a burglar.

Just as Lieutenant Pepitone was opening the door, Ms. Huddleston, 92, steadied in her hand her late husband's .357 Magnum revolver, and pulled the trigger just once.

The bullet blasted through a wall hitting the 54-year-old lieutenant in the side of the head.
http://www.toledoblade.com/Police-Fire/ ... ficer.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

No charges will be filed against the woman, but they confiscated her gun.

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 10:02 pm
by LabRat
And they confiscated her gun because........???? She's not charged with a crime.

Seems like she might be a better shot than some folks are......and she believed danger was coming in the back door.....

Not sure why the cops would think taking her firearm would be a legal move.

LabRat

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 10:04 pm
by gigag04
Seriously - she killed somebody with it. It's definitely getting taken. And I'm slightly appalled that that is your first concern, honestly....

Even in a "good" shoot, the gun will be taken, at least for a while.

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 10:06 pm
by LSL
It was to for protection - of the TPD officers who in their own folly, might return in the future for a health and welfare l

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 10:26 pm
by arod757
gigag04 wrote:Seriously - she killed somebody with it.
Where was that in the story?

"The crew took Lieutenant Pepitone to Toledo Hospital where he was treated and released."

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 10:29 pm
by JJVP
gigag04 wrote:Seriously - she killed somebody with it. It's definitely getting taken. And I'm slightly appalled that that is your first concern, honestly....

Even in a "good" shoot, the gun will be taken, at least for a while.

She did NOT killed anyone. The officer was treated and released.

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:22 pm
by LabRat
gigag04 wrote:Seriously - she killed somebody with it. It's definitely getting taken. And I'm slightly appalled that that is your first concern, honestly....

Even in a "good" shoot, the gun will be taken, at least for a while.
As has already been pointed out, she did not kill anybody.

You were mistaken; can I assume you are now not "appalled" at my first concern?

Yes, guns are confiscated during investigations; however, we see numerous times (think New Orleans and Hurricane Katrina as only 1 example) where police confiscate weapons (for no criminal activity) and never return them or make the process so onerous as to be prohibitive to pursue. Actions like that smack of a police state mentality.

Yet in this case, an apparent swift decision was made that the act did not rise to a criminal offense. The officer should not have tried to force his way into a dwelling.

So the police still confiscate her gun, leaving her with less protection than when the event started?
Nothing in the information provided makes that act seem justifiable.

LabRat

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:57 am
by gigag04
The first articles I had followed made not mention of the status of the officer, so I missed that.

Still puzzled by the alarmed response. I would fully expect to turn over the weapon used in defense to the investigating agency.

Just because a person hasn't yet been charged, doesn't mean investigators are reviewing the case and meeting with prosecutors. I don't know the specifics of this case, but that is the nature of investigations. The weapon is a big fat piece of evidence.

I hope both parties end up fine and learned some things along the way.

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 8:14 am
by chasfm11
gigag04 wrote:The first articles I had followed made not mention of the status of the officer, so I missed that.

Still puzzled by the alarmed response. I would fully expect to turn over the weapon used in defense to the investigating agency.

Just because a person hasn't yet been charged, doesn't mean investigators are reviewing the case and meeting with prosecutors. I don't know the specifics of this case, but that is the nature of investigations. The weapon is a big fat piece of evidence.

I hope both parties end up fine and learned some things along the way.
How should this situation have been avoided? I realize that dispatch will not attempt to keep the homeowner on the phone until police arrive with every report of a prowler but I would have expected the officers on scene to try to do something to alert the homeowner that they were there, especially if they were planning to come into the house.

I also find it somewhat strange the medics were rolled on this call. Unless she reported medical problems at the same time she reported the prowler, having them there seems a bit out of normal procedure.

This is why I have multiple guns. If one of them ended up as evidence, I'd still have options. Of course, there is always the outside chance that all firearms would be confiscated after an incident. I guess that would be depend on the circumstances - and the location.

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 9:30 am
by LabRat
gigag04 wrote:The first articles I had followed made not mention of the status of the officer, so I missed that.

Still puzzled by the alarmed response. I would fully expect to turn over the weapon used in defense to the investigating agency.

Just because a person hasn't yet been charged, doesn't mean investigators are reviewing the case and meeting with prosecutors. I don't know the specifics of this case, but that is the nature of investigations. The weapon is a big fat piece of evidence.

I hope both parties end up fine and learned some things along the way.
Its expected that when folks comment on threads such as this that they acutally read the referenced link so that all parties are on the same page for the discussion.
If you aren't going to read the discussion information, how can we talk about this with some intelligence?

If you have alternate sources, post them so that we can all benefit and absorb the same data.
Again, it puts us all at the same place for discussion.

As noted in the article; "Police Sgt. Joe Heffernan said Ms. Huddleston will not be charged with the shooting because "I don't think it meets all the culpability standards for felonious assault on a police officer."

Its unlikely that Sgt. Heffernan would say "will not be charged" unless he's been in contact with decision-makers who back that statement. When an officer is shot at in other circumstances, its a done deal on an arrest. So I tend to think his statement is based on verbiage approved by higher-ups. Usually you get something on the order of "will be referred for consideration of charges" or "will be sent to a Grand Jury", etc.

Now, can things change? Sure, but again, we're specifically commenting on the article as posted at this time.

I, too, hope both parties are fine. Ms. Hudleston should not experience any guilt or regret over her actions.
Officer Pepitone has a superficial wound and was back at work within a day or so.

I also hope the officer takes a hard look at what he was attempting to do and sees the danger his actions provoked.

In the context of the article, a prowler is reported to police. Officer investigates and finds nothing.
Then attempts to break into the home that reported the prowler...really?

That wouldn't be my first plan of action and I'm not a police officer.
It didn't occur to him that the homeowner might think the reported prowler was trying to gain entry?

To break into her home (to contact her?) was a poorly thought out decision.
He's lucky he's not dead.
His actions provoked the shooting; which which could be why Ms. Huddleston will not be charged (at this time).

There were other less dangerous and more common methods apparently available to him to contact the homeowner. The article notes Ms. Huddleston was the one who contacted 911, so a phone call to her would make a lot more sense before he chose to force entry into her home. He might want to take some time to fine tune his approach in future similar events - that's what I hope he's learned.

And I hope they return her property in short order. I don't think the "evidence" tangent is going to work this time.
She's the only one at home and she shot at the officer trying to break into her home. What additional evidence are they looking for?
Now if they want to charge the police officer with some administrative action due to his poor decision, do they really need the weapon for that to occur?

LabRat

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 9:50 am
by Heartland Patriot
The whole thing about the officer trying to get into the house like that doesn't make any sense. Like was said, a phone call might have been a better idea. Or, perhaps, in a loud voice, to announce that law enforcement is there and can the person please come and talk with them? Anyway, this one leaves me shaking my head.

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 1:05 pm
by JJVP
Heartland Patriot wrote:The whole thing about the officer trying to get into the house like that doesn't make any sense. Like was said, a phone call might have been a better idea. Or, perhaps, in a loud voice, to announce that law enforcement is there and can the person please come and talk with them? Anyway, this one leaves me shaking my head.

It appears that the officer did try to contact her. I imagine that being 92, her hearing might not be so good and never heard him.
After doing a perimeter check and finding no signs of anyone trying to break in and after trying to contact Ms. Huddleston with no response, the lieutenant sent other officers to the back of the house while he forced entry.

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 3:12 pm
by Heartland Patriot
JJVP wrote:
Heartland Patriot wrote:The whole thing about the officer trying to get into the house like that doesn't make any sense. Like was said, a phone call might have been a better idea. Or, perhaps, in a loud voice, to announce that law enforcement is there and can the person please come and talk with them? Anyway, this one leaves me shaking my head.

It appears that the officer did try to contact her. I imagine that being 92, her hearing might not be so good and never heard him.
After doing a perimeter check and finding no signs of anyone trying to break in and after trying to contact Ms. Huddleston with no response, the lieutenant sent other officers to the back of the house while he forced entry.
Got it...I guess I skimmed the article a little too fast and missed it. Makes a bit more sense with you pointing that out, thanks.

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 7:20 pm
by LabRat
If a phone was used by her to report the prowler, its not likely she would ignore the phone if it rang. Would likely be the police calling back to check on her or provide more information.

Don't know what means he used to try to contact her, but I think he would have persisted before breaking into her home.
From the article, he had no indication of a crime in process; why the break-in?

I think he should be disciplined over the incident.

He apparently passed up some really good avenues to resolve this event.
Instead he chose to escalate it to a danger level that almost cost him his life. Retraining might be in order.

LabRat

Re: OH - Grandma shoots LEO after mistaking him for a BG

Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2012 12:03 am
by ddurkof
Of course had the Lt. not attempted to make contact and she was disabled or being held captive, the Lt. would have been negligent for not doing "more." News media is famous for not getting the story right and you guys seem to become experts on what was or was not done on the scene.

Luckily, the Lt. was shot in the head and since Lts. don't think, no harm was done. <KIDDING>

I would bet that the door was knocked on and loud noises were made to get her attention. At her age of 92, like my mom, you could tell her who you were and she would forget before the end of her sentence. Not all 92 year olds are cognitive of everything that is going on. It is why my mom lives with my sister and not alone anymore.

I am just glad the Lt. made it through ok.