Warning for shooter of lighweight revolver, esp. LCR

[Excaliber]

My aluminum J-frame will NEVER stovepipe.

My 1911 will never experience bullet jump and cylinder lockup.

[Excaliber]

As I recall, the general consensus on this issue is to shoot only jacketed rounds from the ultra lightweights to avoid bullet creep.

True. However, in Greybeard's account, the projectiles were full metal jackets.

[stevie_d_64]

I am by no means a revolver expert...I do know that they work, and if handed the keys to one, I certainly would not turn that down...

That being said, I have owned one revolver, it was a Dan Wesson .357, and it was a sweet piece of machinery...I could not get it to screw up on me, but for some reason I had to sell it years ago, and I kick myself for doing so almost everyday...

But...My question is this...Is the weight of the revolver indicative of the problem...The DW I had was a pretty good sized firearm...The weight was comperable to most full size revolvers of the time, balance was excellent, and it shot very well...Plus I never had a problem with it as described by GB here...

Is the weight of the gun that critical to keep the inertial creep of the rounds in the cylinder from doing that???

I and the "Wife Unit" have been looking at these small frame revolvers for some time now, and this is the first potential negative we have ever heard of in the revolver genre...

From what I see here, it is not a common problem, and the quality of the ammunition seems to be a factor here...If we go with reloads, those could be crimped a little more than the usual load and still perform when needed...Some of those factory rounds are probably not manufactured to any specific frame size or weight of gun due to the market they support...

So if the majority of small "lightweight" framed revolvers are only used for self-defensive purposes, I would be mindful of this potential problem and either reload my own to solve this, or get a friend (if I didn't reload) to reload some specific ammunition every now and then to compensate for this issue...

Just my opinion on the matter...

[Greybeard]

Some 10+ years ago, I had an 11-ounce S&W in 38+P (342?) that was shot a lot (mostly with 130 grain FMJ non +P ammo) and never experienced the problem. Sold it to a lady friend in order to buy the "lastest and greatest" in 12-ounce 357. That is when the potential became so apparent when S&W had the warning on both the barrel and in their book on the Model 340. The +P LCR weighs in at 13 1/2 ounces. Many of the most popular Smiths are in the 15-ounce range. It's looking like around 15 ounces may be the "edge of the envelope" for some of the ammo manufacturers' "standard crimping" to withstand the recoil.

I do know with certainty that 15 ounce "threshold" is what has caused a whole lot of folks to shoot one of the 5-holers 5 times, then have it and 45 rounds of ammo "for sale".

[barres]

I am no revolver expert, but it would seem to me that this phenomenon would be at least partly tied to how firm a grip the shooter had on the handgun. The little revolvers will jump more with a weaker grip (limp wristing, anyone?) which would cause the bullet creep described. A firm grip would allow the shooter's arms/body to absorb some of the force, keeping the revolver from jumping as much and reduce the effect of bullet creep. At least if my memory of physics and momentum impulses are correct.

[casingpoint]

in Greybeard's account, the projectiles were full metal jackets

In Massad Ayoob's account, the projectiles were jacketed hollow points.

[Greybeard]

Pages 12 and 13 of the LCR Manual DOES recommend an "Ammunition Check" in accordance with procedures described in prior post by couzin.

[YabuUS]

barres wrote: A firm grip would allow the shooter's arms/body to absorb some of the force, keeping the revolver from jumping as much and reduce the effect of bullet creep.

I have never experienced this problem with my snubby. Of course I shoot a Taurus 605 and that gun weighs 24oz. But I agree with barres about the grip. Besides, when you shoot .357 rounds through a gun with a 2" barrel you better have a good grip on it. [/b

[YabuUS]

Boy, didn't mean to put that last post all in bold. I guess my lack of computer skills is really showing this morning. Sorry bout that......

[Excaliber]

in Greybeard's account, the projectiles were full metal jackets

In Massad Ayoob's account, the projectiles were jacketed hollow points.

The cure for bullet creep in the little revolvers seems to have more to do with bullet weight than whether they're jacketed or not. In my experience and in the accounts I've read, the 125 - 135 grain loads (which are almost all JHP's) seem to work just fine. The creep issue shows up with the heavier bullets, which makes sense in view of the physics involved.

The lighter rounds are more controllable on the recoil side as well.

[shooter1911]

The S&W Manual for my 340PD specifically instructs you to shoot four shots and then check the bullet pull on the 5th shell. That way you can check the ammo you will be shooting. I shoot Speer 135gr SB .357 or the same bullet in 38+P with out any issues, other than the pain in my hand.

[chamberc]

A few weeks ago, on Guntalk, the guy who was attacked by a bear on his walk in his neighborhood, experienced the same thing.

He was carrying a revolver in .454 Casull and fired 4 shots, and tried to fire the 5th. As it turns out, the bullet had jumped the crimp out of the brass.

It's worth a listen to that episode...

[eialbur]

First - let me say that I LOVE my LCR 9mm. However, with crummy ammo bullet creep is a real issue.

I've shot maybe 300 rounds through the gun. I had one round of generic target-range reload with enough bullet creep that the cylinder wouldn't cycle - everything else worked just fine.

Then I made the TERRIBLE mistake of trying Federal 115gr FMJ ALUMINUM case ammo. Out of 15 rounds I had two creep so much the cylinder wouldn't cycle, and two where the bullet literally fell out of the case.

Bottom line - if you are going to shoot a lightweight 9mm revolver make sure you check for bullet creep when you change ammo manufacturer .. and NEVER use Aluminum cases.

[JALLEN]

Following the recommendations in the owner's manual is a Real Good Idea[tm] for any weapon.

My experience with lightweight revolvers is quite limited, but I would rather throw the pistol at someone rather than shoot them with it.