cocked and locked?

[ru934]

hey hows it goin? i just wanted to mention something real quick, an see if im the only one that feels this way.....i am terrified of haveing whatever handgun i chose to carry on me, ''cocked an locked''. tried carrying this way with everything from a beetta m9 to a 1911, and it just doesnt feel right. brings a wierd feelin to me or somethin....not real sure why, becouse i know how safe ''most'' of these guns are, and i know how safe an cautious i am. just lookin to see what peoples point of views are on this. nothin anyone says can change my mind. way i look at it is i still have a whole lot better chance takein an extra second to rack tha slide then be without at all. again, not tryin to start any arguments! take it easy, rusty


PS: i feel 100% safe with a fully loaded revolver(an yes, ive allways been taught to leave it on an empty chanmber but....) . go figure.... all you have to do on it is simply pull the trigger an it goes bang! no safetys....hmmmm haha

[j1132s]

Hey, everybody has different believes and comfort zones. As long as their guns don't go off accidentally, I guess they are carrying safely.

I'm with you ru934. I wouldn't feel confortable carrying a 1911 cocked and locked as a regular carry. I've carried in competitions, but that's different. In a concealed, all day carry, I'd worry about the safety coming off.

[carlson1]

I don't have a problem carrying cocked and locked. I actually think it is the most safe gun there is.

[Mike1951]

PS: i feel 100% safe with a fully loaded revolver(an yes, ive allways been taught to leave it on an empty chanmber but....) . go figure.... all you have to do on it is simply pull the trigger an it goes bang! no safetys....hmmmm haha

There has NEVER been a valid reason to carry a double action revolver with the hammer on an empty chamber.

Colt single actions and clones require this as an impact on the hammer could cause a discharge. Ruger single actions, after 1973, have a hammer block that makes this unnecessary. However, since I have both styles, it's easier to remember if I just carry all single actions with five.

You simply haven't had enough experience with the 1911 platform. It took me awhile. I carried a 1911 on duty back in the '70's, but always in a holster with a thumbreak. About 8 years ago, when I decided to again carry a 1911, I had Tucker make me a holster with a thumbreak.

Later on, I sent it back to him and had him cut the thumbreak off.

However, I'm still paranoid about any situation that would disable the grip safety, like any carry method that would locate a strap over it.

[longtooth]

Many of us carry 1911's. Everyone I know personally that carrys a 1911 does so C&L.
Flintknapper did a post on the 1911 as the safest carry weapon. It was worth repeating. If you would repost that, I would copy it for saving & use as training info. Pretty long as I remember but an excellent read.

[flintknapper]

hey hows it goin? i just wanted to mention something real quick, an see if im the only one that feels this way.....i am terrified of haveing whatever handgun i chose to carry on me, ''cocked an locked''. tried carrying this way with everything from a beetta m9 to a 1911, and it just doesnt feel right. brings a wierd feelin to me or somethin....not real sure why, becouse i know how safe ''most'' of these guns are, and i know how safe an cautious i am. just lookin to see what peoples point of views are on this. nothin anyone says can change my mind. way i look at it is i still have a whole lot better chance takein an extra second to rack tha slide then be without at all. again, not tryin to start any arguments! take it easy, rusty


PS: i feel 100% safe with a fully loaded revolver(an yes, ive allways been taught to leave it on an empty chanmber but....) . go figure.... all you have to do on it is simply pull the trigger an it goes bang! no safetys....hmmmm haha

An "extra second" is exactly what a many a dead person wishes he/she had back. IMO, every firearm carried for the purpose of self defense should be carried in a state of readiness (to the degree it was designed to do so).

A properly functioning 1911 is actually quite safe when carried C&L. It looks "ready" because it IS ready, well.... so is a revolver, or if you carry a striker/other fired pistol (Gloo...Gllllo...Glock, Kahr, XD, etc.), they too are ready, you simply can not see the mechanism. Following the same logic, they should give you the "willys" too.

Also, I hope you can rack that slide one handed. If you are attacked and lose the use of one arm/hand before you can get your weapon charged and into action.. then you'll be needing much more than an extra second to iron things out.

Don't be afraid to be "ready". If you carry, keep your weapon charged.

Plan for the worst case scenario, not the best, not the average, not the "odds are"..........scenario.

Take care.

Flint

[jrosto]

If you are uncomfortable carrying a 1911 C&L, but are comfortable carrying a revolver "ready", then carry the revolver.

[The Marshal]

I felt that way at first.
Carried the pistol around C&L on an empty chamber.

After a week, finding that the safety never moved no matter what I did, I simply loaded one more round and have been good ever since!

The trick is to overcome the fear in your mind.
It is a very safe platform!!!

My XD gives me no qualms at all. Too many safeties to defeat to make it go off, even accidentally.

[pistolchamp]

Yep, I carry only 1911s and only in 45 acp and always cocked and locked.

When I did on-duty stuff with Bandera County Constable's Department I carried cocked and locked without a problem either.

You can trust a 1911 to save your life and not to blow your leg off... training and understanding are helpful to most people.

[txinvestigator]

hey hows it goin? i just wanted to mention something real quick, an see if im the only one that feels this way.....i am terrified of haveing whatever handgun i chose to carry on me, ''cocked an locked''. tried carrying this way with everything from a beetta m9 to a 1911, and it just doesnt feel right. brings a wierd feelin to me or somethin....not real sure why, becouse i know how safe ''most'' of these guns are, and i know how safe an cautious i am. just lookin to see what peoples point of views are on this. nothin anyone says can change my mind. way i look at it is i still have a whole lot better chance takein an extra second to rack tha slide then be without at all. again, not tryin to start any arguments! take it easy, rusty


PS: i feel 100% safe with a fully loaded revolver(an yes, ive allways been taught to leave it on an empty chanmber but....) . go figure.... all you have to do on it is simply pull the trigger an it goes bang! no safetys....hmmmm haha

You cannot carry a Beretta M9 cocked and locked. You can carry it cocked, but there is no way of putting it on safe with the hammer back. It is not safe to carry cocked, as there is no safety engaged and a short trigger pull.

A 1911 is perfectly safe to carry C&L. In addition to the thumb safety, there is a grip safety. Even with the safety off the gun will not fire unless the grip safety is depressed. a 1911 with nothing in the chamber is a club.

Mike was right on about revolvers. Modern revolvers are prefectly safe to carry fully loaded.

[Paladin]

When I was first starting out, I carried on an empty chamber.

As I got more and more experience under my belt, I was more comfortable about carrying with one in the pipe. Because I knew from experience I wouldn't do anything stupid.

These days I always carry my USP45 cocked and locked.

[Skiprr]

I'll echo what most others have said: C&L is the way to go. Flint mentioned racking the slide with one hand in case your other arm is injured, and I'll go one better as a supporting reason for C&L. We all know that most defensive handgun engagements--LEO or private citizen--occur at seven yards or less. I'd posit that, for a citizen carrying concealed, the distance is liable to be closer than for LEO engagements. Why? Two reasons: we're carrying concealed and it takes longer to present from concealment (generally speaking) than from open carry; and because we know that at least a couple of lawyers are going to be riding on each bullet, we're going to be as sure as humanly possible of our decision to present and fire, shaving more microseconds off the time from threat to fire.

Meanwhile, that guy with the knife charging you is probably a step or two closer than he would be on a patrolman in the same situation. So I've always felt that my offhand had better be prepared to do more work than just grabbing the other side of my pistol and supporting the shooting hand. More work as in blocking an attack, pulling some object out of the way (or into the way, as the case may be), or even simply giving a visible gesture as I shout, "Stop!" So I approach it with the thought that the most likely scenario, should I ever actually have to draw, would be a one-handed point-and-shoot for at least the first shot. Can't do that without something in the chamber on an autoloader...

[fm2]

An "extra second" is exactly what a many a dead person wishes he/she had back. IMO, every firearm carried for the purpose of self defense should be carried in a state of readiness (to the degree it was designed to do so).

Also, I hope you can rack that slide one handed. If you are attacked and lose the use of one arm/hand before you can get your weapon charged and into action.. then you'll be needing much more than an extra second to iron things out.

Don't be afraid to be "ready". If you carry, keep your weapon charged.

Plan for the worst case scenario, not the best, not the average, not the "odds are"..........scenario.

That is some great advice.

[jimlongley]

I carry my 1911s cocked and locked, I am comfortable with it and have tested a variety of scenarios with them (carefully verified as unloaded of course) to ensure that they are what I consider safe.

Some time back I was running one of these scenarios, as part of my regular dry fire practice, when I found that the safety on one had become worn to the point that I felt that it was unsafe - so I had my gunsmith replace it. The previous safety was the original that came with a lower grade Charles Daly that I bought and had reworked into a "night fighter" and it started out a little loose but I never had a problem with it until that dry fire session. It was probably still quite safe when I had it replaced, but it is a carry gun after all . . .

[fm2]

ru934, The reason it doesn't feel right is lack of training, IMHO. You should carry what you are comfortable with. If you are not "sold" on cocked and locked, that's okay, choose accordingly. The training environment allows you to try different things, ie...Single action, DA/SA, DAO, modes of carry etc... in the propper environment. You should avoid often changes in your mode of carry, ie Single action Saturday, DAO Sunday, etc....

I'll go one better as a supporting reason for C&L....I'd posit that, for a citizen carrying concealed, the distance is liable to be closer than for LEO engagements. Why? Two reasons: we're carrying concealed and it takes longer to present from concealment (generally speaking) than from open carry; and because we know that at least a couple of lawyers are going to be riding on each bullet, we're going to be as sure as humanly possible of our decision to present and fire, shaving more microseconds off the time from threat to fire....

I'll add that a LEO can point his pistol at the BG, while CHL folks cannot brandish a firearm. This can allow the BG to get closer. Also some people look like food to BG's, while LEOs generally do not.

So I've always felt that my offhand had better be prepared to do more work than just grabbing the other side of my pistol and supporting the shooting hand. More work as in blocking an attack, pulling some object out of the way (or into the way, as the case may be), or even simply giving a visible gesture as I shout, "Stop!" So I approach it with the thought that the most likely scenario, should I ever actually have to draw, would be a one-handed point-and-shoot for at least the first shot. Can't do that without something in the chamber on an autoloader...

Correct! The off hand, and maybe both hands, must be available for fending off the attacker or more likely attackers.