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Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:36 am
by doublepush
So I bought some guns (AR and two pistols) from a friend in Ohio, and my brother picked them up and has them. Now I gotta get the guns to Texas. We were planning on shipping them to TX. My brother was gonna have an FFL in Ohio ship to an FFL in Texas, where I pick them up. The plan should have worked without problems, but it's taken a while because my brother just had a new baby.
Now our Fourth of July trip to Ohio is coming up, and in less than two weeks we'll be driving up there. Is there any way to just transport them back to Ohio myself?
-Brent
Re: Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2008 10:27 am
by seamusTX
If you take them from Ohio to Texas without going through an FFL, it's a federal offense. It's a ridiculous law, but it is the law.
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b1
(B1) To whom may an unlicensed person transfer firearms under the GCA?
A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may sell or transfer a firearm to a licensee in any State. However, a firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector.
(B2) From whom may an unlicensed person acquire a firearm under the GCA?
A person may only acquire a firearm within the person’s own State, except that he or she may purchase or otherwise acquire a rifle or shotgun, in person, at a licensee's premises in any State, provided the sale complies with State laws applicable in the State of sale and the State where the purchaser resides.
Licensee means FFL.
- Jim
Re: Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:38 pm
by boomerang
seamusTX wrote:If you take them from Ohio to Texas without going through an FFL, it's a federal offense. It's a ridiculous law, but it is the law.
Moving my own firearms across state lines doesn't involve a transfer of ownership and doesn't require a FFL.
Technically, if he (TX resident) already bought the pistols from his friend (OH resident) then he already broke the law.
Re: Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 11:13 am
by barres
But he hasn't taken possession of them, yet, which is where it gets sticky. Jim is right. If the pistols cross state lines without an FFL transferring them, then that is a Federal offense. The AR would be fine, so long as there are no laws in Ohio preventing such a transfer (Federal law does not prevent face-to-face sales of long guns across state lines, but some state laws do).
Have fun with your AR, but don't do something silly that could come back to haunt you with the pistols. IMHO and IANAL, of course.
Re: Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 4:48 pm
by BigDan
I think what I would do is essentially ask for a refund from the seller (they broke the law too, didnt' they?). Then, contact an FFL and have the seller ship them there. You may want to just ship the lowers to the FFL and take possession of the uppers yourself. Good luck!
Re: Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 10:24 pm
by SCone
Per the ATF website...
(B3) May an unlicensed person obtain a firearm from an out-of-State source if the person arranges to obtain the firearm through a licensed dealer in the purchaser’s own State? [Back]
A person not licensed under the GCA and not prohibited from acquiring firearms may purchase a firearm from an out-of-State source and obtain the firearm if an arrangement is made with a licensed dealer in the purchaser's State of residence for the purchaser to obtain the firearm from the dealer.
Go see the famliy, UPS the guns to an FFL here in Texas to do the transfer paperwork.
When you get home, your guns will be yours.
Re: Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:05 pm
by flb_78
Just buy the gun, delete this thread, never mention it again, and don't worry about it.
Re: Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Sat Jun 21, 2008 10:25 am
by lrb111
Your brother bought some guns in Ohio, and doesn't want them now? I would accept the gift, and bring them home.
It would only be a straw purchase if you were in a "prohibited" situation. You are clearly not a prohibited position.
Re: Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Sat Jun 21, 2008 2:57 pm
by Xander
lrb111 wrote:Your brother bought some guns in Ohio, and doesn't want them now? I would accept the gift, and bring them home.
It would only be a straw purchase if you were in a "prohibited" situation. You are clearly not a prohibited position.
Again, that would break federal law. Gift or purchase (both are perfectly legal) you cannot transport newly-acquired firearms across state lines like that. The seller (or giver) must ship them to an FFL in the receiver's state. That is the *only* legal option.
Re: Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:30 pm
by CleverNickname
barres wrote:Federal law does not prevent face-to-face sales of long guns across state lines
Well, federal law really isn't so much concerned about "sales" as it is concerned about "transfer", so you're technically correct. But it is illegal for anyone other than an FFL to transfer a firearm to a resident of another state. It doesn't matter if it's a handgun or a long gun.
A resident of one state may do a face-to-face transfer of a long gun from an FFL in another state. But only from an FFL. Handguns must be transferred by an FFL in the state where they reside.
The only way for one non-licensee to legally transfer a firearm to another non-licensee according to federal law is if they're both residents of the same state.
Re: Interstate transfers in person
Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2008 10:42 am
by barres
CleverNickname wrote:barres wrote:Federal law does not prevent face-to-face sales of long guns across state lines
Well, federal law really isn't so much concerned about "sales" as it is concerned about "transfer", so you're technically correct. But it is illegal for anyone other than an FFL to transfer a firearm to a resident of another state. It doesn't matter if it's a handgun or a long gun.
A resident of one state may do a face-to-face transfer of a long gun from an FFL in another state. But only from an FFL. Handguns must be transferred by an FFL in the state where they reside.
The only way for one non-licensee to legally transfer a firearm to another non-licensee according to federal law is if they're both residents of the same state.
You're right. I was thinking of an individual buying from an FFL in another state. My apologies.
