TexasCHLforum.com

Something that has eluded me for several years is the logic behind choosing a larger caliber handgun as a primary carry and a smaller caliber handgun as a back-up gun. It would seem to me that if a smaller caliber is inadequate as a primary carry defense weapon, then it would also be just as inadequate for use as a secondary, back-up weapon. And if a smaller caliber is adequate as a back-up gun, then why wouldn’t that smaller caliber be just as adequate as a primary carry.

I’m not trolling for an argument. Just wondering why someone (especially gun mag writers) often say that a smaller caliber, such as a .32 or .380, “would serve well as a back-up” but not as a primary weapon.

Perhaps because it is smaller, lighter, and more concealable than your primary, and meant to be used only as a last ditch effort to end an attack if you have run your primary sidearm out of ammo or whatever.

I think your logic is correct. If it is an inadequate caliber there is no real point, except to have "something" instead of "nothing" once your primary sidearm is out of the picture.

I do not carry a backup. The actual chance that I will need to draw a weapon is quite small - it is there, but in 60 years I've never faced a situation requiring it, and I've gotten nothing but more careful and conservative over the years. I carry because it it prudent (the chance of needing it is small but not zero) and because I like to feel prepared; same reason I keep up with first-aid classes and CPR classes.

Since I carry a 9mm CZ75, were I to carry a BUG it would be a 5- or 6-shot revolver in .357 mag or 9mm (yes, there are some in 9 - another story). If I carried a 1911 (or other .45), selection of a BUG might be more difficult - might have to step down to a 9, .38, or .357 but I can not imagine someone who carries a .45 being comfortable with a .32 or .380 as a backup.

So - I think your logic is sound but I'm far from judging anything that anyone else chooses to carry.

if someones going to kill me, I don't care if I'm shooting a rubberband gun back at him as long as I'm fighting him with something.

a .32 is a lot more effective at arm's length, than at 7yds, or down the hallway.
only thing I can think of.

If I was to carry a backup, and I have something that would suffice, it'd be a .38spl/.357Mag.
I have a 2" revolver that you could pass as either main or back-up carry.

My Primary carry is usually a Rock Island Armory Compact 1911 in 45acp, if not that then it will either be my Springfield Armory XD or my XDm (Both are .40S&W models). My backup gun is now a J-Frame snubby in .38special. My four main reasons for this as a backup gun is as follows:

1. 1: Simple and reliable.
   2: Easier to conceal than my primary.
   3: Easy to explain how to operate to some who doesn't the weapon ("Its like a computer mouse, point and click") if I need to equip someone else.
   4. More options to conceal it on me.

I have carried a full size 1911 as my primary and a compact 1911 as my secondary, as the compact can use the full size magazines. I know a few glock owners who carry a full sized glock as their primary and a baby glock in the same caliber as a bug for magazine interchange.

For me it is the physical size of the pistol that defines my BUG. My primary carry is the largest one I can conceal for strong hand draw. My BUG would be the largest one I can conceal for weak hand draw.
Example; (big gun carry)
Sig P229/357sig on the strong side, Glock 33 or Taurus PT145 or S&W 442 or Kel-Tec p11 on the weak side.

Example; (small gun carry)
Kel-Tec P11 on the strong side, Kel-Tec P32 on the weak side.

Example; (no gun carry) Kel-Tec P32.

I just weighed a loaded 15 round Glock magazine(357sig Speer GD) just under 10 oz. My loaded Kel-Tec p32 with a Hogue handall grip and a pinky extension on the mag weighed just over 10 oz. The point I'm trying to make here is, I'd rather have a spare mag with 15 rounds of 357sig than a BUG with 8 rounds of 32acp. But if I feel I might need a spare gun and not just an extra mag. I'm going to pack something bigger than a P32.

My favorite carry is the Glock 33 on the strong side and either a 15 round(G31) spare magazine or a BUG. If the BUG is the Taurus PT145, it's hard to beat 11 rounds of 45acp for a BUG!

Regards, OE

BobCat wrote:Perhaps because it is smaller, lighter, and more concealable than your primary, and meant to be used only as a last ditch effort to end an attack if you have run your primary sidearm out of ammo or whatever.

I think your logic is correct. If it is an inadequate caliber there is no real point, except to have "something" instead of "nothing" once your primary sidearm is out of the picture.

I do not carry a backup. The actual chance that I will need to draw a weapon is quite small - it is there, but in 60 years I've never faced a situation requiring it, and I've gotten nothing but more careful and conservative over the years. I carry because it is prudent (the chance of needing it is small but not zero) and because I like to feel prepared.........

So - I think your logic is sound but I'm far from judging anything that anyone else chooses to carry.

with the above statements. My everyday carry are .45's, in rotation, in various sizes. I have only felt the
need to carry a BUG 1 or 2 times. Normally, I will carry an extra magazine if I feel the threat level of the area I will
be in warrants. Otherwise, I'm good with a 8 round mag with one in the pipe.... 9 total .... I'm good to go.

As far as I know, there are two schools of thought on a BUG in law enforcement. The first school is that the two guns should both use the same ammunition, even working the same if possible (smaller version like Glock 27 for Glock 22). This simplifies the training and ammunition supply.

The second school of thought is that the BUG is a last ditch emergency weapon. It is meant to be used only after the main gun is rendered out of action or unable to be drawn. In these cases, you are more likely to be using the weaker hand and unable to support it properly. It is also likely you will be at much closer ranges (hand to hand grappling). This means a smaller gun in a smaller category is the better choice for a bug.

Obviously, there are good arguments for both sides of this debate. In the end it comes up to personal choice or departmental rules.

But, how would that transfer over to a CHL? Some of the concepts are going to be the same. The chances of a need for similarity of ammunition is less, but the chances of the need for similar handling are still there and maybe greater (muscle memory will count and police can train more). Is there even as great a need for a BUG for a CHL?

My conclusion is that it is all a matter of personal choice and your estimate of your needs. You can decide better than anyone when you think you are more likely to need a BUG and how familiar youa re with pistols to switch weapon type under stress. For me, now that I am not on patrol duty very often, I do not carry a BUG very often. If I go back to a patrol position, I will reevaluate my needs then. I also don't carry a BUG off duty very often (I can't remember the last time I did). My estimate of the needs for it just did not justify it for me.

Obviously, I also do not disagree with someone who has decided to carry one. Police magazine just had an article on a police shooting where the officer carried two BUGs and needed BOTH in the one case. I would probably have considered this crossing into paranoia, but it worked for him.

I've carried a Walther P22 as a BUG because it was the only other handgun I had besides my .40 PX4 Storm at the time.

two .45s...one at 9o'clock...one at 3o'clock
if i have to draw..well , you get the picture

I think it's somewhat akin to the choice between having a "donut" or full size backup tire for your vehicle.

usa1 wrote:two .45s...one at 9o'clock...one at 3o'clock
if i have to draw..well , you get the picture

To steal from the other thread...

I never carry a backup gun anywhere I go. Heck most of the time here lately I carry my .380 Kel-Tec as my primary and two knives as backup. I do carry a full size pistol in the truck. By the way I live and work in Houston and don't feel "naked" or anything not carrying a .45.

JMOfartO:

My "always" daily cc choice is my LWS380.

When wardrobe, wx, other circumstances allow I ALSO cc a 9mm pistol or 38 cal. revolver w/Lasergrips (CS9/HK P7/638 J-frame).

Obviously the larger the caliber, and the greater the capacity in your self defense choice is a plus if ever needed for self defense.

Bigger bullet, larger hole on the other end...

Do I feel adequately armed with just my LWS380? Yep.. But then I don't buy or sell drugs, I avoid any community where the main street is named after a deceased preacher, and I avoid the "stop and rob" convenience stores late at night. I try and remain "situationly" (probably not a real word) aware of my surroundings, and on those times I have no choice and my lovely bride drags me out of my local comfort zone so she can spend money we don't have on things we don't need in a large community we don't live in I always TRY and add a larger caliber cc to the mix.

But if I simply cannnot cc a larger pistol or revolver, I rely on my ever faithful Seecamp...

Just personal opinion, no offense to those with contrary opinions..

Jesse

PX wrote: I avoid any community where the main street is named after a deceased preacher