Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

Gun, shooting and equipment discussions unrelated to CHL issues

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ChattyKat
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Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#1

Post by ChattyKat »

Hello Everyone,

This forum has a wealth of information from very wise and kind people, and I would appreciate any recommendations and considerations you may have regarding a carry choice for a petite 61-year old woman with great health but not the strongest hands who may carry in a handbag. This morning my husband and I went to the shooting gallery. (As a bonus, Mondays are Ladies' Day at a local range, total payout was $8.61 including an extra target.) Surely I am the greenest newbie on this forum w.r.t. carry options (CHL application received at DPS Aug. 26, 2010), and have shot only a few times total, the first time using my husband's S&W 38 Special Model 637 Airweight and the last three times (including CHL shooting test) using his 9 mm Baretta PX4 Storm.

In thinking about what to purchase after receiving my CHL, I was leaning towards a decent-caliber revolver because of its simplicity over a semi-automatic. However, this morning I shot both my husband's models (mentioned above) and made some unexpected observations. First, the double-action trigger pull on the revolver is too hard (previously I had always used it in single-action mode). It seems I will have to find a model to accommodate a little arthritis in my hands, especially in the right-hand index finger. Also, I noticed big differences in geometry between the models (could barely get my finger into trigger-pull position on the revolver). Thirdly, the revolver was much more difficult to aim (although I will probably get a laser sight for whatever I carry).

I appreciate your patience with this elementary-level question -- any thoughts about carry choices for me? If a similar version of this subject has been covered before, please let me know the link. Thanks for your help! :bigear:
-Kat
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baldeagle
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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#2

Post by baldeagle »

Man, you sound like my wife, right down to the age, arthritis, the DA trigger, the whole nine yards. I'll be watching this thread closely.
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Yankee Girl
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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#3

Post by Yankee Girl »

Welcome from another newbie, ChattyKat!

I asked a related question at this thread
viewtopic.php?f=53&t=37019" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
and got some good information there, feel free to mine what you can, it may at least give you a jumping off point for more specific questions. I'm in the process of building a spreadsheet with many options, listing their dimensions, weight, caliber and so on - when I get it built, I'll be happy to share.
Courage is just Fear that has said its prayers -
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chartreuse
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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#4

Post by chartreuse »

Welcome, Kat. :tiphat:

I don't have answers to your specific questions, but I do have a question of my own. How did you find the recoil on the S&W? The reason I ask is, I find the Airweight to be too light for my taste. Charter Arms do a very affordable snubby that's still light, but with a lil' more heft to it than the Airweight. Perhaps that might be an option for you?
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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#5

Post by Excaliber »

ChattyKat wrote:Hello Everyone,

This forum has a wealth of information from very wise and kind people, and I would appreciate any recommendations and considerations you may have regarding a carry choice for a petite 61-year old woman with great health but not the strongest hands who may carry in a handbag. This morning my husband and I went to the shooting gallery. (As a bonus, Mondays are Ladies' Day at a local range, total payout was $8.61 including an extra target.) Surely I am the greenest newbie on this forum w.r.t. carry options (CHL application received at DPS Aug. 26, 2010), and have shot only a few times total, the first time using my husband's S&W 38 Special Model 637 Airweight and the last three times (including CHL shooting test) using his 9 mm Baretta PX4 Storm.

In thinking about what to purchase after receiving my CHL, I was leaning towards a decent-caliber revolver because of its simplicity over a semi-automatic. However, this morning I shot both my husband's models (mentioned above) and made some unexpected observations. First, the double-action trigger pull on the revolver is too hard (previously I had always used it in single-action mode). It seems I will have to find a model to accommodate a little arthritis in my hands, especially in the right-hand index finger. Also, I noticed big differences in geometry between the models (could barely get my finger into trigger-pull position on the revolver). Thirdly, the revolver was much more difficult to aim (although I will probably get a laser sight for whatever I carry).

I appreciate your patience with this elementary-level question -- any thoughts about carry choices for me? If a similar version of this subject has been covered before, please let me know the link. Thanks for your help! :bigear:
-Kat
Everyone has an initial struggle to find a gun that's right for him / her. Most go through a few before they settle down happy, but you can be happy the first time if you do some research and range time with rented candidates before you put down your money.

Everything looks good in the case. The things you don't like are usually discovered on the range. You want to discover characteristics you don't want to live with on guns rented for $10 plus a box of ammo, not ones you paid $500 for and can trade in for half of that on a new one.

Given the trigger pull issues you described, I would suggest you look at semiauto pistols that use the energy of the recoiling slide to partially or fully cock the striker. Examples would be the Glock, the Springfield XD or XDM, and the Smith & Wesson M&P. These have shorter trigger travel length than revolvers, and trigger pull weights of around 5 - 8 pounds instead of the 12 - 14 pounds typical of revolvers.

In terms of recoil management and comfort, a large, heavy gun will be more comfortable to shoot and less comfortable to lug around. A small, light gun will be a delight to carry and will deliver a lot more energy to the shooter when fired because the inertial mass of the big gun isn't there to dampen it. You need to experiment to find your own best compromise.

Arthritic hands will generally be happier with either 9mm or .45 caliber. Most folks with this condition find the .40S&W cartridge too "snappy" and painful. Anything below .38 Special / 9mm should not be relied on for self defense. Don't let folks talk you out of the .45 without trying it yourself. Some women consider it to have "softer" (less snappy and therefore more comfortable) recoil characteristics than some 9mm's.

In order to competently operate a semiauto, you'll need to be able to work the slide. Many women find this a challenge because they are not instructed properly and are shown techniques that require more hand strength than many have.

The Cornered Cat web site is written by women shooters and for women shooters. It contains a huge wealth of well grounded information that I think will answer many of your questions and give you a good start on technique. One of the best tips on the site are about how to use a woman's strongest muscle groups to help work the slide on a semiauto pistol without breaking a sweat. That info can be found here.

Good luck, and don't hesitate to come back with more questions.
Excaliber

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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#6

Post by CompVest »

My personal choice is the M&P 9c. It is fairly light extremely ergonomic, accurate, and has the shortest reach from the backstrap to the trigger of any semi-automatic. It fits in my VERY small purse. The gun is well balanced front to back and isn't top heavy. It is a safe action gun gun which gives the shooter a consistent trigger pull of somewhere around 5 pounds every time. All of my lady students are able to chamber a round and clear this gun even the ladies who's hand are crippled with arthritis.
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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#7

Post by Yankee Girl »

Excaliber wrote:Many women find this a challenge because they are not instructed properly and are shown techniques that require more hand strength than many have.

The Cornered Cat web site is written by women shooters and for women shooters. It contains a huge wealth of well grounded information that I think will answer many of your questions and give you a good start on technique. One of the best tips on the site are about how to use a woman's strongest muscle groups to help work the slide on a semiauto pistol without breaking a sweat. That info can be found here.
:iagree: :iagree: :iagree:
I was having a lot of trouble with exactly that issue when I first started, and CompVest and her cohorts in instruction in the Women's Only class at PSC TOTALLY overcame that problem for me, in demonstrating and working through this technique (as opposed to my dear sweet husband's technique which was completely wrong from somebody a foot shorter and 70 lbs lighter than him :roll: ). Practice helps - practicing a good technique helps more. ;-)
Courage is just Fear that has said its prayers -
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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#8

Post by ChattyKat »

Yankee Girl wrote:
I'm in the process of building a spreadsheet with many options, listing their dimensions, weight, caliber and so on - when I get it built, I'll be happy to share.
Congratulations on your recently-received CHL! :party: Thank you for the link and also for mentioning your spreadsheet. Organizing the data on a spreadsheet is a great idea -- if you're inclined to share, I'd welcome the information.
-Kat
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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#9

Post by randomoutburst »

It sounds like you have hands like mine - small! I still can't reach the trigger on a J-frame revolver unless I'm shooting in single action. That's not very useful in a self-defense situation, so I will carrying a semi-auto when my license arrives. (I'm sending off my packet this week.)

I recommend that you find a gun range with handguns for rent. Some places will charge you a set fee per gun, but many will only charge you a decreasing fee as the number of guns you rent increases, and yet others will have a flat charge and you may try as many as you like. Please go out and try many different models; that is the only way you will find what YOU like.

Take into account that you need to be able to reach all the controls on the gun - safety, trigger, magazine release, etc. Also consider getting the largest caliber you can safely and effective handle; you are, after all, carrying it for self-defense and want something that will WORK if you ever have to use it.

Handling many different guns will be a big help in determining what fits your hand, the amount of recoil that will compliment the amount your hands can take, and what you feel comfortable with.

I would personally recommend a 1911 for a short trigger pull and ergonomic fit, but you will have to try one to see if you like it. The barrel is typically 5", but if you need something concealable they are made as small as 3". Some companies, like STI, even offer 1911 models in calibers other than .45 - 9mm, .40, and 38 super to name a few.

Best of luck in finding a carry weapon you like, and please let us know what you determine works best!
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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#10

Post by ChattyKat »

chartreuse wrote:
but I do have a question of my own. How did you find the recoil on the S&W?
I found the recoil to be pretty fierce -- after shooting only 10 rounds I quit using the S&W 38 Special Airweight because the recoil made my hand ache. :ack:

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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#11

Post by chefkristian »

ChattyKat wrote:Hello Everyone,

This forum has a wealth of information from very wise and kind people, and I would appreciate any recommendations and considerations you may have regarding a carry choice for a petite 61-year old woman with great health but not the strongest hands who may carry in a handbag. This morning my husband and I went to the shooting gallery. (As a bonus, Mondays are Ladies' Day at a local range, total payout was $8.61 including an extra target.) Surely I am the greenest newbie on this forum w.r.t. carry options (CHL application received at DPS Aug. 26, 2010), and have shot only a few times total, the first time using my husband's S&W 38 Special Model 637 Airweight and the last three times (including CHL shooting test) using his 9 mm Baretta PX4 Storm.

In thinking about what to purchase after receiving my CHL, I was leaning towards a decent-caliber revolver because of its simplicity over a semi-automatic. However, this morning I shot both my husband's models (mentioned above) and made some unexpected observations. First, the double-action trigger pull on the revolver is too hard (previously I had always used it in single-action mode). It seems I will have to find a model to accommodate a little arthritis in my hands, especially in the right-hand index finger. Also, I noticed big differences in geometry between the models (could barely get my finger into trigger-pull position on the revolver). Thirdly, the revolver was much more difficult to aim (although I will probably get a laser sight for whatever I carry).

I appreciate your patience with this elementary-level question -- any thoughts about carry choices for me? If a similar version of this subject has been covered before, please let me know the link. Thanks for your help! :bigear:
-Kat
I am assuming you went to Red's this morning. I was at the Pflugerville one earlier too :patriot:

While I was there I handled the S&W bodyguard .38 special revolver with a built in laser. I liked it a lot, it has a slim handle and was small in frame and i thought the trigger pull was actually kind of light compared to most revolvers I have shot. Just my observations since I am slowly getting into the revolver scene (I prefer semi-auto) and am considering one to tote around in my car and I am considering getting this one.
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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#12

Post by ChattyKat »

Excaliber wrote:
Arthritic hands will generally be happier with either 9mm or .45 caliber. Most folks with this condition find the .40S&W cartridge too "snappy" and painful. Anything below .38 Special / 9mm should not be relied on for self defense. Don't let folks talk you out of the .45 without trying it yourself. Some women consider it to have "softer" (less snappy and therefore more comfortable) recoil characteristics than some 9mm's.
Thanks very much for your informative reply; I will digest your comments carefully. On this forum I have noticed the popularity of .45s and particularly 1911s (presumably among men) but would have been hesitant (rather, just plain scared) to try anything that large. Perhaps I should rethink that. :headscratch

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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#13

Post by CompVest »

Yankee Girl wrote: I was having a lot of trouble with exactly that issue when I first started, and CompVest and her cohorts in instruction in the Women's Only class at PSC TOTALLY overcame that problem for me, in demonstrating and working through this technique (as opposed to my dear sweet husband's technique which was completely wrong from somebody a foot shorter and 70 lbs lighter than him :roll: ). Practice helps - practicing a good technique helps more. ;-)
Thank you for the kind words, glad we could help.
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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#14

Post by Yankee Girl »

ChattyKat wrote:
Excaliber wrote:
Arthritic hands will generally be happier with either 9mm or .45 caliber. Most folks with this condition find the .40S&W cartridge too "snappy" and painful. Anything below .38 Special / 9mm should not be relied on for self defense. Don't let folks talk you out of the .45 without trying it yourself. Some women consider it to have "softer" (less snappy and therefore more comfortable) recoil characteristics than some 9mm's.
Thanks very much for your informative reply; I will digest your comments carefully. On this forum I have noticed the popularity of .45s and particularly 1911s (presumably among men) but would have been hesitant (rather, just plain scared) to try anything that large. Perhaps I should rethink that. :headscratch
From the little experience I've had, I'd have to agree with some of the comments here - the bigger calibers have less "kick" than the smaller, because the guns themselves are heavier. If you are going to carry in your purse, rather than on your body, a few ounces, or half a pound even, of additional mass won't be a big deal to schlep around and could make shooting more comfortable, as others have said.
Courage is just Fear that has said its prayers -
-- Maya Angelou

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Re: Woman Requesting Help with Carry Choices

#15

Post by chartreuse »

Yankee Girl wrote:
ChattyKat wrote:
Excaliber wrote:
Arthritic hands will generally be happier with either 9mm or .45 caliber. Most folks with this condition find the .40S&W cartridge too "snappy" and painful. Anything below .38 Special / 9mm should not be relied on for self defense. Don't let folks talk you out of the .45 without trying it yourself. Some women consider it to have "softer" (less snappy and therefore more comfortable) recoil characteristics than some 9mm's.
Thanks very much for your informative reply; I will digest your comments carefully. On this forum I have noticed the popularity of .45s and particularly 1911s (presumably among men) but would have been hesitant (rather, just plain scared) to try anything that large. Perhaps I should rethink that. :headscratch
From the little experience I've had, I'd have to agree with some of the comments here - the bigger calibers have less "kick" than the smaller, because the guns themselves are heavier. If you are going to carry in your purse, rather than on your body, a few ounces, or half a pound even, of additional mass won't be a big deal to schlep around and could make shooting more comfortable, as others have said.
I think that it is a common error, amongst men who think that they know about guns, to believe that a woman needs a "little, girly gun". It's often not the case.
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