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Took my new S&W M&P 15-22 AR platform to the range today. It is equipped with a Truglo 8 reticle open red dot sight, Magpul MBUS backup sights, and a RIS grip/bipod. My goal was to test the rifle and zero the red dot sight. My impressions are mixed.

The rifle



Overall it functioned well. I had no misfires, but with the new CCI "AR Tactical" .22lr ammo, I had about 5 failures to feed. The nose of the round was bent 30- 40 degrees in relation to the case. Funny enough, the cheapo Remington Golden Bullets in the 550 Round bulk pak fired flawlessly. Absolutely no issues. I fully expected to have issues with that ammo, but nope! I fired about 100 rds of each.

As for accuracy, it took forever to get "on paper" with the red dot. No biggie, I expected that as no prior boresighting was done. Once on paper, I was disappointed by the groups. Yes, at 50 yds, no problem staying inside a 6" bull, but my groups were far larger than at 50 yds with my M1 Carbines with iron sights. I expected better accuracy with the .22, especially with the bipod in use. Wind did not seem to be a factor. I can't say I particularly like the stiff trigger pull. I selected 50 yds, as that's where the parallax error is supposed to be zero with this particular sight.

The Truglo Red Dot

This is the Truglo I have:



Once I finally got it adjusted in the bull, it was fine until I bumped the rifle. I don't think I had it mounted tight enough, as the zero was lost, and I had to practically go back to square one. As I said before, the groups were so large, that it was hard to adjust with a great degree of accuracy. I'll go back tomorrow and play some more. I'm not sure that the bipod is as good as a rest for zeroing a weapon, May be more play in the bipod than the rest. I realize the red dot is for quicker target aquisition vs. greater accuracy, but I expected more. I simply don't know why the groups were so large. I did have a few 1 to 2 inch groups while zeroing, but that was not the norm.

Huh, let us know how it turns out... I'm looking at maybe getting me one to sit next to my S&W M&P 15 and use for some inexpensive plinking...

Medic624 wrote:Huh, let us know how it turns out... I'm looking at maybe getting me one to sit next to my S&W M&P 15 and use for some inexpensive plinking...

I went back to the range today. Much better. Red dot is zeroed, and I was able to hold 2-3" groups at 50 yds. Not great, but OK for a 4 MOA red dot I guess, and old eyes. I like the reticle that has the red dot in a large circle, as opposed to just the dot, or the cross hairs. Seems to help keep the dot centered as you can use the outer circle to ensure the bull is centered. maybe my imagination, but I thought it helped and was the most accurate. I also prefer the red over the green. That said, probably because the red cross hairs remind me of my past, when sighting the old AH-1 Cobra for firing mini-gun, cannon, and rockets. That's exactly what we had - a projected red cross hair (actually orange) on a plexiglass reticle above the instrument panel.

Most accurate ammo was some CCI Mini-Mags I had forgotten to take yesterday. Next was Winchester in the 333 rd box, and least accurate was the Remington Golden Bullets 550 rd bulk pak. I guess you get what you pay for. All in all, no malfunctions of any kind through about 100 rds.

Still the only thing I dislike is the trigger pull. I think it has a crisp break, but the pull weight is too much. Looking into some JP trigger and hammer springs which would bring it to about 4 4 1/2 lbs. Right now, I'd guess it's 8-10 lbs. Feels like one of my early Inland M1 Carbines, with the early dog leg hammer and early hammer spring. That one measures 8 1/2 lbs. Just a guess right now on my part.

I'm pretty pleased with the rifle at this point, so we'll see how it goes from here.

BTW, yesterday, a fellow was firing a Mosin Nagant about 6 feet away from me. Oh my, that sucker is loud!!

Thanks for the report. I'm looking/planning on getting into the AR arena and this is one of the weapons I'm looking at for having some fun at the range with.

Thanks!! Yeah, seems they probably put the same trigger in the 15-22 as in the M&P 15 in 5.56. The trigger pull on mine is pretty stiff and if I knew more about triggers (I'm gonna read up on it) I would swap out the trigger.

Now I just need to figure out when and where I'm gonna get me a plinker and save $$$$ on range costs ha ha...

Medic624 wrote:Thanks!! Yeah, seems they probably put the same trigger in the 15-22 as in the M&P 15 in 5.56. The trigger pull on mine is pretty stiff and if I knew more about triggers (I'm gonna read up on it) I would swap out the trigger.

Now I just need to figure out when and where I'm gonna get me a plinker and save $$$$ on range costs ha ha...

Excellent reviews on the S&W forum about the JP spring kit for the AR. Cost is less than $10.

G26ster wrote:

Medic624 wrote:Thanks!! Yeah, seems they probably put the same trigger in the 15-22 as in the M&P 15 in 5.56. The trigger pull on mine is pretty stiff and if I knew more about triggers (I'm gonna read up on it) I would swap out the trigger.

Now I just need to figure out when and where I'm gonna get me a plinker and save $$$$ on range costs ha ha...

Excellent reviews on the S&W forum about the JP spring kit for the AR. Cost is less than $10.

Sweet... Less than $10 bucks....JACKPOT

I bought one of these a few weeks ago as well and I've been happy with it so far. I shot a mix of Winchester xpert, Remington golden bullet, Federal Lightning, and cci green tag for a total of a couple hundred rounds--all of it functioned flawlessly. I had better luck with grouping than you did-- I put a 4x scope on it and using a front rest I could get 1" groups at 50 yards with the green tag and 2-3" groups with everything else.

Most accurate of course was the green tag. The golden bullet and Federal were about even. My worst groups were with the win xpert.

I did clean and lube it, used a dremel to polish the trigger parts and feed ramp, and took one little bur off of the sear before heading out to the range. The trigger isn't great, but it seems on a par with a stock m4 trigger.

ron1n1 wrote:I bought one of these a few weeks ago as well and I've been happy with it so far. I shot a mix of Winchester xpert, Remington golden bullet, Federal Lightning, and cci green tag for a total of a couple hundred rounds--all of it functioned flawlessly. I had better luck with grouping than you did-- I put a 4x scope on it and using a front rest I could get 1" groups at 50 yards with the green tag and 2-3" groups with everything else.

Most accurate of course was the green tag. The golden bullet and Federal were about even. My worst groups were with the win xpert.

I did clean and lube it, used a dremel to polish the trigger parts and feed ramp, and took one little bur off of the sear before heading out to the range. The trigger isn't great, but it seems on a par with a stock m4 trigger.

I think the main issue with my groups on day one was the red dot sighting. On day two, I would say the CCI Mini Mags held one inch groups if I did my part, but with a 4 MOA red dot with no magnification, it's difficult to attain consistently. I see no problem with 1 -2" groups with an optical scope with most any ammo. It's a fine gun and has functioned flawlessly through about 300 rds so far (except for the 5 or so FTFeed with the CCI Tactical ammo). I am ordering the JP trigger springs to reduce the pull though. Thanks for the input.

Glad to hear it worked well. When they very first came out, there was some out of battery firing issues. But S&W seems to have fixed those...

G26ster wrote:Overall it functioned well. I had no misfires, but with the new CCI "AR Tactical" .22lr ammo, I had about 5 failures to feed. The nose of the round was bent 30- 40 degrees in relation to the case.

I've had the same problem with that ammo. Their minimags work great, though.

Dave2 wrote:

G26ster wrote:Overall it functioned well. I had no misfires, but with the new CCI "AR Tactical" .22lr ammo, I had about 5 failures to feed. The nose of the round was bent 30- 40 degrees in relation to the case.

I've had the same problem with that ammo. Their minimags work great, though.

The CCI "Tactical" ammo was not as accurate as the cheap bulk Winchester. The Mini-Mags were dead on. I noted, as with some other bulk ammo, the Tactical bullets were not tight in the case, and could be wiggled a bit. Not so for the Mini mags. Don't know what affect that may have. I think I'll stick with the Mini-Mags, even if they're twice the price, at least for now.