Allen Gun Show

[gemini]

All of a sudden this guy in a dark suite gets right in my face and says, “is that a concealed handgun on your right hip?”, to which I replied, yes sir. He then said, “let me see it right now.”

Was the guy in the dark suit wearing some type of ID badge? Did you ask HIM for ID etc. prior to just pulling up your shirt etc. ?

I did not personally attend the Frisco gun show or the Allen gun show. However I have friends that went to both shows and both shows seemed to have problems. Frisco, the second floor area was too dark, the vendors brought their own lights which caused the breakers to continually trip.... the admission charge of $8 was for a individual, but, if the individual brought a gun to sell on the floor he was charged an additional $10. My friends walked away. The Allen show was too small, not worth going etc. Labrat1001001, sorry to hear about your encounter with rude guy.
I believe there is a Market Hall gun show this coming week end (Aug 21 & 22). I usually make a few Market Hall shows every year. Never had a "rude" experience at one. Maybe try your luck there.

[Keith B]

I went to the Allen Gun show yesterday. Unloaded my Kimber Ultra Carry II 45 ACP in the truck, purchased tickets for the wife and I, checked my Kimber at the door and went inside to look at all the goodies. I was there from 10am to 12pm.

I went around the concourse and into the middle event area. I went back out around the concourse to see a few tables I missed the first time. The wife was looking at some flash lights and I was a few tables down looking at some Glocks.

All of a sudden this guy in a dark suite gets right in my face and says, “is that a concealed handgun on your right hip?”, to which I replied, yes sir. He then said, “let me see it right now.” I pulled up my shirt and showed him that it was unloaded and had been checked at the door. Without another word, he turned and left. This guy’s tone and body language were unbelievable. He acted as if he was a LEO and I had just committed some offense on the street.

Standing there shell-shocked, my wife came up and asked me what was wrong. I told her what had just transpired. Thinking about this for a few minutes, I decided to report this to his supervisor. He was standing a few feet down from me so I walked up and asked him if he was a LEO, he was not as I thought. I asked to speak to his supervisor and he said, “I am the supervisor.” This guy was either being obtuse or trying to misdirect me from reporting the incident.

I walked off and found another security guard for lack of their appropriate title. I asked him if I could speak to a supervisor and he got on his radio to have someone come down. A true supervisor came down and I explained to her what had happened. I went on to tell her that I totally get and respect gun safety, adhere to gun laws and other courteous gun practices. Lastly, told her that my intention in speaking with her was to ask that she provide additional training to the security guard who accosted me.

She told me that while their policy is to roam around and confirm folks have checked their weapons, the manner in which I was contacted was incorrect. She also told me that she would speak to the security guard and provide additional training for him.

This entire incident is not sitting right with me. Like most of you, I have been many, many guns shows, I always check my weapon at the door and never, ever have had a problem. Did anyone else have issues at the Allen gun show, have knowledge about their “roam and check” policy, have thoughts on my experience or any other feedback?

I will never again go back to the Allen gun show.

Thanks,

Labrat

The Allen Event Center is a city owned building. There is a gray area on whether an event that is using the building can legally enforce the 30.06. No matter, without a case setting precedence on this (unless you want to be a test case) then you have to follow their wishes. I went on Saturday and almost bypassed the 30.06 sign on purpose, but decided I didn't want to push my luck on the legality, so checked my gun and had is zip-tied.

Was the guy in a black suit or a black shirt? If it was black shirt, they are part of the venue and the lady you probably talked to is named Robin. If black suit, then it was someone from the Allen Events Center, then they are basically city employees and I would tell them they need to talk to the city attorney about the legality of preventing CHL's from carrying in their building.

[PeteCamp]

“is that a concealed handgun on your right hip?”, to which I replied, yes sir. He then said, “let me see it right now.” I pulled up my shirt and showed him that it was unloaded and had been checked at the door.

I'm wondering why you would reveal that you were carrying a concealed handgun to anyone other than an inquiring LEO. If he isn't in uniform, or displaying a badge and department ID, my reply is always the same: "It's none of your business." It seems to me that this business of acting one way about a lawfully concealed handgun in one place and acting differently in another place is a recipe for tragedy. JMHO.

[ddstuder]

“is that a concealed handgun on your right hip?”, to which I replied, yes sir. He then said, “let me see it right now.” I pulled up my shirt and showed him that it was unloaded and had been checked at the door.

I'm wondering why you would reveal that you were carrying a concealed handgun to anyone other than an inquiring LEO. If he isn't in uniform, or displaying a badge and department ID, my reply is always the same: "It's none of your business." It seems to me that this business of acting one way about a lawfully concealed handgun in one place and acting differently in another place is a recipe for tragedy. JMHO.

I agree with Mr. Camp!

Unless I see a badge, it is nobody's business if you are carrying! I have had people who know that I carry ask me if I had a pistol on me, I just smile and ask them to mind their own business!

[G26ster]

Prohibiting lawfully concealed weapons at a gun show really puzzles me. If you walk in the entrance with a concealed handgun (minus mag and ammo), you have to unconceal to get it zip tied. Then you can re-conceal and go in. The place is full of magazines and ammo (same as the one's you left in your car). Makes my head hurt

[Bob in Big D]

“is that a concealed handgun on your right hip?”, to which I replied, yes sir. He then said, “let me see it right now.” I pulled up my shirt and showed him that it was unloaded and had been checked at the door.

I'm wondering why you would reveal that you were carrying a concealed handgun to anyone other than an inquiring LEO. If he isn't in uniform, or displaying a badge and department ID, my reply is always the same: "It's none of your business." It seems to me that this business of acting one way about a lawfully concealed handgun in one place and acting differently in another place is a recipe for tragedy. JMHO.

"its none of your business" may promote and aggressive responce from the person asking, rather you might try "Why would that be any of your business"? (In a level adult voice) I would want to know who this person asking the question is before I revealed wheather I was carrying or not. If he/she insists without saying who they are. I would tell him that we are going to find the closest LEO before you reveal anything. I did not attend the Allen GS but did attend Plano and there were several LEO's at that show.

[esxmarkc]

“is that a concealed handgun on your right hip?”

"No sir! I'm just happy to see ya!

Bet he'd walk away from you as fast as possible.

[NTexas_V-Star]

To the OP:

I was also at the Allen gunshow on Sunday. My boss, a friend of his, and myself all carpooled down there. We are all CHL'd, and all unloaded prior to entry.

I reconcealed up until we walked in, and then tucked my shirt in behind the pistol. The "suit" at the entrance almost had a fit! I had to calmly tell/show him that it was completely unloaded, and I was carrying it to check out holsters. Same with the two guys with me.

After he calmed down, he let us know that there were ATF and local law enforcement all over the place, and we had best be careful.

I chose not to dwell on it, but it sounds like your encounter was a little more stressful and unproffessional than mine.

[Keith B]

To the OP:

I was also at the Allen gunshow on Sunday. My boss, a friend of his, and myself all carpooled down there. We are all CHL'd, and all unloaded prior to entry.

I reconcealed up until we walked in, and then tucked my shirt in behind the pistol. The "suit" at the entrance almost had a fit! I had to calmly tell/show him that it was completely unloaded, and I was carrying it to check out holsters. Same with the two guys with me.

After he calmed down, he let us know that there were ATF and local law enforcement all over the place, and we had best be careful.

I chose not to dwell on it, but it sounds like your encounter was a little more stressful and unproffessional than mine.

LOL, sounds like the event center security guard was a mall cop wanna-be and over zealous on his duties to be concerned about the LEO's or ATF being there. I talked to one of the ATF guys for almost half an hour, and even helped them pack their stuff up for the day on Saturday. One of them is an ex Dallas LEO and really into guns himself. I asked him if he had been around in the show and he said they don't normally 'shop' due to the ATF on the shirt making the vendors nervous and they wanted to present a good presence and let folks know they were not there to confiscate all the guns. I told him to put a piece of duck-tape over the ATF and write 'Gun Nut' on it and then he could go shopping. All three of the agents liked that idea. The one I talked to for quite awhile was more the one that helped folks with admin questions. He was talking to one guy as I came up to the table and advising he go the trust route vs. a CLEO sign-off on an SBR. He even gave the guy his card and said for him to call him and he would help with any questions and paperwork. Really nice folks (yeah yeah, I know, they is da Feds and can't be any good), but that is why they said they are at the show, to try and improve the image that a lot of pro-gun folks have of them.

[flb_78]

“is that a concealed handgun on your right hip?”, to which I replied, yes sir. He then said, “let me see it right now.” I pulled up my shirt and showed him that it was unloaded and had been checked at the door.

I'm wondering why you would reveal that you were carrying a concealed handgun to anyone other than an inquiring LEO. If he isn't in uniform, or displaying a badge and department ID, my reply is always the same: "It's none of your business." It seems to me that this business of acting one way about a lawfully concealed handgun in one place and acting differently in another place is a recipe for tragedy. JMHO.

I agree with Mr. Camp!

Unless I see a badge, it is nobody's business if you are carrying!

[NTexas_V-Star]

To the OP:

I was also at the Allen gunshow on Sunday. My boss, a friend of his, and myself all carpooled down there. We are all CHL'd, and all unloaded prior to entry.

I reconcealed up until we walked in, and then tucked my shirt in behind the pistol. The "suit" at the entrance almost had a fit! I had to calmly tell/show him that it was completely unloaded, and I was carrying it to check out holsters. Same with the two guys with me.

After he calmed down, he let us know that there were ATF and local law enforcement all over the place, and we had best be careful.

I chose not to dwell on it, but it sounds like your encounter was a little more stressful and unproffessional than mine.

LOL, sounds like the event center security guard was a mall cop wanna-be and over zealous on his duties to be concerned about the LEO's or ATF being there. I talked to one of the ATF guys for almost half an hour, and even helped them pack their stuff up for the day on Saturday. One of them is an ex Dallas LEO and really into guns himself. I asked him if he had been around in the show and he said they don't normally 'shop' due to the ATF on the shirt making the vendors nervous and they wanted to present a good presence and let folks know they were not there to confiscate all the guns. I told him to put a piece of duck-tape over the ATF and write 'Gun Nut' on it and then he could go shopping. All three of the agents liked that idea. The one I talked to for quite awhile was more the one that helped folks with admin questions. He was talking to one guy as I came up to the table and advising he go the trust route vs. a CLEO sign-off on an SBR. He even gave the guy his card and said for him to call him and he would help with any questions and paperwork. Really nice folks (yeah yeah, I know, they is da Feds and can't be any good), but that is why they said they are at the show, to try and improve the image that a lot of pro-gun folks have of them.

To be honest then, it seems to me that someone needed to reeducate the staff about the purpose of the ATF's presence. I wasn't in the least bit concerned about the ATF being there. I knew I wasn't breaking any laws or doing anything to attract unwanted attention. The "suit" at the door, who I assume was staff security, sure did act frantic about it.

[Keith B]

I know the promoter for the show and will tell her about the gestapo tactics that were being used by the event center staff. There is no reason for them to be conducting searches. If they have a concern, then a LEO needs to be involved. You can also contact them at the phone or email listed here

[Kythas]

Thank you all for reading my post and providing feedback. I figured there would be three main types of responses. 1) The security guard is not a LEO, has no legal right to ask or demand to see your weapon and you should have replied with “it’s none of your business” or something to that effect in a not so polite tone, 2) The security guard is not a LEO, has no legal right to ask or demand to see your weapon and you should have replied with “a polite response to be disinclined to acquiesce to the request” and 3) your response was the high-road, non confrontational, and the best response given the over zealous, boarder-line threaten manner of the security guard at that moment.

In retrospect under the circumstances, I still believe my behavior was correct and is not in question as is the security guards. Any complaints or discussions with the Management of the AEC will focus on the guard’s behavior, not mine. I’ve since found out that the security guard in question is the Head of Security for AEC.

I should have mentioned that when the manager came down to speak with me, a show promoter also came down, an African American gentleman. He was very polite and he and I spoke after the AEC manager left. He told me that was ACE ‘s first show I believe and they were very paranoid about vendor/customer behavior. He also told me that I would be his guest at their next show. AEC should have spent more time training their folks and given more consideration to their own behavior.

I left a voice mail for the AEC General Manager but still have not heard back from him. I guess their strategy is just not to respond and everything will just go away. I’m not sure how far I should or even can take this with any real benefit; policy and behavior change during Guns shows at the AEC.

This was the first ever gun show in Allen. Their security is not used to it and I'll be some of them aren't familiar with guns and are very nervous around them. I'll bet as there are more shows there and no issues occur the hopolophobic people will realize there's nothing to be afraid of.

At least, that's my hope.