Question from a new CHLer

[TTU Bass Angler]

Hey guys I'm new to carrying so maybe it might sound dumb but...

Is it a bad idea to have regular rounds for the first two bullets in the magazine and then after that loaded with hollow points? I was just thinking that if two regular bullets hit their mark and the guy still won't stop then there's a need for hollow points. Do I really need a full magazine with hollow points?

[GeekwithaGun]

If given no other choice, I would want the threat to be stopped immediately, therefore I carry 17+1 +17 HP rounds at all times.

[Thomas]

I am kinda new to CHL as well, but I only use hollow points because I don't want a full metal jacket round to go through the bad guy, a wall if I miss, or anything else and then hit an innocent bystander. A hollow point is designed to stop right after impact. While that does mean more of a momentum transfer to the bad guy making it a better at stopping bad guys, it is also makes it safer to anyone else that is not the intended target.

I recently spoke to someone who said his instructor says he alternates between full metal jacket and hollow point rounds so he can "alert" the bad guy (this reason is extreme hearsay at this point), and that he just remembers which one is going to be fired next (as if someone in a high stress situation is going to be able to pay attention to that).

I don't understand how a full metal jacket can be better than a hollow point for self defense, unless you are up against a mass of zombies and you want rounds to go through things.

Buying a magazine's worth of hollow points, in my opinion, is a worthwhile investment in case you ever need to use them.

[TxKimberMan]

If any situation progresses to the point that I need to defend myself or my family with a weapon, I want EVERY round to count. Hollow points and only hollow points in my EDC.

[boomstick]

Less chances of a through and through bullet and collateral damage

[RPB]

Hey guys I'm new to carrying so maybe it might sound dumb but... No question is dumb

Is it a bad idea to have regular rounds for the first two bullets ( That's a very bad idea) in the magazine and then after that loaded with hollow points? I was just thinking that if two regular bullets hit their mark and the guy still won't stop then there's a need for hollow points. Do I really need a full magazine with hollow points? yes

You really don't want to accidentally kill some innocent person, remove the round nose bullets and only carry hollowpoints to reduce the risk of overpenetration.
The TV show "Chase" about Texas Rangers or Federal Marshals in Houston had an episode where a guy shot another at close range inside a van, 9mm bullet went through the guy, through the metal van door, into a lady's husband in the park, killing both.

I only use hollow points because I don't want a full metal jacket round to go through the bad guy,... and then hit an innocent bystander.

If any situation progresses to the point that I need to defend myself or my family with a weapon, I want EVERY round to count. Hollow points and only hollow points in my EDC.

and with anyone else that says only hoollowpoints, for essentially the two above reasons ... I agree.

(The only time I'd consider a non-HP round might be in .25acp (way underpowered round imho) otherwise, round nosed bullets are for paper targets only, hollowpoints keep others safer since they are less likely to overpenetrate.... but if you carry a .25acp ... please sell it and and buy a gun)

[Excaliber]

Hey guys I'm new to carrying so maybe it might sound dumb but...

Is it a bad idea to have regular rounds for the first two bullets in the magazine and then after that loaded with hollow points? I was just thinking that if two regular bullets hit their mark and the guy still won't stop then there's a need for hollow points. Do I really need a full magazine with hollow points?

It's not a dumb question at all, and one that many folks have.

This is the "let's just try to hurt him a little bit first" line of thinking. I understand that it comes from a good person's commendable reluctance to hurt anyone. It's usually heard from very well intentioned and gentle folks who have come to realize that they are responsible for their own and their family's protection, but have been fortunate enough never to have dealt with asocial violence up close and personal enough to know just how vicious and unforgiving it is. This is not a criticism of any kind. Without the emotional reference point of seeing violence and its results closely enough to hear, see, and smell its effects, it's very difficult to understand how blindingly quick, brutal and unforgiving it truly is. The "don't hurt him too much at first" concept is usually a transitional thought position between "I'd never hurt anyone" and "I'll do what I know I need to to protect myself and my family."

Staying alive by using deadly force during a life threatening attack very often requires hurting someone to the point where he doesn't have a choice about stopping from hurting you. It's ugly, violent, and often over in a couple of seconds. Anyone who plans to carry a lethal weapon for defense should come to grips with those realities before taking on the responsibility of carrying it in public.

With that being said, here's a bit of perspective on handgun ammunition:

If you don't absolutely need to stop an attacker from doing what he's trying to do right now, you have no business shooting him at all.

If you do absolutely need to stop him right now, you've got a serious problem because, despite the fictitious effects seen in the movies, handguns are far from reliable in that department. It often takes multiple well placed rounds to stop a serious threat. Using bullets that create the widest wound channel possible and deliver all of their energy into the target body gives you the best chance of success in an uncertain business. Hollowpoints are the best generally available ammunition type for this purpose at this moment in time, but if you have to use them, understand that you should be prepared to continue firing continuously until the threat is ended. This may take a full magazine or more.

With that as background, there is no logical reason I can think of to sharply diminish the chances that your first couple of shots will result in disabling injury to your adversary. That first or second shot may very well be all you get.

[WildBill]

If you don't absolutely need to stop an attacker from doing what he's trying to do right now, you have no business shooting him at all.

Sage advice.

This reminds me of a question that was asked during a class that I attended.

Student: How many shots do you shoot [at the BG]?

Instructor: You keep shooting until he stops doing the thing that you caused you to start shooting.

[TTU Bass Angler]

I guess I should've asked more questions during the course. Thanks for the responses. It totally changed my mind about it. I shoot a 9mm and I did buy a box of Hornady hollow points but I haven't put them into any of my magazines for that reason. I definitely will now. This gives me a different perspective on the whole situation. Thanks for the help!

[WildBill]

I guess I should've asked more questions during the course.

The primary purpose of the CHL course is designed to teach the law so it is not surprising that this topic did not come up. That is one reason the forum exists. Stick around - there is a lot more that we can learn.

[RoyGBiv]

I guess I should've asked more questions during the course. Thanks for the responses. It totally changed my mind about it. I shoot a 9mm and I did buy a box of Hornady hollow points but I haven't put them into any of my magazines for that reason. I definitely will now. This gives me a different perspective on the whole situation. Thanks for the help!

You need to shoot a few magazines of the specific HP's you plan to carry to make certain they feed reliably in your specific gun. Yes, it makes for an expensive trip to the range but I would never rely on a round that's not proven itself in MY gun.

[Pawpaw]

I guess I should've asked more questions during the course. Thanks for the responses. It totally changed my mind about it. I shoot a 9mm and I did buy a box of Hornady hollow points but I haven't put them into any of my magazines for that reason. I definitely will now. This gives me a different perspective on the whole situation. Thanks for the help!

You might want to re-think that one a bit. It is very wise to make sure your weapon performs reliably with your chosen self-defense ammo. During a deadly encounter is not the time to find out your gun jams with that ammo.

Personally, I run at least 100 trouble-free rounds of SD ammo before I use it for carry. I understand that some might not be able to test that many rounds, but you need to test to the best of your ability.

Cutting corners is false economy, especially if it costs you your life.

Edit: RoyGBiv beat me to it!

[WildBill]

Cutting corners is false economy, especially if it costs you your life.

Very false economy.

[RPB]

If you got the Hornady Critical Defense 9mm, they PROBABLY will cycle ok, but you better test them because probably isn't good enough when a lot is at stake.
Agreed they aren't cheap, but what's at stake is priceless.

[nyj]

I carry 8 rubber tipped bullets with my last round being a JHP. I want to give the bad guy a chance to repent.




/sarcasm