Utah or Texas ? Or.....Both ?

[03Lightningrocks]

How Ironic. So the State of texas suspends your CHL and you fellers are saying you can say BAH!!!! I will just carry concealed under my Utah license? LOL.... so if this were the case, why would the State bother to suspend your license in the first place.....meaning.... what would be the purpose in it? If the State says your license is suspended, for what ever reason, are they not telling you that they don't want you carrying concealed?

Keith is right in that the odds of getting caught are small, but that is really not the point here. TAM is right in that I carry concealed under the belief that concealed is concealed. but i sure as heck am not going to recommend this coarse of action to others as if it is somehow protected or a good idea. TAM.... since we are discussing past posts and I will freely admit to carrying at all times while out. Are you not the guy who recomends erring on the safe side. Now your saying if you get your right to carry concealed revoked by Texas, you are going to carry in Texas anyway.... and then try to use the ole Utah permit as your out? Interesting set of values, to say the least. Maybe misread your post.

Try this one.... why would the State of Texas revoke or suspend your CHL other than for the purpose of forbidding you the right to carry concealed in Texas?

Do the laws not say we have to follow the laws of the State we are in for non-resident carry?

So how does having an out of state permit negate your being forbidden to carry concealed in the State of texas?

yep.....getting caught would be unlikely. But if you ended up in a second self defense shooting while under suspension, and then whipped out the Utah permit as an "in your face", i would hate to see the legal bills for that one.

I believe anyone reading this thread that has a situation develop of this nature should seek the advice of their trusted attorney....

[sjfcontrol]

03 -- show me the Texas law that says that out-of-state licenses are rendered invalid when your Texas CHL is suspended.

The advice to discuss with your lawyer is good -- and exactly what TAM said he would do.

And again, having your license suspended does NOT mean Texas has said you can't carry. It does not invalidate MPA.

[The Annoyed Man]

How Ironic. So the State of texas suspends your CHL and you fellers are saying you can say BAH!!!! I will just carry concealed under my Utah license? LOL.... so if this were the case, why would the State bother to suspend your license in the first place.....meaning.... what would be the purpose in it? If the State says your license is suspended, for what ever reason, are they not telling you that they don't want you carrying concealed?

Keith is right in that the odds of getting caught are small, but that is really not the point here. TAM is right in that I carry concealed under the belief that concealed is concealed. but i sure as heck am not going to recommend this coarse of action to others as if it is somehow protected or a good idea. TAM.... since we are discussing past posts and I will freely admit to carrying at all times while out. Are you not the guy who recomends erring on the safe side. Now your saying if you get your right to carry concealed revoked by Texas, you are going to carry in Texas anyway.... and then try to use the ole Utah permit as your out? Interesting set of values, to say the least. Maybe misread your post.

Try this one.... why would the State of Texas revoke or suspend your CHL other than for the purpose of forbidding you the right to carry concealed in Texas?

Do the laws not say we have to follow the laws of the State we are in for non-resident carry?

So how does having an out of state permit negate your being forbidden to carry concealed in the State of texas?

yep.....getting caught would be unlikely. But if you ended up in a second self defense shooting while under suspension, and then whipped out the Utah permit as an "in your face", i would hate to see the legal bills for that one.

I believe anyone reading this thread that has a situation develop of this nature should seek the advice of their trusted attorney....

Hey, you know what? I actually agree that the judge may not take kindly to it. But try this one on for size.... I don't care. Why? Because if I am actually involved in a second legitimate self-defense shooting while my CHL is under suspension, then I needed that gun, didn't I? And I'm not some kind of Palladin. I avoid trouble at all costs. But sometimes, trouble finds you. And in that event, I would rather be prepared than dead.

If I shoot some gansta crip (or aryan nation, or mexican mafia, or what have you) in self-defense, my CHL is suspended, and his homies come hunting for me and find me, and I am suddenly now in dire need of a gun and don't have one, then I'm going to be dead. I would rather be alive and judged by 12 than dead and carried by six, regardless of what the law says. Wouldn't you? At that point, my need to survive trumps whether or not a judge might be irritated with me.

Now, I submit that said judge is going to not take it lightly the second time around - regardless of whether or not I have a CFP from Utah. However, I believe that an attempt to mount a legal defense by claiming authority to carry under my CFP is a better defense than no defense at all. But also, as I am now repeating for the 3rd time or so in this thread, I would follow the advice of my lawyer at that time. Why, because just as IANAL, YANAL either. And more importantly, YANML.

[Crossfire]

Well, let's look at this another way. Say, you are a Utah resident. You have a Utah CFP and you happen to be visiting family here in Texas for awhile. Or, maybe your job transferred you here, and you intend yo keep your Utah permit since it is legal for you to carry here with a Utah permit. While here, you get into the worst possible situation, and are forced to defend your life with your legally carried handgun.

So the local PD, while assuring you that your situation certainly looks like a legally justified shoot, still confiscates your firearm and your Utah permit. Proper procedure is for them to notify the Utah BCI and send the permit to them, so they do.

Utah BCI then reviews your case, finds that you have been arrested but NOT convicted of a crime, and MAILS your license back to you. So, are you going to just put it away? Cause, you know the state of Texas took it from you, so that means they certainly don't want you to have it. Or are you going to take it down to the local PD and give it back to them?

[sjfcontrol]

YANML --Good one TAM!

[Cobra Medic]

Try this one.... why would the State of Texas revoke or suspend your CHL other than for the purpose of forbidding you the right to carry concealed in Texas?

Are you saying someone whose license is suspended because they didn't change their address can't carry under MPA?

What if someone's CHL expires? Are they prohibited from carrying under MPA? For the rest of their life?

What if a cop with a CHL has their CHL suspended, or it expires? Can they no longer carry a gun?

[03Lightningrocks]

03 -- show me the Texas law that says that out-of-state licenses are rendered invalid when your Texas CHL is suspended.

The advice to discuss with your lawyer is good -- and exactly what TAM said he would do.

And again, having your license suspended does NOT mean Texas has said you can't carry. It does not invalidate MPA.

Show me where in the law it says they aren't. You apparently miss the point....as so many seem to want to do on this forum.

If the intent of the State is to forbid you the right to carry concealed, which is JUST WHAT THEY ARE OING WHEN REVOKING YOUR PERMIT!.... carrying concealed under some other States permit may just land you in some hot water. Your in Texas.... not Utah. the laws plaimly state that when under reciprical carry, one must follow the laws of the state they are in. If Texas law says you can't carry in Texas, I read that to mean just what it says and until you show me the statuet that says Utah permits circumvent texas law.... i will continue to believe this.

[03Lightningrocks]

If Utah sends it back you are no longer under suspension. Good night nurse!!!!! We are talking about while your texas permit is under suspension...not up for renewal.

[Crossfire]

If Texas law says you can't carry in Texas, I read that to mean just what it says and until you show me the statuet that says Utah permits circumvent texas law.... i will continue to believe this.

You go with that thought, Lightning. In the meantime, I'm going with mine.

So, are we done here yet? 150 some odd posts in this thread. Really, is there anything new to discuss here?

[Cobra Medic]

carrying concealed under some other States permit may just land you in some hot water. Your in Texas.... not Utah. the laws plaimly state that when under reciprical carry, one must follow the laws of the state they are in. If Texas law says you can't carry in Texas, I read that to mean just what it says and until you show me the statuet that says Utah permits circumvent texas law.... i will continue to believe this.

They have reciprocity. http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/administra ... eement.pdf

They don't circumvent Texas law any more than an FBI agent circumvents Texas law if he carries without a CHL.

[03Lightningrocks]

If Texas law says you can't carry in Texas, I read that to mean just what it says and until you show me the statuet that says Utah permits circumvent texas law.... i will continue to believe this.

You go with that thought, Lightning. In the meantime, I'm going with mine.

So, are we done here yet? 150 some odd posts in this thread. Really, is there anything new to discuss here?

So your recommendation as a profesional trainer is that if texas revokes or suspends my CHL for some legal reason, I should continue to carry under my Utah permit? Just wanted that quote in writing.

[sjfcontrol]

Give me a break. Laws tell you what you CAN'T do. Not what you can! show me the law that says you can eat pizza! it ain't there. So you are now legally prevented from ever eating pizza again in this state until they pass a law allowing it,

If you can't point out the law that invalidates the Utah license when the texas CHL is suspended, then it's legal. End of discussion.

[Cobra Medic]

You go with that thought, Lightning. In the meantime, I'm going with mine.

So, are we done here yet? 150 some odd posts in this thread. Really, is there anything new to discuss here?

So your recommendation as a profesional trainer is that if texas revokes or suspends my CHL for some legal reason, I should continue to carry under my Utah permit? Just wanted that quote in writing.

Maybe you missed it. Her recommendation to you was to follow your own advice.

[03Lightningrocks]

Give me a break. Laws tell you what you CAN'T do. Not what you can! show me the law that says you can eat pizza! it ain't there. So you are now legally prevented from ever eating pizza again in this state until they pass a law allowing it,

If you can't point out the law that invalidates the Utah license when the texas CHL is suspended, then it's legal. End of discussion.

No...Crossfires answer to my direct question will be end of discussion. Of course we could all wonder why it took 150 posts to get there, but if her answer is yse.... carry under Utah if texas suspends your license, I will have to give in to her greater knowledge on the topic.

[Cobra Medic]

How did we fit 150 posts on 4 pages?