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Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:14 am
by Islands7
This topic is not looking for opinions, as plenty of these can be found elsewhere on this site.
CHL we know requires one to secure their weapons when unattended.
The scenario here is - one drives their convertible "rag top" into the parking lot of church/school/post office/etc. and must secure their weapon in this car when entering such buildings.
The most obvious compliance would be one of those lockboxes that steel cable to one of the car's fixed metal pieces - but is this purchase really necessary, as per the law?
These other solutions need to be addressed by those closer to the law or have real-life experiences (again, no opinions please!).
These "solutions" assume locked doors, top up & locked in place, trunk locked AND that "concealed" does not equal "secured":
1. Inside locked glove box
2. Inside unlocked or unlockable glove box
3. Concealed inside other unlockable compartments, e.g. center console, door map pocket (covered by towel/rag), "hidden compartment",Inside running board concealed under seat, etc.
4. Inside trunk
5. Inside lockable tool box that resides on & is secured (by concealed bolts) to running board (older cars)
6. Inside locked luggage secured to outside luggage rack; further how secure does the luggage have to be to be compliant; or does the weapon have to be inside a lockbox inside the luggage if not secured legally?
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:18 am
by AEA
Welcome to the Forum.
I will keep my opinion to myself.
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:22 am
by longtooth
Welcome
First time for this one I think.
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:23 am
by seamusTX
Wow. All I have are opinions.
- Jim
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:27 am
by Teamless
So what is the question here? Law - and not opinions of what the law means? I guess one would have to read the Penal Code, without interpreting it, but fully just understanding the meaning.
Hmm, since I have only opinions, I guess I cannot help here either
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:29 am
by Purplehood
Why would a ragtop be any different than any other car? Put the top up. I do.
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:29 am
by The Annoyed Man
Islands7 wrote:This topic is not looking for opinions, as plenty of these can be found elsewhere on this site.
CHL we know requires one to secure their weapons when unattended.
The scenario here is - one drives their convertible "rag top" into the parking lot of church/school/post office/etc. and must secure their weapon in this car when entering such buildings.
The most obvious compliance would be one of those lockboxes that steel cable to one of the car's fixed metal pieces - but is this purchase really necessary, as per the law?
These other solutions need to be addressed by those closer to the law or have real-life experiences (again, no opinions please!).
These "solutions" assume locked doors, top up & locked in place, trunk locked AND that "concealed" does not equal "secured":
1. Inside locked glove box
2. Inside unlocked or unlockable glove box
3. Concealed inside other unlockable compartments, e.g. center console, door map pocket (covered by towel/rag), "hidden compartment",Inside running board concealed under seat, etc.
4. Inside trunk
5. Inside lockable tool box that resides on & is secured (by concealed bolts) to running board (older cars)
6. Inside locked luggage secured to outside luggage rack; further how secure does the luggage have to be to be compliant; or does the weapon have to be inside a lockbox inside the luggage if not secured legally?
Welcome to the board... Wow. First post... Blue in 150% font size in case we can't read it otherwise.... and on a
discussion board where people discuss their
opinions, we are invited by a member who has never posted before to
not participate...
Since I'm not even sure what the purpose of the thread is in the first place, and since I've been disinvited to comment, I'm done with
this thread...
Good luck in your future endeavors.
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:38 am
by Keith B
First off, welcome to the forum.
However, you will NEVER get an answer to your question, even legally, because all that can EVER be issued are opinions when there is no case law to back up the statute. Until a Judge has issued an opinion on the interpretation of the law, then it is just speculation and others opinions. Even after a test case has happened, there will still be opinions on the issue.
So, bottom line, there is no answer to your question from a legal standpoint because there has not been case law to set a precedence.
Now, whether you want it or not, my opinion is you should do the best job you can of securing your weapon. In the case of the convertible, that would mean locking it in a steel box mounted to the floor or under the seat, or putting it in the locked trunk.
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:38 am
by SQLGeek
Hey, even an attorney is only going to give you his opinion.
Welcome to the forum...
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:48 am
by The Annoyed Man
I spotted a fallacy, and then I'm done...
CHL we know requires one to secure their weapons when unattended.
I just searched through the law as downloaded from the DPS website. The word "secure" occurs on 7 pages. None of the references are to a CHL holder being required to secure his/her weapon when unattended. So that is just not true.
Now, it would
foolish not to do so using a lockbox, but so far as I can tell, hiding your gun under the seat and locking your car would qualify as "secured" for legal purposes.
I smell sulfur in the air... Are there any trolls hiding under bridges nearby?
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 10:07 am
by Keith B
And, BTW on your off-limits locaitons, you are not required to leave your CCW behind when going into a church unless it is 30.06 posted or you have recevied oral notification to not carry there.
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 10:14 am
by seamusTX
The Annoyed Man wrote:I smell sulfur in the air... Are there any trolls hiding under bridges nearby?
Now don't play the troll card until he asks three questions before you can cross the bridge.
Oh, wait.
To the OP: No hard feelings, I hope. You've had your baptism by fire.
- Jim
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 10:29 am
by The Annoyed Man
seamusTX wrote:The Annoyed Man wrote:I smell sulfur in the air... Are there any trolls hiding under bridges nearby?
Now don't play the troll card until he asks three questions before you can cross the bridge.
Oh, wait.
To the OP: No hard feelings. You're had your baptism by fire.
- Jim
Is the bridge posted 30.06?
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 10:30 am
by Keith B
OK folks, back on topic.
Re: Secure compliance vs. Convertible Automobile
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 10:56 am
by Fawkes
Crud, all I brought with me today was my CCW and a pocket full of opinions. Eh, what're ya gonna do?