Looking for interpetation

[easyridertejas]

I hope i am in the right section to ask this sort of question. I am looking for opinions on the meaning of PC 46.03 a and PC 46.03 1.

PC §46.03. PLACES WEAPONS PROHIBITED. (a) A person commits
an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly possesses or goes with a firearm, illegal knife, club, or prohibited weapon


And


(1) on the physical premises of a school or educational institution,
any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or
educational institution is being conducted, or a passenger transportation
vehicle of a school or educational institution, whether the school or
educational institution is public or private, unless pursuant to written
regulations or written authorization of the institution;

I am interesed in how the castle doctrine impacts my ablilty to carry in my car if i work On the premisies of an educational Institution. Thanks for any and all opinons.

[ScottDLS]

I hope i am in the right section to ask this sort of question. I am looking for opinions on the meaning of PC 46.03 a and PC 46.03 1.

PC §46.03. PLACES WEAPONS PROHIBITED. (a) A person commits
an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly possesses or goes with a firearm, illegal knife, club, or prohibited weapon


And


(1) on the physical premises of a school or educational institution,
any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or
educational institution is being conducted, or a passenger transportation
vehicle of a school or educational institution, whether the school or
educational institution is public or private, unless pursuant to written
regulations or written authorization of the institution;

I am interesed in how the castle doctrine impacts my ablilty to carry in my car if i work On the premisies of an educational Institution. Thanks for any and all opinons.

Short answer is you can carry in your car based on the "Motorist Protection Act", not "Castle Doctrine" (which relates to the duty to retreat and civil liability for shooting an intruder in your home). The reason is because premises in 46.03 does not include the parking lot, grounds, etc. Note if a school sponsored activity is taking place in the parking lot or grounds, then you can't carry in your car or on your person there. Also if you carry outside your car, you need to have a CHL.

There is also a federal law that prohibits you from carrying within 1000' of a school unless you have a Texas CHL, but I'm answering based on the Texas law. Relevant Penal Code cited below.



...
(1) on the physical premises of a school or educational institution,
any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or
educational institution is being conducted,
...
(1) "Premises" has the meaning assigned by Section 46.035.
...
46.035
...
under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code.
(3) "Premises" means a building or a portion of a building. The term does not include any public or private driveway, street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area.

[WildBill]

I hope i am in the right section to ask this sort of question. I am looking for opinions on the meaning of PC 46.03 a and PC 46.03 1.

PC §46.03. PLACES WEAPONS PROHIBITED. (a) A person commits
an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly possesses or goes with a firearm, illegal knife, club, or prohibited weapon


And


(1) on the physical premises of a school or educational institution,
any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or
educational institution is being conducted, or a passenger transportation
vehicle of a school or educational institution, whether the school or
educational institution is public or private, unless pursuant to written
regulations or written authorization of the institution;

I am interesed in how the castle doctrine impacts my ablilty to carry in my car if i work On the premisies of an educational Institution. Thanks for any and all opinons.

Welcome to the forum easyridetejas! This is the place to get information. IANAL, but the motorist protection act allows you to carry a concealed handgun in your car. The definition of school premises referred to in PC §46.03 includes only school buildings, not parking lots. So you should be good to go.

It looks like ScottDSL beat me to the punch.

[Keith B]

I hope i am in the right section to ask this sort of question. I am looking for opinions on the meaning of PC 46.03 a and PC 46.03 1.

PC §46.03. PLACES WEAPONS PROHIBITED. (a) A person commits
an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly possesses or goes with a firearm, illegal knife, club, or prohibited weapon


And


(1) on the physical premises of a school or educational institution,
any grounds or building on which an activity sponsored by a school or
educational institution is being conducted, or a passenger transportation
vehicle of a school or educational institution, whether the school or
educational institution is public or private, unless pursuant to written
regulations or written authorization of the institution;

I am interesed in how the castle doctrine impacts my ablilty to carry in my car if i work On the premisies of an educational Institution. Thanks for any and all opinons.

First off, welcome to the forum.

The Castle Doctrine has nothing to do with you carrying in your car, that is the Motorist Protection Act. Many people get them mixed up as they both came into play at the same time.

As for carrying in your car with no CHL on a school premise, the law that prohibits that is the Federal Gun Free School Zone Act. Also, your employer can fire you if it is a violation of the school policy. The MPA says you can carry in your car wherever it is legal, but the GFSZA says it is illegal, so you officially would be breaking the law even if your school system allowed it.

Now, the best way is to get your CHL, which allows you to carry on school premise (not in buildings or at school sponsored functions.) However, your employer can still fire you for having a gun on their property if they so deem to.

Hope that helps clear it up.

EDIT TO ADD: Scott beat me also, but some other links in mine.

[glbedd53]

I work for a school district and I was told by my CHL instructor the same thing. He said they could fire you but they can't prosecute you. What I did, and I don't know if it's good enough, is I looked up the district policies, ours is online. In this district the school policy is copied word for word like the state law.

[SwimFan85]

I am interesed in how the castle doctrine impacts my ablilty to carry in my car if i work On the premisies of an educational Institution. Thanks for any and all opinons.

The castle doctrine has no effect on where people can or can't carry guns in Texas. Pro or con

[driver8]

Sounds like another way you could get wrongly "cuffed and stuffed". In fact I think I remember reading on this forum a while back about someone it happened to. He just pulled over in a school parking lot to talk to a friend, wasn't even during school hours.

[easyridertejas]

Thanks for all the help. Since i do have a CHL i intend to continue to carry in my car. It's not so much that i would like to carry at work as much as getting to and from work. I dont know if any of you have noticed, but it's getting a bit chippy out there on the roads these days.
I found all these answers helpful and informative. Enough to ask another question:

I read the carry laws to say that i can carry an illegal Knife or club in my car along with a handgun. Now i dont have a sword in my car, but i do like to carry an asp. I read the law to say that i'm ok with it in my car, but when i exit the vehicle with it, i'm commiting a violation. Other than to and form the car. Any comments on my interpretation?

[WildBill]

I read the carry laws to say that i can carry an illegal Knife or club in my car along with a handgun. Now i dont have a sword in my car, but i do like to carry an asp. I read the law to say that i'm ok with it in my car, but when i exit the vehicle with it, i'm commiting a violation. Other than to and form the car. Any comments on my interpretation?

I do not know what law you are trying to interpret, but ... Definitely not! Read the front of your CHL. It is a Concealed Handgun License. It is not a concealed weapon permit. Nothing in the statues allows you to legally carry anything other than a handgun. INAL, etc.

[RPB]

Thanks for all the help. Since i do have a CHL i intend to continue to carry in my car. It's not so much that i would like to carry at work as much as getting to and from work. I dont know if any of you have noticed, but it's getting a bit chippy out there on the roads these days.
I found all these answers helpful and informative. Enough to ask another question:

I read the carry laws to say that i can carry an illegal Knife or club in my car along with a handgun. Now i dont have a sword in my car, but i do like to carry an asp. I read the law to say that i'm ok with it in my car, but when i exit the vehicle with it, i'm commiting a violation. Other than to and form the car. Any comments on my interpretation?

First point .... you said "to and from" I do not see any "from" provision. Taken literally, there is only an "enroute TO" a motor vehicle allowance. I suppose if you took it from your house TO a car, and you owned more than one car/truck etc, you could take it TO your other motor vehicle, and then TO the first vehicle again, then TO the second vehicle .... don't get arrested trying to take it back TO the house though unless you are on your own premises or premises under the person's control .... so taking into a motel room from a motel parking lot ....... might be a Don't park in front of a neighbor's house; don't park in the street in FRONT of your property.

Sec. 46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun, illegal knife, or club if the person is not:
(1) on the person's own premises or premises under the person's control; or
(2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control.

If you want a club in your car, just carry a 6 D-cell Maglight flashlight, not a "club"

Forgive my ignorance .... an "asp?"



I'm guessing you are reading :
http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/S ... /PE.46.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Sec. 46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun, illegal knife, or club if the person is not:
(1) on the person's own premises or premises under the person's control; or
(2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control.

and
Sec. 46.01. DEFINITIONS. In this chapter:

(1) "Club" means an instrument that is specially designed, made, or adapted for the purpose of inflicting serious bodily injury or death by striking a person with the instrument, and includes but is not limited to the following:
(A) blackjack;
(B) nightstick;
(C) mace;
(D) tomahawk.

(6) "Illegal knife" means a:
(A) knife with a blade over five and one-half inches;
(B) hand instrument designed to cut or stab another by being thrown;
(C) dagger, including but not limited to a dirk, stiletto, and poniard;
(D) bowie knife;
(E) sword; or
(F) spear.

Note that switchblades are not included in the definition of "illegal knife" (I do not know what an asp is)

[Excaliber]

Forgive my ignorance .... an "asp?"

Asp is the brand name of a high quality expandable tactical baton.

[RPB]

ahhhh ok, Yeah I saw those before, I just didn't connect them with a brand.
Maglights serve me well in all sizes.
6 D cell in the car, kubaton sized 2 or 3 cell AA/AAA one on my belt (so I can see where the key goes in the door at night)
I went to Maglights in the 1970s after Dallas Police Dept decided they wanted to keep my nunchucks a freind I had loaned them to had under his carseat.

I also carry a 3 foot long keyCHAIN which I know how to use well .... I mean ummm ... having my keys spread out along the chain makes it easier to locate the proper one, rather than them being all bunched together ..... so I can use it better. Also, the keys and chain are very heavy on purpose for the reason that I'd notice if start to go off without them or if I drop them I'll hear it ...
It would be illegal to walk to or from a store with clubs etc, but I NEED my keys to get back in the car later, and my mini maglights to see the keyhole.

See if you can see which key I need ... " onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Close quarters example (but not the best techniques in these examples) " onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Close quarters, I'd go to my mini maglight and Aikido type techniques .... I need my keys to drive home But no one gets close when my keys are a-swinging

[gabe]

Asps. Very dangerous. You go first.

Forgive my ignorance .... an "asp?"

http://www.asp-usa.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[srothstein]

I read the carry laws to say that i can carry an illegal Knife or club in my car along with a handgun. Now i dont have a sword in my car, but i do like to carry an asp. I read the law to say that i'm ok with it in my car, but when i exit the vehicle with it, i'm commiting a violation. Other than to and form the car. Any comments on my interpretation?

I do not know what law you are trying to interpret, but ... Definitely not! Read the front of your CHL. It is a Concealed Handgun License. It is not a concealed weapon permit. Nothing in the statues allows you to legally carry anything other than a handgun. INAL, etc.

Wildbill, I have to disagree. No matter what the license says on it, the law clearly states that 46.02 does not apply if you are carrying a CHL and a pistol of the type permitted. I can only take that to mean that I may carry a club or knife with my pistol. In a way, this makes some sense. why would i worry about your carrying a lower level of weapon if you are carrying a firearm? I also know that this may not be the intended interpretation of the law, but intent only comes up when the law itself is not clear.

now, if someone were asking about carrying the club or knife when they did not have the pistol with them also, I would agree with you. That is clearly forbidden.

[RPB]

I read the carry laws to say that i can carry an illegal Knife or club in my car along with a handgun. Now i dont have a sword in my car, but i do like to carry an asp. I read the law to say that i'm ok with it in my car, but when i exit the vehicle with it, i'm commiting a violation. Other than to and form the car. Any comments on my interpretation?

I do not know what law you are trying to interpret, but ... Definitely not! Read the front of your CHL. It is a Concealed Handgun License. It is not a concealed weapon permit. Nothing in the statues allows you to legally carry anything other than a handgun. INAL, etc.

Wildbill, I have to disagree. No matter what the license says on it, the law clearly states that 46.02 does not apply if you are carrying a CHL and a pistol of the type permitted. I can only take that to mean that I may carry a club or knife with my pistol. In a way, this makes some sense. why would i worry about your carrying a lower level of weapon if you are carrying a firearm? I also know that this may not be the intended interpretation of the law, but intent only comes up when the law itself is not clear.

now, if someone were asking about carrying the club or knife when they did not have the pistol with them also, I would agree with you. That is clearly forbidden.

I've wondered about that too... I think you are required to carry BOTH your pistol (of the proper catagory SA/NSA) and HANDGUN license if you want to legally carry an "illegal knife" .... just sounds strange lol ... but that's my layman's impression. It does say 46.02 doesn't apply to licensees in 46.15.

Still, I see no reason to carry any illegal knife, club or otherwise. I have my pistol, my backup gun, maybe another backup or two, a keyCHAIN and my maglight flashlights, a folding knife on my belt for peeling oranges, a "small" 10% pepper spray in case I want spicy oranges, a couple metal ballpoint pens, a few other legal pocket items ..... who needs weapons that will trigger an alarm in a LEO's mind?