Finally, a CHLer is portrayed as the victim

[Purplehood]

I have to agree. Good judgement, bad judgement aside, there is absolutely no valid reason for a bad-guy to do bad things to those women...whatever time of day or night.

Again, no argument out of me, and I never said there was.

TAM, I think ultimately you and I agree. After all, lack of situational awareness and putting yourself in a potentially bad-situation provide opportunity for the bad guy that may not have existed in the first place.

[bdickens]

It would be nice if everybody had the same luxuries that most of us do about when and where they have to be.

[Liberty]

It would be nice if everybody had the same luxuries that most of us do about when and where they have to be.

Many of us in this forum, take real life situations as an opportunity to learn.

We can take from these examples and put our love ones and our selves in the same situation and try figure out what will keep them and us alive. We can not make judgments on those actually involved because we don't know all the facts, nor the people involved. True, we don't know that the girls weren't nurses working the late shift on a Holiday and had to stop for food at 2:30am on the way home because their refrigerator wasn't working. The AC in their mustang might not have working and the windows were broke and wouldn't go down on their Mustang. Somehow I get the feeling though that if they had followed a forum such as this, that discussed situational awareness. This whole thing might have been avoided.
Every cloud does have a silver lining, I know I am reminded once again about the importance of situational awareness, even though I'm not a prime target for sexual assault. One thing we can be clear on though, is that the girls should be commended for clear thinking after the fact.

I for one have been on the road and hungry because of an emergency, and have stopped for fast food, I keep all windows up except to speak to Jack, and to pay and get my food, I also keep one hand on the grip of my sidearm while going through the drive through. To bad the girls didn't do the same. Its not that I'm superior to those those I'm just better educated in part because of this forum reading how these scenarios breakdown.

[bdickens]

What I see is a whole lot of sanctimonious armchair quarterbacking, including implied smears against the character of the two young ladies in the linked Chronicle article who were the victims of a horrible ordeal.

[bayouhazard]

I agree. We have come a long way from the original post where the guy with a CHL was identified as the victim, rather than the typical news story recasting the criminal as the victim.

[Oldgringo]

What I see is a whole lot of sanctimonious armchair quarterbacking, including implied smears against the character of the two young ladies in the linked Chronicle article who were the victims of a horrible ordeal.

What you either failed, or chose not, to see was TAM's most eloquent and to the point commentary of Thu Jul 08, 2010 1:02 pm on this most unfortunate incident . After you have read TAM's post, please come back and elaborate on the "sanctimonious armchair quarterbacking" that bothers you so greatly.

[bdickens]

What I see is a whole lot of sanctimonious armchair quarterbacking, including implied smears against the character of the two young ladies in the linked Chronicle article who were the victims of a horrible ordeal.

What you either failed, or chose not, to see was TAM's most eloquent and to the point commentary of Thu Jul 08, 2010 1:02 pm on this most unfortunate incident . After you have read TAM's post, please come back and elaborate on the "sanctimonious armchair quarterbacking" that bothers you so greatly.

I did, but my favorite moderator deleted my post because I was engaging in "personal attacks." I suppose if I only attacked people who can't be here to defend themselves, that would be okay.

[Embalmo]

What I see is a whole lot of sanctimonious armchair quarterbacking, including implied smears against the character of the two young ladies in the linked Chronicle article who were the victims of a horrible ordeal.

What you either failed, or chose not, to see was TAM's most eloquent and to the point commentary of Thu Jul 08, 2010 1:02 pm on this most unfortunate incident . After you have read TAM's post, please come back and elaborate on the "sanctimonious armchair quarterbacking" that bothers you so greatly.

I did, but my favorite moderator deleted my post because I was engaging in "personal attacks." I suppose if I only attacked people who can't be here to defend themselves, that would be okay.

I was called a radical Muslim, which I consider to be the most hideous, vile personal attack one can make to another. I asked, very politely, that the post be removed, but I was informed that because many might agree with this insult, the post would remain. I just re-read the rules and it indicates that NO personal attacks will be allowed, nor will anything related to religious hatred be allowed. Maybe I'm off base here, but being called a member of the Taliban sounds like a personal attack to me (They kill our soldiers-that should be unpopular with this group). I hang out here because of the high standards. I'm very disappointed.

Worded like a disapproving Mullah.

"behaving" is a rather revealing word choice.

As for their being out and about past a time you or anyone else seems to think inappropriate for young women, rings of a Taliban-like perspective regarding women in general.

Embalmo

[Keith B]

OK folks, sometimes there are things that are missed by the mods. Remember we are all volunteers and do our best to keep the forum a good place to visit.

With that said, do NOT make posts that resort to name calling or that contain personal attacks or the thread will be locked. Additionally, repeated violations can lead to potential banning.

And glad to know I am your favorite moderator!! Thanks!

[Oldgringo]

OK folks, sometimes there are things that are missed by the mods. Remember we are all volunteers and do our best to keep the forum a good place to visit.

With that said, do NOT make posts that resort to name calling or that contain personal attacks or the thread will be locked. Additionally, repeated violations can lead to potential banning.

And glad to know I am your favorite moderator!! Thanks!

to our Mods!

[Charles L. Cotton]

I was called a radical Muslim, which I consider to be the most hideous, vile personal attack one can make to another. I asked, very politely, that the post be removed, but I was informed that because many might agree with this insult, the post would remain.
Embalmo

No, that's not what I told you. I said I didn't read the comment as a personal attack. Here is my exact PM.

Chas.

Sorry, I don't read the post that way. I understand you don't like it, but you did post an opinion basically saying women shouldn't be out at that hour and the word "behavior" in that context would have most women equally mad at you.

Chas.

[Embalmo]

...in that context would have most women equally mad at you.

Yes, equally mad, so equally agreeing with the Taliban comment/sentiment.

2. No personal attacks on other members - NONE! We can be respectful even in disagreement. If you're talking about the person rather than the issue, then the post will be deleted.

3. No racial or ethnic slurs. Descriptions of persons in actual events are fine, so long as it doesn't constitute stereotyping.

Embalmo

[JackM]

In light of this thread and watching the T.V. show Bait Car where law enforcement set up a very enticing but totally undefeatable Cadillac Escalade, etc. with cameras, remote control shut-off, doors-locking perps in, etc. it gave me an idea. BG's ALWAYS look for the easy prey/victim which keeps them in business longer to strike again. On the show, it doesn't take 15 seconds for several auto thieves to come out of the woodwork in bad neighborhoods.

Scenario #1
Set up the 2 young, seemingly vulnerable, women late at night in a convertible in a bad part of town in a drive through but with a little surprise in the backseat under a blanket is a well-trained, armed individual ready to put the rapist out of business.

Scenario #2
Have a friend in a different vehicle parked on the other side of the mall bring a lot of empty wrapped boxes at Christmas time through the mall to a car that you are waiting in under a blanket in the back seat armed to the teeth while she places them on the front seat and leaves the door unlocked and returns to the mall for more "shopping". Another friend with binoculars and also armed waits in a van a few rows over with a walkie-talkie to warn you if you face a van-load of attackers to get ready.

Some may find this more rewarding than deer hunting since it helps out the truly vulnerable from being victims when these people are 6 feet under ground. There were probably quite a few people that the rapist in the drive through passed up before he decided to strike the ones least able to defend themselves. This just turns the tables in the same way it would when they decide to pick the wrong house to break into that has a 12-gauge waiting on the other side.

Whoops. Game over!

[USA1]

Scenario #1
Set up the 2 young, seemingly vulnerable, women late at night in a convertible in a bad part of town in a drive through but with a little surprise in the backseat under a blanket is a well-trained, armed individual ready to put the rapist out of business.

Scenario #2
Have a friend in a different vehicle parked on the other side of the mall bring a lot of empty wrapped boxes at Christmas time through the mall to a car that you are waiting in under a blanket in the back seat armed to the teeth while she places them on the front seat and leaves the door unlocked and returns to the mall for more "shopping". Another friend with binoculars and also armed waits in a van a few rows over with a walkie-talkie to warn you if you face a van-load of attackers to get ready.

Some may find this more rewarding than deer hunting since it helps out the truly vulnerable from being victims when these people are 6 feet under ground. There were probably quite a few people that the rapist in the drive through passed up before he decided to strike the ones least able to defend themselves. This just turns the tables in the same way it would when they decide to pick the wrong house to break into that has a 12-gauge waiting on the other side.

Whoops. Game over!

Sounds a little "vigilante" to me.

Defending yourself is one thing, but actively seeking confrontation
and dealing out justice is something else entirely.

[Keith B]

Scenario #1
Set up the 2 young, seemingly vulnerable, women late at night in a convertible in a bad part of town in a drive through but with a little surprise in the backseat under a blanket is a well-trained, armed individual ready to put the rapist out of business.

Scenario #2
Have a friend in a different vehicle parked on the other side of the mall bring a lot of empty wrapped boxes at Christmas time through the mall to a car that you are waiting in under a blanket in the back seat armed to the teeth while she places them on the front seat and leaves the door unlocked and returns to the mall for more "shopping". Another friend with binoculars and also armed waits in a van a few rows over with a walkie-talkie to warn you if you face a van-load of attackers to get ready.

Some may find this more rewarding than deer hunting since it helps out the truly vulnerable from being victims when these people are 6 feet under ground. There were probably quite a few people that the rapist in the drive through passed up before he decided to strike the ones least able to defend themselves. This just turns the tables in the same way it would when they decide to pick the wrong house to break into that has a 12-gauge waiting on the other side.

Whoops. Game over!

Sounds a little "vigilante" to me.

Defending yourself is one thing, but actively seeking confrontation
and dealing out justice is something else entirely.

That wold be a total disaster when it hit court that you were out looking for trouble. Vigilatisim is NOT what having a CHL and carrying a gun is about. It is about being able to protect yourself when situations arise and you need to fight for your life, not fights you go looking for.