Concealed Carry On Campus Forum at TX State

[RPB]

I'll post this link from last week, in case others want to read it

nutshell: San Marcos Police = leaning towards Pro-campus carry (even if University SGT. Benitez isn't)
http://www.sanmarcosrecord.com/local/x1 ... -on-campus" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Ferrari said it is important to have this forum because the concealed carry issue has come up in the past at the university and has been voted down four times.

San Marcos Police Department Chief Howard Williams said Friday that SMPD would not be involved in the forum because UPD has jurisdiction over the university.

“I don’t see any magic in being on a college campus that just automatically makes you safer, and if the rationale is that people can defend themselves, I can understand why the university would want it,” he said.

Williams said there are going to to be people who are “adamant gun supporters” who will argue in favor of allowing concealed carry, but there are also people who will take “hardcore philosophical stances” against allowing it on college campuses.

“There seems to be a certain sanctity to a campus, but they had that same feeling at Virginia Tech and at about 20 other colleges,” he said. “There is no magic fence around our campus.”

[hirundo82]

Thanks, RPB, for the reference. I read the article by Mr. Lewis on Oct 9 and was very impressed with his effort to express the facts on the subject. I hope everyone in Houston read it. The only university I visit these days is Rice, a private school that would be exempt, I suppose, to any new law on the subject. About 8 years ago, I exchanged snail mail with the campus police chief, requesting permission to carry, to no avail. He said that several professors have asked permission for them to carry, but that he has granted none, and doesn't intend to. I don't know if he is still there. (Maybe you are reading this, Chief?).

I doubt the Rice police chief would ever grant anybody permission to carry on campus. If it is the same chief as in 2009, he testified that he instructs his officers to shoot first and ask questions later if they see anybody with a gun on campus.

[Embalmo]

I really had to force myself to attend because I fully expected to be of the minority opinion. I couldn't have been more delighted with the turnout and the clear, logical, succinct points made by such young individuals.

Embalmo

[RPB]

Stats:

http://www.police.txstate.edu/Records/C ... stics.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Texas State University: Burglary of Vehicle 76 in 2009, 88 in 2008,

City of San Marcos PD, 2009 Year in review:
http://www.ci.san-marcos.tx.us/departme ... ew2009.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
(under Common calls for Service)
236 burglarized vehicles

I haven't worked out percentages, general Population compared to Campus Population ... but I doubt any Campus will say vehicle burglaries aren't a problem at all. Even if percentile is lower on campus than generally. Additionally, the stats don't say it all due to a crime occurring across the street from campus, wouldn't be included in the campus stats, but the city's stats.

[RPB]

I really had to force myself to attend because I fully expected to be of the minority opinion. I couldn't have been more delighted with the turnout and the clear, logical, succinct points made by such young individuals.

Embalmo

Some people don't like to think real hard or analyze facts

If the "Antis" (Brady bunch) uses "feelings" instead of "facts", I suggest asking about ...

Do you feel safer walking to your car knowing that car burglars can get guns out of licensees cars in the same parking lot while they are in class, to use against you .... or would you feel safer if the licensee who got out of class the same time you do is walking to his car right next to yours in the same parking lot you are, when a bad guy attempts to carjack you?

Or, Something Like That, depending on whatever crime activity is at whatever campus.

Wish I couldda been there.

I hope there is a write-up in the paper from someone who attended.

[RPB]

Thanks, RPB, for the reference. I read the article by Mr. Lewis on Oct 9 and was very impressed with his effort to express the facts on the subject. I hope everyone in Houston read it. The only university I visit these days is Rice, a private school that would be exempt, I suppose, to any new law on the subject. About 8 years ago, I exchanged snail mail with the campus police chief, requesting permission to carry, to no avail. He said that several professors have asked permission for them to carry, but that he has granted none, and doesn't intend to. I don't know if he is still there. (Maybe you are reading this, Chief?).

I doubt the Rice police chief would ever grant anybody permission to carry on campus. If it is the same chief as in 2009, he testified that he instructs his officers to shoot first and ask questions later if they see anybody with a gun on campus.

Former California Sheriff ? lol

I have a problem calling any University "Private" if they, though it may be in a roundabout way, get money from governments.

Just to name a couple ways I give them money through my tax dollars ...

--------------
Rice University was awarded $11.1 million in federal stimulus funding from the National Institute of Standards and Technology for construction of the Brockman Hall for Physics, a new state-of-the-art research facility.
----------
Rice University participates in US Title IV financial assistance programs.
In 2008-2009, 84% of students received financial aid of some sort.

Grants % of
Students Average
Amount
Any Grant 68% $24,461
Institutional Grant 68% $22,586
Federal Grant 15% $4,279
Pell Grant 15% $3,092
Other Federal Grant 13% $1,389
State or Local Grant 18% $3,776

--------------

and on and on ......... you, the public, are paying them; IMHO, it's public.
I see no reason to exempt "so-called" "Private" schools, unless they indeed accept no money nor benefits from government nor the public. After they have their own water well, power plant and are 100% self-sustaining, and get no benefit from Student's government grants, insured loans etc ... then OK.

====================

I recall when my parents were discussing whether our Elementary schools should accept Federal moneys so milk would be 4 cents a carton instead of 7 cents.
The main objection back then was "But then the Government will tell us what to teach and not to teach"
Soon after, milk was 4 cents, and we learned evolution, stopped hearing the morning prayer over the loudspeaker, didn't have to say the Pledge, stopped learning spelling , ... you know the rest.


We are "The People" that the government is for, and by.
So, WE are the government.
We are the public.
If we support that school, it's public imho.

[hirundo82]

Leaving aside the question of whether private universities should be getting public money at all (Rice has almost $4 billion in the bank; why are they getting government handouts?), funds to private universities usually come without many strings attached (besides not being allowed to discriminate based on sex, race, etc.). For example, private schools can restrict speech on campus even though their public counterparts are bound by the First Amendment.

That's not to say a state couldn't withold money contingent on a school allowing carry on campus--they almost certainly could. It is just unlikely.

[RPB]

Quickly back to Texas State ...
I just now ran across this:

POLL


http://www.snappoll.com/poll/349665.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

How do you want me to vote at the upcoming ASG meeting?
Are you for concealed carry on campus?
Yes, I am for concealed guns on campus. 100% 1

No, I am against concealed guns on campus. 0% 0

total votes: 1

100%, pretty good

[ELB]

How odd. I went to the link for the poll, and hit the button for concealed carry. I got an error message that told me I could not vote repeatedly. Heck, apparently I can't even vote once!

[RPB]

New article today
http://star.txstate.edu/content/student ... y-opinions" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Students Voice Concealed Carry Opinions


Last weeks were:
http://star.txstate.edu/content/conceal ... nday-night" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Concealed carry forum to be held Monday night

http://star.txstate.edu/content/main-po ... -bear-arms" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Main Point: Right to bear arms

http://star.txstate.edu/content/profess ... good-stuff" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Professors smoke the good stuff
I’ve heard from numerous faculty who believe CHL holders cannot be trusted and

[Embalmo]

New article today
http://star.txstate.edu/content/student ... y-opinions" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Students Voice Concealed Carry Opinions


Last weeks were:
http://star.txstate.edu/content/conceal ... nday-night" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Concealed carry forum to be held Monday night

http://star.txstate.edu/content/main-po ... -bear-arms" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Main Point: Right to bear arms

http://star.txstate.edu/content/profess ... good-stuff" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Professors smoke the good stuff
I’ve heard from numerous faculty who believe CHL holders cannot be trusted and

The vote is supposed to happen tonight. Any ideas on getting the info quickly?

[RPB]

Was Supposedly a video feed at http://star.txstate.edu" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; off air now/

Last week I heard/I thought the vote was supposed to be Tuesday, then I heard it was supposed to be tonight.... I missed it watching Chuck and Chase.

http://star.txstate.edu/content/student ... y-opinions" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Today ASG senators will vote on behalf of the student body to either support the current university policy, or issue a statement advocating the policy be changed to allow concealed firearms in university buildings.


Best way now is go to there and check twitter

http://twitter.com/#search?q=%23txstasg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

biancadavis #txstasg by a vote of 27-23 did not pass a bill to support the current #txst policy of not allowing concealed carry on campusabout 1 hour ago via TweetDeck

Realtime results for #txstasg

1. N1537650015_30007518_3694_normal gwhillhouse RT @Allen_Reed: "I know where to buy drugs." -random ASG senator. #txstasg #anewday about 1 hour ago via Tweetie for Mac
2. Hp5_cousins_linecamp_049_normal biancadavis #txstasg by a vote of 27-23 did not pass a bill to support the current #txst policy of not allowing concealed carry on campus about 1 hour ago via TweetDeck
3. Hp5_cousins_linecamp_049_normal biancadavis Not having guns on campus isn't violating 2nd Am like not being able to say fire in a theater doesn't violate the 1st -schultz #txstasg about 1 hour ago via TweetDeck
4. Hp5_cousins_linecamp_049_normal biancadavis Sen. @tylercrump said "if someone was going to shoot on campus and they knew there were guns there, they'd think twice about it" #txstasg about 2 hours ago via TweetDeck
5. Hp5_cousins_linecamp_049_normal biancadavis Gun free zones are a magnet for crazy people -ASG Senator #txstasg about 2 hours ago via TweetDeck
6. Me_normal Allen_Reed "I know where to buy drugs." -random ASG senator. #txstasg #anewday about 2 hours ago via TweetDeck
7. Ustar_twitter_normal universitystar ASG talking about the positive and negative aspects of "Concealed Carry". Let the debate begin #txstasg - http://ow.ly/3he9f" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; about 2 hours ago via HootSuite
8. Ustar_twitter_normal universitystar Sen French, author of "Concealed Carry" giving a speech. #txstasg about 3 hours ago via HootSuite
9. Me_normal Allen_Reed ASG letting a pro-handgun lobby take place right before the concealed carry vote. The public forum was last week #confusion #ethics #txstasg about 3 hours ago via TweetDeck
10. Ustar_twitter_normal universitystar Isaac Hart, CHL Instructor from Lone Star Handgun speaking at #txstasg meeting - http://ow.ly/3hdo8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; about 3 hours ago via HootSuite

Older tweets are temporarily unavailable.



* "Concealed Carry" fails votes 27 - 23 meaning they do not... — 11/29 8pm
* @jaikil They are voting — 11/29 8pm
* ASG is voting on "Concealed Carry" now — 11/29 8pm
* @jaikil I can let you know right before they vote. — 11/29 8pm
* @jaikil I think after they finish debating, and there is no... — 11/29 8pm
* ASG talking about the positive and negative aspects of "... — 11/29 7pm
* @limorama It hiccups every now and then. Just reload and it... — 11/29 7pm
* @limorama Is it working now? — 11/29 7pm
* Sen French, author of "Concealed Carry" giving a speech. #... — 11/29 7pm
* @normalguyguide Thanks — 11/29 7pm
# Isaac Hart, CHL Instructor from Lone Star Handgun speaking... — 11/29 7pm
# Speaker at ASG talking about extension classes, #txasg... — 11/29 7pm
# Now livestreaming ASG decision on their stance on concealed... — 11/29 7pm

[RPB]

universitystar [
Dear Karl Kautsky,

As a publication dedicated to upholding the rights of the first amendment, we do not censor our readers’ ideas. The reason your comment was not posted was because it contained a personal attack against another commenter. In order to keep the free flow of ideas without fear of name-calling and other personal attacks, we did not allow your comment to be posted.

Thank you,
Chase Birthisel / Star Web Editor


I guess he was mad and couldn't think straight without using personal attacks after presenting paragraphs on how to win a logical debate.

[sigma9]

so I am completely confused by all the tweets.....

What was the final decision?

[RPB]

Today's article :

ASG votes in favor of concealed carry in classrooms
http://star.txstate.edu/content/asg-vot ... classrooms" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(We should notify TV stations and etc maybe)
City newspapers had articles about the forum last week

French authored a bill immediately following the resolution’s failure to give a “definitive recommendation” to the university regarding the policy.

The new bill states the senate disagrees with the administration’s policy prohibiting concealed handguns on campus. The new bill passed 24-10 with eight abstentions — one vote more than the required two thirds.

Ferrari refused comment about whether or not the second piece of the authored bill explicitly stating the students are against concealed carry on campus was necessary, but said it could have been brought up at a separate time.

Ferrari will decide whether or not to veto the second piece of legislation, which disagrees with the university's stance on banning guns, Wednesday afternoon. If she decides to veto the legislation, the senate can override her veto with 2/3 majority. More at the link above.