Has this happened to you? Someone calls a LEO?

[The Annoyed Man]

The main thing to remember is to stay calm & be polite. That should cover you for the majority of encounters - both gun-related and not.

[krieghoff]

Does anyone feel obligated to show the person their CHL and explain yourself before the situation escalates? Anyone with experience with this? Should I create a new topic for this question?

It depends on how calm the other person was. IF he/she was calm and grinning and asked if I had a license to carry, I'd probably just nod and leave it at that. I'd never show that person my CHL unless they were an LEO. It's none of their business. It's got my personal information on it, and I don't know who that person is. You can leave or stay, but it doesn't matter. A person that is hysterical is going to call the law regardless of what you do, and a person like that wouldn't know a CHL from a library card, so showing it them would be pointless. If someone were to loudly/hysterically challenge me with "DO YOU HAVE A LICENSE FOR THAT THING!?!?!?!" I'd either answer "who wants to know?" or just ignore the question. Depends on the situation. The point is, don't let the thing escalate in the first place. You can't fix stupid. Not ever. Only stupid can fix stupid.....albeit often painfully. If it looks like it might be headed into full retard, don't contribute to the conversation, and leave if you can before it gets to that point. If you can't leave for some reason, then have your TDL and CHL handy in a shirt pocket or something so that when the cops do drive up, you can hand it to them before they even start asking questions. If your gun actually was unintentionally exposed, you can say, "I don't know, it might have been for just a moment when I was getting out of my car....." Or "the breeze blew my jacket open before I could catch it....." or any number of other answers. What's important is that the cop understands that you did NOT draw your gun, that any exposure was unintentional, and it wouldn't hurt if you told the cop that you had actually tried to deescalate the situation, but the other party was increasingly hysterical, and you were unable to get away from him/her. Apologize to the cop and say you're sorry that he/she had to get dragged all the way out here for such a ridiculous call.

Each situation is going to be unique, but honestly, I think most of us go through our entire CHL existences without ever having an issue with someone else, particularly with a stranger. We have members here who have gotten out of their car and walked into Walmart, did their shopping, paid and left, before discovering that their gun was in the open the whole time. NOBODY NOTICED. Most people just aren't that aware of their surroundings. Be aware of your responsibilities as an armed citizen. Be aware of the things you are NOT responsible for (it's not a Batman license). Dress around your gun, not the other way around. Have confidence in your carry method. Strap it on. Cover it up. Forget about it.

You can't live your life worrying about other people's possible issues. The world is full of hysterical stupid people. Most of them vote democrat and have issues with your devotion to the Constitution. Ignore them. They are busybodies, and they spend most of their energy on trying to tell everyone else how to live. Their animus against your having a gun is only a part of their worldview. And unless they are LEO, they have ZERO authority to demand to see your CHL.

Period.

Well said. Especially the third paragraph!

[tbrown]

I'm wondering what will happen if (say sitting down in a restaurant or just walking around Walmart) and someone notices my concealed gun and calls the police? Will I get arrested? Will I lose my CHL? Just wondering.

I've tried looking for answers or discussion but to no avail.

Nobody can know what will happen. It depends how you behave. It depends on the police who respond. It depends on other factors that I can't know now with any more certainty than I know the number of hurricanes we'll have in 2014.

[chasfm11]

I'm wondering what will happen if (say sitting down in a restaurant or just walking around Walmart) and someone notices my concealed gun and calls the police? Will I get arrested? Will I lose my CHL? Just wondering.

I've tried looking for answers or discussion but to no avail.

There is another way to look at this. What if you didn't have a gun and you suddenly needed it? From a statistical standpoint it is hard to say which is the greater risk because both are random. The majority of us will see either situation in our lifetimes (hopefully.)

I have to admit that for a time after my plastic arrived, I wondered whether my statistical time would be up. I had my shirt blow up a few times and I know that an observant person could have seen something. Washing the front windshield in our van with certain shirts will cause enough of a gap that at least the holster will be displayed. But in several years, including all those situations, I've never been the subject of a MWAG call.

I do lots of risky things. I have a chain saw and I use it regularly. I use a number of power saws including a radial arm saw. All of those come with risks. I view carrying a gun on my hip as having several risks, too. I could mishandle it and create an ND. I could have a wardrobe malfunction and end up in the back of a patrol car. But I believe in accepting and managing risks. When I operate the saws, I don't take foolish chances. I use push sticks with the table saw and make sure the work is anchored solidly with the radial arm. Occasionally, I push the envelope with a shirt that is shorter and tighter than I prefer but, for the most part, I play very conservative with clothing. I don't have a physique that I want to display to begin with, gun or no gun, so baggy is just fine with me.

Frankly, I've gotten to the point where I accept the patrol card ride as the potential price of my choices. I'm confident that I could beat any intentional exposure charge, though I'd rather not have to go through the financial hit for that. Many people exceed the speed limits and accept citations as the price of that choice. I don't see a lot of difference with the possible accidental exposure situation. I'm certain that I have a much greater risk of being in a major auto accident but that hasn't stopped me from driving.

[CHLLady]

Does anyone feel obligated to show the person their CHL and explain yourself before the situation escalates? Anyone with experience with this? Should I create a new topic for this question?

It depends on how calm the other person was. IF he/she was calm and grinning and asked if I had a license to carry, I'd probably just nod and leave it at that. I'd never show that person my CHL unless they were an LEO. It's none of their business. It's got my personal information on it, and I don't know who that person is. You can leave or stay, but it doesn't matter. A person that is hysterical is going to call the law regardless of what you do, and a person like that wouldn't know a CHL from a library card, so showing it them would be pointless. If someone were to loudly/hysterically challenge me with "DO YOU HAVE A LICENSE FOR THAT THING!?!?!?!" I'd either answer "who wants to know?" or just ignore the question. Depends on the situation. The point is, don't let the thing escalate in the first place. You can't fix stupid. Not ever. Only stupid can fix stupid.....albeit often painfully. If it looks like it might be headed into full retard, don't contribute to the conversation, and leave if you can before it gets to that point. If you can't leave for some reason, then have your TDL and CHL handy in a shirt pocket or something so that when the cops do drive up, you can hand it to them before they even start asking questions. If your gun actually was unintentionally exposed, you can say, "I don't know, it might have been for just a moment when I was getting out of my car....." Or "the breeze blew my jacket open before I could catch it....." or any number of other answers. What's important is that the cop understands that you did NOT draw your gun, that any exposure was unintentional, and it wouldn't hurt if you told the cop that you had actually tried to deescalate the situation, but the other party was increasingly hysterical, and you were unable to get away from him/her. Apologize to the cop and say you're sorry that he/she had to get dragged all the way out here for such a ridiculous call.

Each situation is going to be unique, but honestly, I think most of us go through our entire CHL existences without ever having an issue with someone else, particularly with a stranger. We have members here who have gotten out of their car and walked into Walmart, did their shopping, paid and left, before discovering that their gun was in the open the whole time. NOBODY NOTICED. Most people just aren't that aware of their surroundings. Be aware of your responsibilities as an armed citizen. Be aware of the things you are NOT responsible for (it's not a Batman license). Dress around your gun, not the other way around. Have confidence in your carry method. Strap it on. Cover it up. Forget about it.

You can't live your life worrying about other people's possible issues. The world is full of hysterical stupid people. Most of them vote democrat and have issues with your devotion to the Constitution. Ignore them. They are busybodies, and they spend most of their energy on trying to tell everyone else how to live. Their animus against your having a gun is only a part of their worldview. And unless they are LEO, they have ZERO authority to demand to see your CHL.

Period.

As always great advice.

Cajun, I am always polite, so that should be easy to do.

[Excaliber]

Another item to add to the list of potential tactics:

If faced with a hysterical antigunner who has called in a MWAG, call the same PD yourself and tell the dispatcher (thus putting on the dispatch tape) that there was an unintentional momentary exposure of your licensed handgun and you understand that a call has been made regarding that.

Tell the dispatcher you have a CHL, give your description, and say you're waiting to meet responding officers with your CHL and TDL in hand. That will most likely calm things down substantially and avoid the scenario where it rains cops and they all draw down on you.

[Ruark]

IIRC, that's what happened to that guy that was killed in a Costco. Somebody saw his weapon and freaked out and told the store manager, who happened to be a typical hysterical anti-gun loony. The store manager called the police ("there's a man running around in the store with a GUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!") and evacuated the store. When the guy was surrounded by a SWAT team, he told them he had a CHL and raised his shirt tail to show them his weapon, at which point they filled him with more holes than a slice of bread.

Accidental display of your weapon is one of those things where probably nothing will happen, but the important point here is what CAN happen, however unlikely. It goes without saying that there are a LOT of people out there who go into utter hysterics at the sight of a gun, and they can cause you all kinds of trouble.

Bottom line: keep that gun concealed.

[Excaliber]

IIRC, that's what happened to that guy that was killed in a Costco. Somebody saw his weapon and freaked out and told the store manager, who happened to be a typical hysterical anti-gun loony. The store manager called the police ("there's a man running around in the store with a GUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!") and evacuated the store. When the guy was surrounded by a SWAT team, he told them he had a CHL and raised his shirt tail to show them his weapon, at which point they filled him with more holes than a slice of bread.

Accidental display of your weapon is one of those things where probably nothing will happen, but the important point here is what CAN happen, however unlikely. It goes without saying that there are a LOT of people out there who go into utter hysterics at the sight of a gun, and they can cause you all kinds of trouble.

Bottom line: keep that gun concealed.

Yes, keeping the gun concealed is the best way to go.

However, if you carry daily or on a very frequent basis, that plan is going to fail on occasion due to the unlimited number of circumstances that can happen.

I think it's important to have a plan to deal with those as well so one doesn't end up in another COSTCO incident. We're at much lower risk here anyway because Texas officers generally use much better judgment than was used in that situation, but taking the pucker factor out of the response before officers get there has a lot to be said for it.

[CHLLady]

Another item to add to the list of potential tactics:

If faced with a hysterical antigunner who has called in a MWAG, call the same PD yourself and tell the dispatcher (thus putting on the dispatch tape) that there was an unintentional momentary exposure of your licensed handgun and you understand that a call has been made regarding that.

Tell the dispatcher you have a CHL, give your description, and say you're waiting to meet responding officers with your CHL and TDL in hand. That will most likely calm things down substantially and avoid the scenario where it rains cops and they all draw down on you.

Excellent advice also.

[Hola Gato]

Another option is to call 911 to report the hysterical person who is yelling about a gun. Who knows what they might do?

[Dragonfighter]

I have a different problem. After completing my local Citizen's Police Academy and doing ride-a-longs, the local police know me pretty well and know that I carry concealed. In public, they are very likely ask me,"What are you carrying today?" It is hard to keep my concealed carrying a secret when that happens. It doesn't really bother me because they are generally discreet when they ask me.

Just look around nervously and whisper, "Shhhh, it's a secrete."

Secreting what? Just messin with ya.

[android]

Stuff that will help....

Pick a gun you can carry comfortably and covertly. Sure, a bunch of people will brag that they can carry a Desert Eagle concealed without even a lump. They will not be there to help you when you get arrested. Get a compact or sub-compact at least until you are experienced and confident in what you can get away with.

Camp style shirts by 5.11 or other straight hemmed un-tucked style shirts work best. T-shirts or polo shirts will need to be very loose.

In addition to the above, get in the habit of checking your shirt as you stand up or get out of a car or other situations where you might reveal your weapon. You're going to have to bend at the knees to reach stuff on lower shelves, not bend at you waist like you do touching your toes.

Learn to use the "other hand" to wash windows or reach high. It won't hurt you to be a bit ambidextrous.

[Jaguar]

I have a different problem. After completing my local Citizen's Police Academy and doing ride-a-longs, the local police know me pretty well and know that I carry concealed. In public, they are very likely ask me,"What are you carrying today?" It is hard to keep my concealed carrying a secret when that happens. It doesn't really bother me because they are generally discreet when they ask me.

Just look around nervously and whisper, "Shhhh, it's a secrete."

Secreting what? Just messin with ya.

D'oh!

[goose]

Tell the dispatcher you have a CHL, give your description, and say you're waiting to meet responding officers with your CHL and TDL in hand. That will most likely calm things down substantially and avoid the scenario where it rains cops and they all draw down on you.

Good stuff. If aware of the MWAG call, this is pretty good advice.

[handog]

Also, this is the only case we know where a CHL was arrested for accidentally exposing his handgun http://texaschlforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=31719" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

To be specific, he was arrested for intentionally exposing his handgun in a situation where actual intent was very unlikely. To me, it demonstrated that at least one Round Rock LEO knew the law very well and chose to specify intent. The Annoyed Man has a good summary that I completely agree with.

Basic summary is this: He unintentionall exposed his gun, but was arrested for intentional failure to conceal. The county prosecutor eventually agreed with Handog, and charges were dropped.

1. He had the gun, a baby Glock 36, in a Bianchi 100 Professional IWB Holster, concealed under his shirt tail. (I seem to remember that it was in a SOB position, but I could be wrong about that.)
2. He was sitting in a chair, waiting for his number to be called.
3. While sitting in the chair, the back of his shirt, rubbing against the chair-back, rode up bit by bit until the gun was exposed.
4. When his number was called, he stood up.
5. His shirt had ridden up far enough that the gun (unknown to him because it was in an SOB (small of the back) holster) was exposed to the woman sitting behind him.
6. Nothing was said at that moment. He realized the problem, pulled his shirt-tail down and covered the gun, and completed his transaction.
7. Unknown to Handog, The woman who saw his gun phoned in a MWAG call.
8. He transacted his business and left.
9. All the squad cars in the planet converged on him in the parking lot, and all the cops drew down on him.
10. He was arrested for intentional failure to conceal, despite the fact that it was unintentional.
11. In the end, the MWAG call and the arrest were recognized as being bogus, and after some lawyer fees, he was let go. He still has his CHL as far as I know.

Details of that arrest here: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=31719&p=369342#p369342" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There used to be a thread prior to that one in which he had given the details in greater detail, but I believe that he deleted it soon after on advice of counsel, as the case was not yet decided. As I recall, the jurisdiction was Round Rock, but I could be wrong about that.

As Keith pointed out above, this is a pretty rare occurrence, and Handog's experience is the only one most of us know about. Just do a conscientious of concealing your gun, don't pluck at your clothing all the time, and don't worry about it. Find subtle ways to check your concealment whenever you transition from sitting to standing or visa-versa.

This is quite accurate. Just one thing. The RR PD watched Mrs. Handog and I get in our truck and drive off, then pulled me over two blocks down the road. We were obviously no threat to anyone. It may have been an anomaly but it can happen. It took years before I could just strap on my CC and forget about it without fear of the Police.