Posting at State public service offices?

[quidni]

It's my understanding that a State agency that provides a public service, in a public access building, is not allowed to post non-CHL signs on the premises - although they are still allowed to ban employee carry. This would include TxDOT, Tx Workforce Commission, & similar agencies. Is this correct? and where can I find the specific chapter/verse that says so/no?

[Commander]

PC 30.06 Trespass by Holder of License to Carry Concealed Handgun.
(a) A license holder commits an offense if the concealed license holder:
(1) carries a hangun under the authority of SubChapter H Chapter 411 Government code on property of another without effective consent: and
(2) received notice that:
(A) entry on the property by a license holder with a concealed hangun was forbidden or..........


......(d) An offense under this section is a Class A Misdeameanor.
(e) It is an exception to the application of this section that the property on which the license holder carries a handgun is owned or leased by a governmental entity and is not a premises or other place on which the license holder is prohibited from carrying the handgun under Section 46.03 or 46.035.

[quidni]

......(d) An offense under this section is a Class A Misdeameanor.
(e) It is an exception to the application of this section that the property on which the license holder carries a handgun is owned or leased by a governmental entity and is not a premises or other place on which the license holder is prohibited from carrying the handgun under Section 46.03 or 46.035.

OK, I guess my "blonde" is showing... I'm reading this as "customers can carry there" but not that they can't post. Is there a difference, legally?

Or am I mis-reading this?

[Charles L. Cotton]

OK, I guess my "blonde" is showing... I'm reading this as "customers can carry there" but not that they can't post. Is there a difference, legally?

Or am I mis-reading this?

You are correct; 30.06 signs are not enforceable on government property, but there is no statute prohibiting them from posting ineffective signs. Hopefully, this will change in a year, but I'm not holding my breath on this one. (Note: governmental agencies can post 30.06 signs in certain specified locations, such as at meetings of governmental agencies.)

You are also correct that they can prohibit employees from carrying.

Regards,
Chas.

[stevie_d_64]

OK, I guess my "blonde" is showing... I'm reading this as "customers can carry there" but not that they can't post. Is there a difference, legally?

Or am I mis-reading this?

You are correct; 30.06 signs are not enforceable on government property, but there is no statute prohibiting them from posting ineffective signs. Hopefully, this will change in a year, but I'm not holding my breath on this one. (Note: governmental agencies can post 30.06 signs in certain specified locations, such as at meetings of governmental agencies.)

You are also correct that they can prohibit employees from carrying.

Regards,
Chas.

They have also conceded to "special" badging of CHL'ers at certain facilities...611 Walker (Public Works)

I have yet to decide to try it, going to pay a friendly (I'm serious) visit to a couple of my favorite elected officials offices downtown as well...I know for a fact they personally wouldn't have a problem with my carrying in thier presense...I wouldn't be doing it just to do it either...

I'm sure it wouldn't be a good idea to do so, so it'll stay in the vehicle locked in the safe for now...

I seem to be getting into situations which require me to disarm more often than I care for...I try to avoid those places, but seem to frequent them more these days...

uggggg...

[quidni]

You are correct; 30.06 signs are not enforceable on government property, but there is no statute prohibiting them from posting ineffective signs. Hopefully, this will change in a year, but I'm not holding my breath on this one. (Note: governmental agencies can post 30.06 signs in certain specified locations, such as at meetings of governmental agencies.)

You are also correct that they can prohibit employees from carrying.

That clarifies it. Thank you, sir!

[Photoman]

You are correct; 30.06 signs are not enforceable on government property, but there is no statute prohibiting them from posting ineffective signs. Hopefully, this will change in a year, but I'm not holding my breath on this one. Regards,
Chas.

Good grief! It's no wonder less than one percent of the eligible CHL licensees get a license! You have to be a lawyer to know where you can carry! This is THE weak link in the Texas CHL law.

Posting of ineffective signs needs to be an offense. As it stands right now, any establishment that sells alcohol and isn't CHL friendly can post an ineffective 51% sign and effectively prohibit weapons on their property without having to post the "ugly" 30.06 sign. How am I to know if they really are 51% or not without contacting TABC?!



.

[Greybeard]

In my experience, once informed, TABC has been pretty prompt at making those with improperly posted 51% signs yank them.

[Kalrog]

In my experience, once informed, TABC has been pretty prompt at making those with improperly posted 51% signs yank them.

Except when they can't answer the question about how a single vendor can make an establishment off limits. I think I might need to ask that question again - but of a different person and see where it goes.

[revjen45]

What about State parks? We recently visited Glen Rose to see the dinosaur tracks. They have big signs banning alcohol and firearms and that it's a game refuge. Does this apply legally to CHL holders? I seem to recall an article on another board that CHL holders are legal to carry in a State park. I'm Listening....

[Kalrog]

I believe STATE parks are open. If it wasn't a valid 30.06 sign then it doesn't apply to CHL holders as there is nothing to enforce as it doesn't meet the requirements of the law. If it was a valid 30.06 sign, then it doesn't apply to CHL holders because state owned areas aren't allowed to post except in very specific circumstances.

[Commander]

Here is a quote from Texas Parks and Wildlife Rules of Conduct in State Parks 59.134:

(f) Arms and Firearms.
It is an offense to:
1. possess a firearm with a cartridge or projectile in any portion of the mechanism, except when authorized by the commission or the director;
2. display a firearm, except when authorized by the director; and
3. discharge across, in, or into a state park any arm, firearm, or device capable of injuring or killing any person or animal or damaging or destroying public or private property except when authorized by the director.

However, although this is from their webpage, it could be out of date as a State Park is state government property and the exemption that prevents the posting of 30.06 sign on state or local government property would seem to apply.

[GrillKing]

I believe STATE parks are open. If it wasn't a valid 30.06 sign then it doesn't apply to CHL holders as there is nothing to enforce as it doesn't meet the requirements of the law. If it was a valid 30.06 sign, then it doesn't apply to CHL holders because state owned areas aren't allowed to post except in very specific circumstances.

I also believe this is correct. Regardless, apparently the Director has stated that Concealed Carry is allowed. I have put together a summary of CHL stuff I carry in case I ever have a need to point out to a LEO why I believe I am correct in my understanding of the law. You are welcome to use it if you wish (as long as you agree that since I'm not a lawyer, it may or may not be correct, accurate, appropriate, in context, etc!!!). It includes an alleged copy of the Park Director's letter. It can be found at:

http://www.trottfamily.net/chl/chlinfo.htm ...... userid and password are both 'chlinfo'

along with a shameless plug for the Texas State Guard (which has significant benefit, by law, for CHL).

[mec]

"
I also believe this is correct. Regardless, apparently the Director has stated that Concealed Carry is allowed. I have put together a summary "


Right He issued a written statement fairly early in the program. Legal to carry but not legal to shoot the gun. Makes sense as most of our state parks are so crowded with people that there's standing room only.