Uninformed CHLer or is he right?

[CrimsonSoul]

I was talking with a friend at work who has a CHL. He told me that his CHL instructor told his class that if pulled over and an officer ask if you have a weapon (as you gave him the CHL card too) you can legally tell him no, even if you do have one on you. I feel that if the cop found out you were lieing that would be a huge saftey risk to the cop and some kind of illegalness, any input?

[dewayneward]

at the very least, not smart. ask yourself when is it OK to lie to a LEO?

[srothstein]

This is sort of a gray area of the law. The only time you have to tell an officer the truth is if he is asking questions during an investigation or if you are detained (or arrested or a witness) and he asks your name, address, or date of birth. See Penal Code sections 37.08 false reprot to a peace officer and 38.02 Failure to identify for the exact requirements.

But, the law specifically states that if you are carrying you must show the CHL and specifically states that the officer has the authority to disarm you under certain circumstances (left up to him really). This certainly implies that you must answer honestly if he asks if you are carrying. But, one of the interesting parts of our laws is that if it is not stated to be an offense, there is no penalty for breaking the law. So I am not sure exactly what the officer could do to you. I could see an imaginative officer charging you with interfering with public duties (PC 38.15) and making at least a good enough case to cost you several thousand dollars defending yourself.

I would advise that this is one of the areas where it is much better to not be the test case. Tell the officer the truth and let him disarm you if he desires. You can never win an argument with an officer on the street, even if you are right and will win in court.

[LittleGun]

If you are lawfully carrying, why would you not want to say so?

[bubba1876]

I have enough respect for LEOs to let them know when presenting my CHL if I'm carrying. They usually ask first, but I have no problem letting them know. They have enough stress on the job to be guessing if a CHLer is lying. (I think I made myself sound like I get pulled over everday!! ) . I've been pulled over 3 times while a CHL in the last 3+ years, only one speeding ticket (I deserved it).

[longtooth]

If you heard that instructor right, find a different one for renewal.

Read Steve's

[fredtubbs]

If you told him no and he decides there is probably cause to search you and your car, when he finds your gun you're not going to like what happens next.

[Bob Landry]

If you are lawfully carrying, why would you not want to say so?

Exactly. I don't see it as an invasion of my privacy. The law says you must inform him if you are carrying. It also says he can disarm you if he wants to for the duration of the traffic stop, and that he must, by law, return your weapon to you when the stop is completed. So, where's the rub with that? You guys can be argumentative with the cop and assurt your perceived rights if you like. Maybe you can afford to be the test case, I can't..

[3dfxMM]

The law says you must inform him if you are carrying.

Can you point us to the specific place in the law?

[will381796]

I don't think that the law specifically requires that you inform him that you're carrying, but it is pretty much common sense. The law requires that you provide your CHL along with your ID if asked for ID while you're carrying. So you MUST provide your CHL if you are armed and he asks for ID. This tells him that you're carrying.

If you do not provide your CHL, and state that you are not carrying, but you are in fact carrying, then you are the very least breaking the law with respect to the CHL.

Texas Penal Code also makes it a crime to provide false information to a LOE if that information is pertinent to a criminal investigation.

§ 37.08. FALSE REPORT TO PEACE OFFICER OR LAW ENFORCEMENT
EMPLOYEE. (a) A person commits an offense if, with intent to
deceive, he knowingly makes a false statement that is material to a
criminal investigation and makes the statement to:
(1) a peace officer conducting the investigation; or
(2) any employee of a law enforcement agency that is
authorized by the agency to conduct the investigation and that the
actor knows is conducting the investigation.
(b) In this section, "law enforcement agency" has the
meaning assigned by Article 59.01, Code of Criminal Procedure.
(c) An offense under this section is a Class B misdemeanor.

Acts 1973, 63rd Leg., p. 883, ch. 399, § 1, eff. Jan. 1, 1974.
Amended by Acts 1993, 73rd Leg., ch. 900, § 1.01, eff. Sept. 1,
1994; Acts 1997, 75th Leg., ch. 925, § 1, eff. Sept. 1, 1997.

IANAL, so I do not know how this would relate to a simple traffic stop as to whether your being armed or disarmed is part of the investigation of traffic violation and whether this would justify you being charged with this additional charge.

But, you have your CHL so you have nothing to hide if you have your weapon on you during a traffic stop so I'm not understanding the apprehension about telling the LOE when he asks.

[Charles L. Cotton]

The law says you must inform him if you are carrying.

Can you point us to the specific place in the law?

While the Government Code doesn't require a CHL to inform the LEO verbally, the requirement to show your CHL only when you are armed establishes a requirement to inform by way of presenting your CHL.

Chas.

Sec.A411.205.AADISPLAYING LICENSE; PENALTY.A (a)If a
license holder is carrying a handgun on or about the license
holder’s person when a magistrate or a peace officer demands that
the license holder display identification, the license holder shall
display both the license holder ’s driver ’s license or
identification certificate issued by the department and the license
holder ’s handgun license. A person who fails or refuses to display
the license and identification as required by this subsection is
subject to suspension of the person ’s license as provided by
Section 411.187.

[3dfxMM]

Thanks Charles. I understand that. However, it does not state that one must inform the officer if one is carrying. Nor does it state that one must only show the officer one's CHL if carrying. I was trying to determine if there was some other law I did not know about.

[Purplehood]

I am all into my personal rights and such, but also try to be very cooperative with any LEO's that I come across.

In general, I am going to show my CHL to any LEO that questions me without being prompted. If he/she asks me if I am armed, I am going to give an honest answer.

If I am asked for my SSN, I am going to quote the Privacy Act of 1974.

That is pretty much where my limit is.

[will381796]

Handing him the CHL is you saying "I have a gun" and would be interpreted as such by the LOE. The LOE will ask where is the gun. You don't necessarily have to tell him where it is, but you're only creating pain for yourself if you try and be evasive for no reason.

[kidder014]

... you're only creating pain for yourself if you try and be evasive for no reason.

So when would be a good reason to be evasive???

"Yes,Officer, I do have a gun with me, but I left it in the trunk when I loaded up the bags of cocaine"