TexasCHLforum.com

Howdy,

After a very considerable amount of personal debate, I have decided to raise my employers awareness of their policies regarding CHL by an employee. I have seen the issue raised numerous times here on the boards and understand the pros and cons of doing so. I remain resolute and will submit the following letter to our HR and Legal departments pending your review. Without further-a-do:

To Whom It May Concern,

I have enjoyed gainful employment of COMPANY for just over two and a half years. During this time I have obtained a concealed handgun license issued by the state of Texas. The laws pertaining to possession of firearms by licensee holders on private property are very clear, unfortunately, company policy and written notice posted on company premises are not. I am asking that the appropriate entities review this issue and provide clarification.

I have brought my concern to our Human Resources Department and was told that the Employee Handbook was sufficiently clear and specifically prohibited the possession of firearms. I further inquired as to how one could obtain “authorization” as noted in the section below:

Workplace Violence Prevention
Employees are expected to refrain from… Firearms, weapons, and other dangerous or hazardous devices or substances are prohibited from the premises of COMPANY without proper authorization"

I was then told that authorization could not be given due to the section “Employee Conduct and Workplace Rules” which reads:

To ensure orderly operations and provide the best possible work environment, the Company expects employees to follow rules of conduct that will protect the interests and safety of all employees and COMPANY.

It is not possible to list all the forms of behavior that are considered unacceptable in the workplace. The following are examples of infractions of rules of conduct that may result in disciplinary action, up to and including termination of employment:

• Possession of dangerous or unauthorized materials, such as explosives or firearms, in the workplace”

Again, the term “unauthorized” is used, but I was not able to locate any documentation specifically referring to what materials or substances are considered “dangerous or unauthorized”. I could very well be in violation already as there is approximately fourteen gallons of highly combustible gasoline already in my vehicles’ gas tank. Despite this, I was then told that I could “keep it (firearm) in my car”. As the facilities parking lot is publically accessible and no notification is present preventing possession this may be the case, I do believe however, that my employment could very well be terminated (in addition to the at-will nature) for violation of the Workplace Violence Prevention policy as the term “premises” is employed and would encompass these areas.

Further obfuscating the issue, there are a number of signs that consist of a revolver that has been crossed out (similar in appearance to that of a “no smoking” display) which are present in proximity to selected entrances to the building. These displays are non-compliant with the above statute and as such do not provide significant written notice to a non-employee licensee.

Texas Penal Code 30.06c

In order to provide notice that entry on property by a license holder with a concealed handgun is forbidden, Penal Code Section 30.06(c)(3)(A) requires that a written communication contain the following language:

"PURSUANT TO SECTION 30.06, PENAL CODE (TRESPASS BY HOLDER OF A LICENSE TO CARRY A CONCEALED HANDGUN) A PERSON LICENSED UNDER SUBCHAPTER H, CHAPTER 411, GOVERNMENT CODE (CONCEALED HANDGUN LAW), MAY NOT ENTER THIS PROPERTY WITH A CONCEALED HANDGUN."
"CONFORME A LA SECCIÓN 30.06 DEL CÔDIGO PENAL (TRASPASAR PORTANDO ARMAS DE FUEGO) PERSONAS CON LICENCIA BAJO DEL SUB-CAPITULO H, CAPITULO 411, CODIGO DE GOBIERNO (LEY DE PORTAR ARMAS), NO DEBEN ENTRAR A ESTA PROPIEDAD PORTANDO UN ARMA DE FUEGO."

It is not within the scope of this document to debate the issue of lawfully concealed handguns in the workplace. I understand and respect COMPANY’s decision to restrict possession of firearms on company premises should that be their intent. I simply wish to clarify this intent and provide legal notification so as to fully educate other employees whom are concealed handgun licensees both within the employee handbook and with respect to posted written notification about the premises.

I will however raise the issue however that the unknowing possession of a firearm by a license holder where prohibited is not taken lightly and may result in the revocation of the license and disqualify reapplication for a five year period. Obtaining a license is a various strenuous process and requires a considerable investment of one’s time and monies.

Furthermore, I would ask that the company consider that they are inadvertently disarming their employees not only while about its’ property but also during our daily commutes. I am sure you have already be apprised as to the occurrence of a number of said incidents already. Should an incident arise which requires the immediate defense of our person from death or serious bodily injury, we will have been denied a significant capacity to do so.

Thank you very much for your attention to this matter.

-Idrathernot

Sounds like you've got another job lined up? This ain't a good time to be shakin' the bushes.

Seriously, isn't there someone in authority (not HR puppets) who may be sympathetic/open to your cause whom you can talk to about this? A letter is sorta' like a bell. Once rung, it can't be un-rung. If the letter must be written, the word you're looking for is "concise". Keep your letter brief, to the point and definitely not adversarial or confrontational.

The documentation/substantiation of your position can be presented during the interview after the letter gets read by someone with the authority to make decisions.

Good luck.

Indeed I do have other opportunities available that I have chosen to pursue in the near future. I plan on sending this to the entire HR and Legal Departments, as well as the CEO and COO. This letter is going back to HQ in California and I do not know anyone in a position of authority to handle the inquiry.

...This letter is going back to HQ in California...

I suspect I know the response to your letter.

Once again, good luck and God Bless.

I know, I'm not expecting a miracle. Just "shakin' the bushes"

idrathernot wrote:I know, I'm not expecting a miracle. Just "shakin' the bushes"

And you have also revelaed your real name - obviously it's Don Quixote Sisyphus.

Actually, other than a couple of spelling and punctiuation issues, it's a fair letter, but I wouldn't expect much from it.

I would add in what are the requirements to obtain a CHL (i.e. no felonies in prior 10 years, no Class A or B Misdeameanors, not chemically dependent, etc, ect....).

I've made a couple of corrections regarding my spelling and punctuation that I've caught since posting the rough draft.

I agree with OG that the letter should be concise and to the point, hence I'm not going into arguments and counter-points or even basic CHL info.

I just figure that if I have to play by the rules (laws even), then they should at least be aware of them and then comply to the best of their ability.

It would be WONDERFUL if anyone knew of litigation involving a civil suit for damages incurred as a result of forced disarmament.

A 'No good deed goes unpunished' move.
About 99.99999% chance of backfireing on you one way or other, short and long term.
-Do NOT stir that brew! -
Relax, enjoy a sunset and get on with your life.

Even if you go on to other jobs I still wouldn't send this. When I leave a job I try to do so as quietly and professionally as possible. You never know who you will wind up working for again. Maybe this company buys a company you go to work for. Maybe the company you go to work for buys this company and someone there gets put in a position over you again. Maybe you leave to go work elsewhere and someone from your current company goes to work at your new company. Even if they aren't in charge of you the possibility of them saying something like "Hey that guy worked for my old company and before he left he sent this really weird letter about carrying a gun at work. You guys should watch him." is there. Sure your letter is well written and makes sense. To us anyway. To some narrow minded person who is set in their ways and won't change it may seem a completely other. Also people will spread rumors based on half truths and for all you know you might get a reputation of having been fired for carrying a gun into work even though it never even happened. Office gossip spreads like fire and often has no or very little truth behind it. Also I hate to say it but these guys are probably either never going to see the letter or never really read it. Their secretaries, assistants, or whatever will intercept it and deem it's not worth their valuable time. Even if they say they have an open policy about employee problems blah blah their headquarters is still too far away for you to actually talk to the big bosses so for all you know they just say they are an employee focused company to make the employees feel better.

Just my opinion but never shake the bushes when they will never drop fruit no matter how hard you work. It's not worth all the thorns you have to cut yourself on to get nothing in return. Also don't go looking for trouble. It usually finds us when we aren't looking for it enough.

idrathernot wrote:This letter is going back to HQ in California and I do not know anyone in a position of authority to handle the inquiry.

Good luck with that one. I was a pretty much life long California resident until 2006. Sending it there is simply going to ensure that you cannot even store your weapon in your car. In fact, it might very well ensure a decision on their part as to whether or not they consider you a "good fit" in their corporate culture.

Like gregthehand said, it is better to simply pursue better possibilities without burning your bridges behind you if at all possible.

idrathernot wrote:I know, I'm not expecting a miracle. Just "shakin' the bushes"

"Be careful when shaking bushes. You never know what will come out and bite you."

Seriously, there is no possible good outcome that would result from sending this letter. Now that you have gotten it off your chest, go to your hard drive and use your delete key.

Better polish up your resumé.

Better yet, don't send it at all. Gregthehand hit the nail right on the head. You never know who knows who or who you may run into again. Let sleeping dogs lie.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for activism. Just not at work.

Sending this could haunt you later in your career. If you ever need a recommendation the issue of carrying a gun at work will get blown out of proportion and can do no good for you. If you feel the uncontrllable urge to send educational letters about legal carry then send them to businesses that have 30.06 signs that infringe on your rights. You're picking a fight you can't win.

Carry concealed where legal and keep quiet about it.

Agree with others this is not a good career move, even if you have another job lined up. Don't burn bridges. This letter will burn bridges, or at least make many who read it consider whether to let you cross a bridge toward them again.

But if you simply MUST send it, please strongly consider NOT informing them of 30.06. Why ruin it for everyone else? Right now, it appears only you as an employee are barred from concealed carry and only with threat of employment termination, not with any legal consequences. Why draw their attention to this? Your argument with them is over them preventing your legal CC as a COMPANY POLICY. There is no need to bring up the legal arguments of legally preventing CC on their premises. If you really wanted to carry there, you could possibly do so legally (but at the risk of losing your job) as long as you haven't been verbally told no by someone with apparent authority. And, if you have been told verbally by someone with authority, then the conditions of 30.06 are met already and there is no need for you to bring up 30.06. Doesn't matter whether their written communication (sign or employee handbook) is 30.06 compliant if you've been verbally told no by someone with authority over the building.

Anyway, I'm running out to dinner or I could go on (I know, you're all SO SAD that I'm cutting myself off now ).

Do some thinking and soul searching before sending this.