To Campus Carry or Not To Carry - Thoughts?

[casp625]

At my private university right now and they have all the standard gun buster signs - haven't observed any 30.06 signs. However according to the campus trackers, my university has chosen to "opt out." The student handbook only states weapons are not allowed per state law and campus policy. This is last year's handbook so it may be updated before class start.

If nothing changes when classes start in a couple weeks, would you carry? With 3 classes costing $8,000 in tuition alone, getting expelled would be pretty expensive but I could still keep handgun stored in car, thoughts?

[KLB]

would you carry?

It's a personal decision, but I would not. I would prefer someone else take the financial and other risk of wrong-headed prosecution.

[jkurtz]

I haven't been to campus yet, so I don't know what signs have been, but that is something I have been considering as well. The school also hasn't released the new handbook either. Even if there are updates to the handbook, this will be my fourth year attending and I have yet to sign anything acknowledging that I have read the handbook. Ultimately it won't make too much of a difference. I only spend 9 hours a week on campus. The majority of my school time is spent doing clinical rotations.

[ELB]

This is how I would think about it: Is the risk of being caught without a handgun more or less than the risk of being caught with one?

Risk has two components: the likelihood or probability of an event happening, and the consequence(s) of that event.

The probability of needing to use a handgun might be very small, but the consequence of not having it might be very large - it could include death, or being the victim of some serious crime, or it could include witnessing death or other crime you could have prevented. Conversely, if you do have the handgun, then you have the chance to counter those consequences. Of course you could still fail at that, and even if successful in using the handgun to prevent very serious consequence, you may still suffer some legal and bureaucratic consequences (like being expelled). But you would be alive.

The probability of being discovered by the university authorities might be not as small, and the consequence might be not as large, but still serious - it could include being expelled and not finishing your studies (at that institution), may include legal difficulties, and would definitely include the self-knowledge that you are not obeying the university rules and the law.

I know which way I would jump on this, but you will have to figure it out yourself.

[Oldgringo]

When I was in college, we had guns in the dorms and later in the married students apartments. AFAIK, no one thought about actually carrying one on campus but we did carry them out to go hunting and shooting off campus. It was a kinder, gentler and cheaper world back then. {sigh}

[WTR]

When I was at A&M, it was not uncommon to find .22s, shotguns and a deer rifle( during season) when you opened up a closet in a dorm room. When I was permitted to have a vehicle on campus you would also find a pistol in the room. (I never traveled without a pistol.) We technically were to check out guns in with campus Police. No one did that I know. One young Officer bragged about taking the very nice weapons to the range.......nobody was going to check a gun after we heard that.

[Kenneth77]

Well i am getting to the point that i am so tired of seeing the sings and you cant carry here for this reason is just getting out of control , i would much rather take the chances of being caught by the collage commies that have no clue than be caught by someone trying to cause harm to me so to me i would carrying and carrying everywhere . I am not saying to obey the laws but it is hard to when you have went though what the state has deemed the right to carry and have your license then you are doing right no matter what some sings says but this is just me .Class C and $200 is better than dead !

[Papa_Tiger]

Well i am getting to the point that i am so tired of seeing the sings and you cant carry here for this reason is just getting out of control , i would much rather take the chances of being caught by the collage commies that have no clue than be caught by someone trying to cause harm to me so to me i would carrying and carrying everywhere . I am not saying to obey the laws but it is hard to when you have went though what the state has deemed the right to carry and have your license then you are doing right no matter what some sings says but this is just me .Class C and $200 is better than dead !

This is not just a Class C. Violating a 30.06 sign on a college campus building is a Class A:

An offense under Subsection (a), (a-1), (a-2), (a-3), (b), (c), (d), or (e) is a Class A misdemeanor

Subsections (a-2) and (a-3) specifically relate to campus carry.

[Kenneth77]

Well i am getting to the point that i am so tired of seeing the sings and you cant carry here for this reason is just getting out of control , i would much rather take the chances of being caught by the collage commies that have no clue than be caught by someone trying to cause harm to me so to me i would carrying and carrying everywhere . I am not saying to obey the laws but it is hard to when you have went though what the state has deemed the right to carry and have your license then you are doing right no matter what some sings says but this is just me .Class C and $200 is better than dead !

This is not just a Class C. Violating a 30.06 sign on a college campus building is a Class A:

An offense under Subsection (a), (a-1), (a-2), (a-3), (b), (c), (d), or (e) is a Class A misdemeanor

Subsections (a-2) and (a-3) specifically relate to campus carry.

Yeah it is but it should not be any different just because of the type of place it is , it is sad that there are laws that keep people from protecting their self.

[nightmare69]

At my private university right now and they have all the standard gun buster signs - haven't observed any 30.06 signs. However according to the campus trackers, my university has chosen to "opt out." The student handbook only states weapons are not allowed per state law and campus policy. This is last year's handbook so it may be updated before class start.

If nothing changes when classes start in a couple weeks, would you carry? With 3 classes costing $8,000 in tuition alone, getting expelled would be pretty expensive but I could still keep handgun stored in car, thoughts?

As a private universities police officer, I wouldn't recommend it. The least that could happen if caught is you would be expelled and possibly criminally trespassed from the property. The worst is you could be arrested for a class A.

I hope that campus carry goes great and more private universities adopt similar policies to public universities and allow students to carry self defense handguns. If not, I hope the legislature could step in and pass a law allowing it.

[oohrah]

I have to agree with nightmare69. My private university has only posted a few 30.06 so far, but they sent a broadcast email yesterday. It reminded everybody that they were prohibiting firearms in building, grounds, premises, etc. and signs would soon be going up. It ended with the posting of the 30.06 language in both english and spanish. They did reiterate the allowance of an LTC to keep their firearm locked in their vehicle on campus.

I don't know if this constitutes effective notice for students and faculty, but it certainly does not for the general public. So now, I won't carry, but until signs are up, any old joe can walk into my building legally CCing until the signs go up.

And yes, it is a Class A. It also means that not only are the buildings are off limits as before, but the grounds as well.

The good side for me, is that there is no longer the "participation in school sponsored activity" sanction. I do a lot of field trips, and now I can carry off campus, or keep it in my vehicle while transporting students, which I couldn't before.

[casp625]

This is how I would think about it: Is the risk of being caught without a handgun more or less than the risk of being caught with one?

Risk has two components: the likelihood or probability of an event happening, and the consequence(s) of that event.

The probability of needing to use a handgun might be very small, but the consequence of not having it might be very large - it could include death, or being the victim of some serious crime, or it could include witnessing death or other crime you could have prevented. Conversely, if you do have the handgun, then you have the chance to counter those consequences. Of course you could still fail at that, and even if successful in using the handgun to prevent very serious consequence, you may still suffer some legal and bureaucratic consequences (like being expelled). But you would be alive.

The probability of being discovered by the university authorities might be not as small, and the consequence might be not as large, but still serious - it could include being expelled and not finishing your studies (at that institution), may include legal difficulties, and would definitely include the self-knowledge that you are not obeying the university rules and the law.

I know which way I would jump on this, but you will have to figure it out yourself.

This is about where I am. Probably just going to leave it in the car.

[TexasTornado]

I have to agree with nightmare69. My private university has only posted a few 30.06 so far, but they sent a broadcast email yesterday. It reminded everybody that they were prohibiting firearms in building, grounds, premises, etc. and signs would soon be going up. It ended with the posting of the 30.06 language in both english and spanish. They did reiterate the allowance of an LTC to keep their firearm locked in their vehicle on campus.

I don't know if this constitutes effective notice for students and faculty, but it certainly does not for the general public. So now, I won't carry, but until signs are up, any old joe can walk into my building legally CCing until the signs go up.

And yes, it is a Class A. It also means that not only are the buildings are off limits as before, but the grounds as well.

The good side for me, is that there is no longer the "participation in school sponsored activity" sanction. I do a lot of field trips, and now I can carry off campus, or keep it in my vehicle while transporting students, which I couldn't before.

The only thing campus carry changes is buildings. The grounds, public sidewalks, parking lots etc. are no more off limits now than they ever were. Personally unless there's signage to make it a legal issue, I wouldn't sweat policy issues.

I've also been reconsidering what schools I will be applying to for my PhD program. SMU & Baylor were my top choices, but all of a sudden A&M and UNT are looking a lot more appealing.

No student should ever have to choose between their constitutionally granted rights & their education.

[Sport Coach]

Great info about Class C vs A. This week a coworker said something to a group about, "Now that open carry is allowed on campuses..." so I corrected him that it was not open carry and not in all areas, etc. I certainly would assess things as ELB, the risk to benefit of either decision. I was at Lone Star College when this discussion started and I anticipated I could have carried in some buildings but not others so the practical implications didn't make sense. If I would have been allowed to carry in all buildings I frequented I would have carried.

[ScottDLS]

This is how I would think about it: Is the risk of being caught without a handgun more or less than the risk of being caught with one?

Risk has two components: the likelihood or probability of an event happening, and the consequence(s) of that event.

The probability of needing to use a handgun might be very small, but the consequence of not having it might be very large - it could include death, or being the victim of some serious crime, or it could include witnessing death or other crime you could have prevented. Conversely, if you do have the handgun, then you have the chance to counter those consequences. Of course you could still fail at that, and even if successful in using the handgun to prevent very serious consequence, you may still suffer some legal and bureaucratic consequences (like being expelled). But you would be alive.

The probability of being discovered by the university authorities might be not as small, and the consequence might be not as large, but still serious - it could include being expelled and not finishing your studies (at that institution), may include legal difficulties, and would definitely include the self-knowledge that you are not obeying the university rules and the law.

I know which way I would jump on this, but you will have to figure it out yourself.

If they don't post 30.06 it would not include self knowledge that you're breaking the law, because you wouldn't be...