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Well, today I went to my local FFL and purchased a new shotgun. They put the usual form in front of me to fill out. Immediately I recognized it as a new form. I asked the employee when did you guys get these in? He said oh, they dropped them off a coupla months ago.
Anyway, going down the list and checking answers to the questions I was flabbergasted to get this question in so many words:

Are you purchasing this firearm with the intent to commit a felony?....uh....hmmmm. Of course I checked NO.

Incredible.

Anyway, thought you folks would be interested that new forms are out with the new questions.

dlh wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2023 12:50 pm Well, today I went to my local FFL and purchased a new shotgun. They put the usual form in front of me to fill out. Immediately I recognized it as a new form. I asked the employee when did you guys get these in? He said oh, they dropped them off a coupla months ago.
Anyway, going down the list and checking answers to the questions I was flabbergasted to get this question in so many words:

Are you purchasing this firearm with the intent to commit a felony?....uh....hmmmm. Of course I checked NO.

Incredible.

Anyway, thought you folks would be interested that new forms are out with the new questions.

What form did they give you? I just did a transfer and didn't see that question. The only change I know of is not having to answer the last two questions for aliens.

puma guy wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2023 6:34 pm

dlh wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2023 12:50 pm Well, today I went to my local FFL and purchased a new shotgun. They put the usual form in front of me to fill out. Immediately I recognized it as a new form. I asked the employee when did you guys get these in? He said oh, they dropped them off a coupla months ago.
Anyway, going down the list and checking answers to the questions I was flabbergasted to get this question in so many words:

Are you purchasing this firearm with the intent to commit a felony?....uh....hmmmm. Of course I checked NO.

Incredible.

Anyway, thought you folks would be interested that new forms are out with the new questions.

What form did they give you? I just did a transfer and didn't see that question. The only change I know of is not having to answer the last two questions for aliens.

I think it is the form described in this link:

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/atf-form-4 ... -revisions

Are they really that stupid? Or do they really think people planning on harming others are that stupid? And at this point do we really think they will do anything different than what they've been doing for decades and decide if and who they will prosecute if anyone based on the answers to the questions on this form?

C-dub wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2023 7:31 pm Are they really that stupid? Or do they really think people planning on harming others are that stupid? And at this point do we really think they will do anything different than what they've been doing for decades and decide if and who they will prosecute if anyone based on the answers to the questions on this form?

Yes, yes and no.

It's the new 4473 that went into effect 1 Apr. We get asked about the 2 new questions several times a day in the store I work at.

tk1700 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2023 8:38 pm It's the new 4473 that went into effect 1 Apr. We get asked about the 2 new questions several times a day in the store I work at.

April 1. How appropriate.......

dlh wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2023 12:50 pm Well, today I went to my local FFL and purchased a new shotgun. They put the usual form in front of me to fill out. Immediately I recognized it as a new form. I asked the employee when did you guys get these in? He said oh, they dropped them off a coupla months ago.
Anyway, going down the list and checking answers to the questions I was flabbergasted to get this question in so many words:

Are you purchasing this firearm with the intent to commit a felony?....uh....hmmmm. Of course I checked NO.

Incredible.

Anyway, thought you folks would be interested that new forms are out with the new questions.

goes right in line with our ding bat in austin house that authored a bill to make it a ..."CRIME ...TO BUY A FIREARM AND COMMIT A CRIME"

dlh wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2023 7:05 pm

puma guy wrote: ↑Thu Jun 15, 2023 6:34 pm

dlh wrote: ↑Wed Jun 14, 2023 12:50 pm Well, today I went to my local FFL and purchased a new shotgun. They put the usual form in front of me to fill out. Immediately I recognized it as a new form. I asked the employee when did you guys get these in? He said oh, they dropped them off a coupla months ago.
Anyway, going down the list and checking answers to the questions I was flabbergasted to get this question in so many words:

Are you purchasing this firearm with the intent to commit a felony?....uh....hmmmm. Of course I checked NO.

Incredible.

Anyway, thought you folks would be interested that new forms are out with the new questions.

What form did they give you? I just did a transfer and didn't see that question. The only change I know of is not having to answer the last two questions for aliens.

I think it is the form described in this link:

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/atf-form-4 ... -revisions

I should have asked my question differently. I was trying to ascertain if it was something different than a Form 4473 that's been around since I was selling guns in 1968.

goes right in line with our ding bat in austin house that authored a bill to make it a ..."CRIME ...TO BUY A FIREARM AND COMMIT A CRIME"

Speaking of stupid redundancy.......the federal government publishes a document known as the "MUTCD" which is the "Manual for Uniform Traffic Control Devices." It provides highly detailed specs that are used all over the USA. It details how big signs should be, their color, their placement, striping data, signal lights, school zones.....you get the picture.

This is why you can drive all over the USA and the TCD will have a consistent look, color, and placement.

But I swear (can't be 100% sure) that TexDOT has decided to add a useless sign to our state's mix, to wit:

"State Law - Observe All Warning Signs."

I have always thought that if the state posts a sign, you obviously have to obey it. Why does TexDOT feel that they have to state the obvious? SMH.

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How about another example of redundancy? I'm not sure if this is Texas practice, or some other state's charging practices, but here goes:

A person commits a crime with a gun, such as "aggravated assault", then catches an additional charge of "using a firearm while committing a felony".
It seems like a useless add-on charge.

SIA

surprise_i'm_armed wrote: ↑Tue Jun 20, 2023 1:53 pmBut I swear (can't be 100% sure) that TexDOT has decided to add a useless sign to our state's mix, to wit:

"State Law - Observe All Warning Signs."

I have always thought that if the state posts a sign, you obviously have to obey it. Why does TexDOT feel that they have to state the obvious? SMH.

This one is not really a redundancy or waste of time. The trick is to know what it really means instead of what it says. Not all warning signs are posted by the government and this lets you know which you need to obey.

Texas has a law that allows road construction crews to post temporary signs, in black lettering on an orange background, to control traffic in a construction zone. You might have seen these as temporary speed limits or lane closures, etc. Since these are posted by a company and not a government, there is no law backing them up and you don't really have to obey them. To give them some force, the legislature decided to add that if there is a proper warning posted, then they must be obeyed. The orange obey all warning signs is the sign the company must post to make their temporary signs enforceable by the police.

Another example of this is that 99% of the traffic laws do not apply while on private property. You can generally ignore the stop signs and lane direction markers in parking lots for example. Some cities use their authority to enact an ordinance that adopts these laws and makes them applicable in parking lots. To do this, they need to post a sign that state laws apply due to the ordinance (I don't remember the exact wording of the law, but if you shop at the Forum at 1604 and IH-35 in San Antonio, you will see the signs for the portion that is in either Selma or Schertz - I never paid attention to which city it was). So we have signs saying to obey state laws too.

Well, you have enlightened me regarding these signs.

Although I'm generally up on signage policies, I did not realize that the construction companies are the ones that post the orange warning signs.

So I'm sure that the majority of drivers do not realize the difference either.

SIA