Carry in the car question

[twomarks]

I've read the statute and my question stems from how "plain view" is defined. I'd rather not keep my revolver in my pocket holster as I don't want to have to dig it out of my pocket if the need arrises. Can I keep it in a holster and place it in between the driver's seat and console close to my hip?

If I were to be stopped for a traffic violation, it would be difficult for an officer to see it without leaning his head into the car - which I doubt happens.

Thanks in advance,

twomarks

[seamusTX]

IMHO, if any part of the weapon can be seen from outside the vehicle, no matter what contortion is required to do so, it may be considered in plain view.

- Jim

[45 4 life]

seamusTX,
I posed that question to a current LEO friend of mine. His recomendations was to put it between the seat and console, and cover it with a towel or jacket. As long as something must be removed to see the weapon, you should be fine.

My suggestion is get rid of the pocket pistol and carry something in a OWB or shoulder rig.

[seamusTX]

Again iMHO, it is risky to carry a handgun on your person in a vehicle if you do not have a CHL. It is legal to have it in the vehicle, but if you step out, you are committing a crime. You might not have time to disarm in an emergency.

- Jim

[twomarks]

Thanks everyone.

I am a CHL holder so no problems with that side of things.

Also, I prefer to carry a 1911, but with the weather in Houston the way it is, it's near impossible to carry that kind of weapon without a jacket for cover. I'm in a suit all day for work so a S&W Airweight 340 PD is my choice when in business attire.

When I'm out and can have a shirt untucked, I'm carrying the heavier caliber.

thanks again,

twomarks

[Crossfire]

If you have a CHL, you can carry in the car with no restriction to keep it out of plain view. "Not in plain view" only applies to carrying under the "Motorist Protection Act", AKA HB 1815.

That said, I usually have my firearm tucked between the seat and center console, and maybe another in the driver side door pocket.

[DoubleJ]

If you have a CHL, you can carry in the car with no restriction to keep it out of plain view. "Not in plain view" only applies to carrying under the "Motorist Protection Act", AKA HB 1815.

That said, I usually have my firearm tucked between the seat and center console, and maybe another in the driver side door pocket.

Really? just anywhere in the cab, eh? nice.

[seamusTX]

If you have a CHL, you can carry in the car with no restriction to keep it out of plain view. "Not in plain view" only applies to carrying under the "Motorist Protection Act", AKA HB 1815.

Are you saying that PC §46.035(a) does not apply to someone in a vehicle?

- Jim

[Crossfire]

I have been told, by DPS, that in the car is not considered "in plain view". Now all these things, as always, are subject to interpretation by you, the LEO on the side of the road, and the judge and jury.

But... I clearly remember from my very first instructor school (way back in, uh, well, awhile ago) that car carry was considered concealed by the vehicle (not discernable to casual observation). And we were told that it was legal to just lay it on the seat beside you (although not recommended due to lack of security in case of accident).

I am always open to other experiences. It would not be the first time that instructors heard things differently from DPS.

[Greybeard]

Quote: "It would not be the first time that instructors heard things differently from DPS."

You can say that again.

[D.R.T.]

so it is legal for a non CHL to carry a loaded firearm in the car, as long as they do not carry it on their person outside of that vehicle...correct?

The reason I ask for clarification is this...my wife is signed up for a chl class but has not received her license yet. I do have my license. I really want her to be protected when she is out by herself or with the kids. So with the new Texas law is she able to have a gun in the car? within reach? loaded etc? even if she does not qualify as "traveling"?

Thanks for any input you guys can share. Later!

[seamusTX]

so it is legal for a non CHL to carry a loaded firearm in the car, as long as they do not carry it on their person outside of that vehicle...correct?

Up to a point. Here's the relevant citation:

PC §46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun, illegal knife, or club if the person is not:
(2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control.
(a-1) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun in a motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control at any time in which:
(1) the handgun is in plain view; or
(2) the person is:
(A) engaged in criminal activity, other than a Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance regulating traffic;
(B) prohibited by law from possessing a firearm; or
(C) a member of a criminal street gang, as defined by Section 71.01.

The law does not distinguish loaded versus unloaded.

Not every police officer understands this recent update to the law.

- Jim

[srothstein]

I have been told, by DPS, that in the car is not considered "in plain view". Now all these things, as always, are subject to interpretation by you, the LEO on the side of the road, and the judge and jury.

I would say they either never worked patrol or have forgotten how many cases they have made by walking up to a car and seeing something in it and claiming the "plain view" exception to a search warrant requirement.

When I read that the weapon cannot be in plain view, I take the court view of the term for search warrants. If I am where I have a legal right to be (in this case anywhere outside the car) and I can see any part of the object AND can immediately recognize it for what it is (illegal for the plain view exception, a firearm for this discussion), then the weapon is in plain view.

So, if I can see the grip and can recognize it as a firearm grip, the weapon is in plain view. If it is covered in any way, even if I can make out the outline (printing), the weapon is not in plain view (but I might be able to make the case other ways still).

This is juts the definition i use and teach to other officers, whose personal interpretations may differ.

[Crossfire]

That sounds like a reasonable explanation to me. I'll go with that!

[rdcrags]

"So, if I can see the grip and can recognize it as a firearm grip, the weapon is in plain view."

My airlite snubbie, when not in a pocket holster when in public, is always in the car door pocket when driving. So, my butt has been showing since 1999. Glad you haven’t noticed it.

Ralph