One in the pipe?

[Lodge2004]

Completely understand your concern, had the same ones myself. Study, practice and taking classes allowed me "move on" over time.

I grew up in on ranges that absolutely would not allow a round in the chamber unless you were firing at a target. Even during my time on active duty, we were taught to never carry a round under the firing pin. After getting my CHL, I had 20+ years of prior training to overcome. My first handgun was a S&W 908 because it had a manual safety. Initially I carried it without a round in the chamber, then with a round but with the safety on and finally with the safety off. It was a fairly rapid progression but it did allow me to get past old/bad habits. By the time I switched to my Glock 19, I was completely comfortable and now can't imagine carrying a firearm that is not ready for immediate use.

Carry every day if possible. Get professional training. Read, practice, watch DVD's, participate in this forum, learn as much as you can. As your knowledge level and self confidence increase, so will your comfort level.

[The Annoyed Man]

2 Cleaning: Inspect the gun carefully be fore cleaning.Make absolutely sure the gun is completely unloaded before disasembly Glocks are particularly worth noting because the trigger must be pulled to disassemble the gun.

That may be true for some models, or for earlier generation pistols, but my wife's third generation G19 does not require pulling the trigger to take down the pistol. I've done it myself a hundred times now - just for practice - and I am confident in stating that it absolutely does not require pulling the trigger to take it down. The slide is retracted about a 1/4", and the two takedown buttons on either side of the side of the frame above the trigger, are pulled downward, releasing the slide/barrel assembly to slide forward off the frame. At no point does your finger have to go anywhere near the trigger.

In any case, your recommendation to make sure the gun is unloaded before cleaning would obviate any safety issues with regard to any pistol, so it's a good practice. I do that with all my pistols before cleaning, regardless of what they are.

Here is an illustrated guide to field stripping a Glock.

[bdickens]

If you don't have a round in the chamber, the gun isn't loaded. If the gun isn't loaded, it is just a very short club.

[Liberty]

2 Cleaning: Inspect the gun carefully be fore cleaning.Make absolutely sure the gun is completely unloaded before disasembly Glocks are particularly worth noting because the trigger must be pulled to disassemble the gun.

That may be true for some models, or for earlier generation pistols, but my wife's third generation G19 does not require pulling the trigger to take down the pistol. I've done it myself a hundred times now - just for practice - and I am confident in stating that it absolutely does not require pulling the trigger to take it down. The slide is retracted about a 1/4", and the two takedown buttons on either side of the side of the frame above the trigger, are pulled downward, releasing the slide/barrel assembly to slide forward off the frame. At no point does your finger have to go anywhere near the trigger.

In any case, your recommendation to make sure the gun is unloaded before cleaning would obviate any safety issues with regard to any pistol, so it's a good practice. I do that with all my pistols before cleaning, regardless of what they are.

Here is an illustrated guide to field stripping a Glock.

I was not aware they had actually fixed that problem. The instructions you posted though state in step 2 that one should pull the trigger.

[Oldgringo]

2 Cleaning: Inspect the gun carefully be fore cleaning.Make absolutely sure the gun is completely unloaded before disasembly Glocks are particularly worth noting because the trigger must be pulled to disassemble the gun.

That may be true for some models, or for earlier generation pistols, but my wife's third generation G19 does not require pulling the trigger to take down the pistol. I've done it myself a hundred times now - just for practice - and I am confident in stating that it absolutely does not require pulling the trigger to take it down. The slide is retracted about a 1/4", and the two takedown buttons on either side of the side of the frame above the trigger, are pulled downward, releasing the slide/barrel assembly to slide forward off the frame. At no point does your finger have to go anywhere near the trigger.

In any case, your recommendation to make sure the gun is unloaded before cleaning would obviate any safety issues with regard to any pistol, so it's a good practice. I do that with all my pistols before cleaning, regardless of what they are.

Here is an illustrated guide to field stripping a Glock.

I was not aware they had actually fixed that problem. The instructions you posted though state in step 2 that one should pull the trigger.

Hey AM,

You reckon Mrs. AM's gun got broke somehow?

[ninemm]

My G19 has slide rails so it is a third generation model. I have to pull the trigger to disassemble. There's no way otherwise.

[MTICop]

I carry condition 1 with my 1911 as this is my primary carry gun. However, I have both a Glock 19 (relax LT, it's for the GSSF competitions) and an SA XDm. Both are striker fire pistols. If/when I have to carry one of these I will carry with one in the pipe. Your finger and brain are the safeties on these guns. I am a firm believer in using whatever safeties that comes with your particular gun but you must remember that mechanical safeties can and will fail so, while they should be used at all times, they are not what makes the guns safe. The handler of the gun is what makes it safe. Trust your instincts and practice drawing, presenting and firing as much as possible and you may be able to overcome this "fear", if you want to call it that.

This is my opinion and, like someone stated earlier, it's ultimately your decision so take all this for what it's worth to you.

[Oldgringo]

I carry condition 1 with my 1911 as this is my primary carry gun. However, I have both a Glock 19 (relax LT, it's for the GSSF competitions) and an SA XDm. Both are striker fire pistols. If/when I have to carry one of these I will carry with one in the pipe. Your finger and brain are the safeties on these guns. I am a firm believer in using whatever safeties that comes with your particular gun but you must remember that mechanical safeties can and will fail so, while they should be used at all times, they are not what makes the guns safe. The handler of the gun is what makes it safe. Trust your instincts and practice drawing, presenting and firing as much as possible and you may be able to overcome this "fear", if you want to call it that.

This is my opinion and, like someone stated earlier, it's ultimately your decision so take all this for what it's worth to you.

Good advice. I would add - also practice holstering with your finger off of the trigger.

[hheremtp]

I I am a firm believer in using whatever safeties that comes with your particular gun but you must remember that mechanical safeties can and will fail so, while they should be used at all times, they are not what makes the guns safe. The handler of the gun is what makes it safe.

+1 for MTICop, he hit the nail squarly on the head with that one.

[The Annoyed Man]

2 Cleaning: Inspect the gun carefully be fore cleaning.Make absolutely sure the gun is completely unloaded before disasembly Glocks are particularly worth noting because the trigger must be pulled to disassemble the gun.

That may be true for some models, or for earlier generation pistols, but my wife's third generation G19 does not require pulling the trigger to take down the pistol. I've done it myself a hundred times now - just for practice - and I am confident in stating that it absolutely does not require pulling the trigger to take it down. The slide is retracted about a 1/4", and the two takedown buttons on either side of the side of the frame above the trigger, are pulled downward, releasing the slide/barrel assembly to slide forward off the frame. At no point does your finger have to go anywhere near the trigger.

In any case, your recommendation to make sure the gun is unloaded before cleaning would obviate any safety issues with regard to any pistol, so it's a good practice. I do that with all my pistols before cleaning, regardless of what they are.

Here is an illustrated guide to field stripping a Glock.

I was not aware they had actually fixed that problem. The instructions you posted though state in step 2 that one should pull the trigger.

Hey AM,

You reckon Mrs. AM's gun got broke somehow?

Hahahaha! I shared some PMs with Excaliber about it, and here's what I just replied to him. May Tijuana donkeys eat the man who says that The Annoyed Man won't admit when he's wrong. Here's what I just PM'd back to him:

I finally went back and re-read the instructions, and compared them to my experience. . . . .

OK, so I'm a mook.

Ever since we bought this pistol, whenever I have field stripped it, I have removed the magazine, racked the slide twice to ensure ejection of anything in the chamber, locked the slide back and checked the chamber both visually, and with the tip of my pinky finger, released the slide into battery, and then de-cocked the striker by pulling the trigger.

For me, that was simply part of the safety drill, which I would do with any semi-automatic pistol, and then I would go on to field strip the pistol. I never associated the above in my mind as being part of the required field stripping drill for a Glock, because I would have done exactly the same for one of my 1911s or my USPc. Of course the striker had been cocked, and then released by pulling the trigger, which for me was simple safety, but it never crossed my mind that I could not have taken the pistol down if I hadn't done it. And reading what others had posted, it sounded to me like they had to simultaneously pull the trigger, pull down the takedown buttons, AND move the slide forward off the frame. It made no sense to me at all.



I guess I need to go back to that thread and acknowledge my mortal imperfections.

There you have it. It's a good thing I've just discovered I'm not perfect. I was about to go outside and try walking on water. . . .

[NcongruNt]

You drop the hammer on a 1911 to field strip it? Why? And beyond that, how?

From what I can tell, the slide has to travel rearward to remove the slide lock lever, and would re-cock the hammer anyway - at least partially. I'd sooner leave the thing be than have it moving against the slide and firing pin strike area during disassembly.

Aside from the bushing, field stripping a 1911 appears to use the same procedure as the Hi-Power, which I've done many many times. I've never dropped the hammer, and certainly don't see why there would be a need to. It seems to me that introducing an unnecessary step like dropping the hammer invites more variables for unintended consequences, not less.

Oh, and back on topic...

I am in agreement with pretty much everyone else. The issue is your confidence in yourself and your weapon. It is not going to fire unless you pull the trigger. Perhaps some range time would be all you need to build the necessary confidence.

I recall something told to me by (I believe) Lawdog ( http://thelawdogfiles.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ), though I may have the source wrong. Anyhow, he decided he'd test the integrity of his 1911 and see what it really took for it to drop the hammer without a finger pulling the trigger. He took his (unloaded, but cocked and locked) 1911, and threw it in the dryer with a load of towels, letting it go for the entire load. At the end, he took out the gun and inspected it. The safety had flicked off sometime during the cycle, but the hammer had never fallen.

The point of the story here is that you need make the deliberate action of putting your finger on the trigger and pulling it for the gun to fire. The towel story aside, if you carry in a holster and maintain proper control of mind and actions, you should not worry about your gun "accidentally" going off. It doesn't happen that way. Follow the 4 rules, and you and those around you will be safe from AD/ND accidents.

[Liberty]

I recall something told to me by (I believe) Lawdog ( http://thelawdogfiles.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ), though I may have the source wrong. Anyhow, he decided he'd test the integrity of his 1911 and see what it really took for it to drop the hammer without a finger pulling the trigger. He took his (unloaded, but cocked and locked) 1911, and threw it in the dryer with a load of towels, letting it go for the entire load. At the end, he took out the gun and inspected it. The safety had flicked off sometime during the cycle, but the hammer had never fallen.

The point of the story here is that you need make the deliberate action of putting your finger on the trigger and pulling it for the gun to fire. The towel story aside, if you carry in a holster and maintain proper control of mind and actions, you should not worry about your gun "accidentally" going off. It doesn't happen that way. Follow the 4 rules, and you and those around you will be safe from AD/ND accidents.

A sidepoint point is that manual safeties get knocked off, and need to be checked.

[camjr]

A Glock with a round in the chamber is no different than a double action revolver. Both go bang if you press the trigger. Of course, the trigger pull on a Glock is usually less than a wheelgun, but you get the point.

One of the reasons I like my XD over a Glock is the grip safety. No manual safeties to manipulate in order to fire the pistol, but, as least for me, that grip safety is very reassuring (knowing it must be activated by a proper grip along along with the trigger safety when pressing the trigger). I also love my little 642 snubbie in a pocket holster. As others have said, I'm entirely comfortable as long as the trigger is covered by a proper holster (pocket or hip).

Cheers

[The Annoyed Man]

You drop the hammer on a 1911 to field strip it? Why? And beyond that, how?

It's a habit, and I think you might have misunderstood me.

I rack the slide, visually and by feel confirm and empty chamber, and then I point the gun in a safe direction and drop the hammer. It's just a habit I have, and it makes a third confirmation (after visual and tactile examination) that the chamber is empty. Others may do it differently, and that's fine for them. I like to do it this way, and it is just part of my pre-takedown safety procedure. But I'm not saying that dropping the hammer is necessary to taking down a 1911. It isn't.

[The Annoyed Man]

I recall something told to me by (I believe) Lawdog ( http://thelawdogfiles.blogspot.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ), though I may have the source wrong. Anyhow, he decided he'd test the integrity of his 1911 and see what it really took for it to drop the hammer without a finger pulling the trigger. He took his (unloaded, but cocked and locked) 1911, and threw it in the dryer with a load of towels, letting it go for the entire load. At the end, he took out the gun and inspected it. The safety had flicked off sometime during the cycle, but the hammer had never fallen.

The point of the story here is that you need make the deliberate action of putting your finger on the trigger and pulling it for the gun to fire. The towel story aside, if you carry in a holster and maintain proper control of mind and actions, you should not worry about your gun "accidentally" going off. It doesn't happen that way. Follow the 4 rules, and you and those around you will be safe from AD/ND accidents.

A sidepoint point is that manual safeties get knocked off, and need to be checked.

On a number of occasions, I have unholstered my 1911 at the end of the day and found that the thumb safety had been switched off. I didn't worry about it since the grip safety still has to be depressed AND the trigger pulled to fire the pistol. Since the holster covers the trigger, it can't be pulled after holstering; and since the safety is on when holstering/re-holstering, the hammer can't drop anyway.