Utah or Texas ? Or.....Both ?

[baldeagle]

$215.25 for a Utah CWP only class? Jeez. Let's see. If the instructor collects the license fee Utah ($65?) and bundles range fees with a rental gun and ammo, eye protection and hearing protection ($40), then he's charging $110.25 for his training. You can take the Texas CHL for as little as $50 - http://www.cityofterrell.org/handgun.htm#class" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (but you supply gun, ammo, eye and hearing protection) and all over the place for around $100 to $140 - http://chltraining.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - http://www.chl-tx.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - http://safegunacademy.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (and they supply everything you need). You get 4 more hours of instruction plus fingerprints for less than half what this guy is charging.

I'd call that a ripoff, plain and simple.

Note: the above are examples, not recommendations. I took the class from Captain McKeown in Terrel, but there are may ethical and qualified instructors in the area - some of whom are active in this forum.

[Cooper]

$215.25 for a Utah CWP only class? Jeez. Let's see. If the instructor collects the license fee Utah ($65?) and bundles range fees with a rental gun and ammo, eye protection and hearing protection ($40), then he's charging $110.25 for his training. You can take the Texas CHL for as little as $50 - http://www.cityofterrell.org/handgun.htm#class" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (but you supply gun, ammo, eye and hearing protection) and all over the place for around $100 to $140 - http://chltraining.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - http://www.chl-tx.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - http://safegunacademy.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (and they supply everything you need). You get 4 more hours of instruction plus fingerprints for less than half what this guy is charging.

I'd call that a ripoff, plain and simple.

Note: the above are examples, not recommendations. I took the class from Captain McKeown in Terrel, but there are may ethical and qualified instructors in the area - some of whom are active in this forum.

Your right, It is a rippff ! But , if he doesnt refund my money , then I probably deserve that for not looking into it more than I should have. At least I didnt pay the full amount....

[Cooper]

[thread drift]
Does he still have the Martin?
[/thread drift][/quote]



I dont know ... He hasnt returned my call yet. If he doesnt , Knowing him he has something else like it or better. He is a good guitar player who has a good taste in guitars.

[Mel]

$215.25 for a Utah CWP only class? Jeez. Let's see. If the instructor collects the license fee Utah ($65?) and bundles range fees with a rental gun and ammo, eye protection and hearing protection ($40), then he's charging $110.25 for his training.

Actually it sounds to my like he's getting it all. There are NO range fees, rental gun, ammo, eye protection, hearing protection because the Utah license doesn't require any shooting.

[Significant Otter]

Since the Utah only instructors are not, AFAIK, required to follow any Texas guidelines in their teaching. You may just be digging yourself a legal hole for the state of Texas to bury you in if, God forbid, you should ever have to actually use your weapon, and you wind up using outside of the guidelines of Texas law because you were never properly instructed.

On the other hand, there seem to be a lot of people who take the Texas class from an official instructor and don't know the Texas law any better than someone who took the Utah class and skimmed the LS16 document from Texas DPS.

[The Annoyed Man]

Thanks guys ,for all yor replys ! Im going to go through an instructor I know, and sold a Martin guitar to years ago , that I , at the time didnt know was an instuctor. His name is Larry Bartek, who is a plano police officer and SWAT member. and one heck of a guy. He also teaches 15 miles from my house.
Im only going for my TX CHL . As most of you have said , "Thats what I should have " .

Thanks again , Coop

I know Larry Bartek. A friend of mine either just took, or is about to take his class. They were partners on a deer lease together. In fact, I spent one very cold January morning in one of Bartek's blinds as a guest of my friend. I met Bartek once at a DPC meet. He seems like a pretty decent guy. I didn't know I had guitar-playing in common with him though.

[The Annoyed Man]

Since the Utah only instructors are not, AFAIK, required to follow any Texas guidelines in their teaching. You may just be digging yourself a legal hole for the state of Texas to bury you in if, God forbid, you should ever have to actually use your weapon, and you wind up using outside of the guidelines of Texas law because you were never properly instructed.

On the other hand, there seem to be a lot of people who take the Texas class from an official instructor and don't know the Texas law any better than someone who took the Utah class and skimmed the LS16 document from Texas DPS.

That's true, there are. When I took my class, I conscientiously read through the material, took notes in class, and studied the handbook... ...and I still learned most of what I know since I joined this forum 2-1/2 years ago. It can be an overwhelming amount of information, and, it can be confusing. How many of us, for instance, were confused at first about whether or not CHL was permitted inside a house of worship? I was. It takes some time to truly assimilate and memorize all the variables of the law. But, with a licensed CHL instructor, you at least get someone who is to A) required make a good faith attempt to teach it all to you; B) required to teach it to you in the order and manner prescribed by the state; and C) required to make certain that you are at least minimally proficient - and safe - with a firearm. You may not be getting any of that from a CFP only instructor. Maybe, but probably not.

How many of the CFP only instructors spend any time on the required conflict resolution and deescalation section? That is important stuff. One of the most damaging things that can happen to the RKBA in Texas would be to have a bunch of hotheads running around who resort to guns first and words last to settle their differences. At least a CHL course makes some concession to teaching a proper way to resolve conflict. CFP, to the best of my knowledge, doesn't require that.

[tacticool]

There may be reasons to revoke reciprocity with Utah completely, but there's no good reason to discriminate based on state of residency.

[joe817]

To answer the question of the topic of this thread: For me, when anxiously awaiting my class, then waiting on the CHL itself I got caught up in the mindset "wouldn't it be neat to have not only a Texas CHL but also a Florida, Utah, and Pennsylvania carry permit? Then I'd be covered just about anywhere I traveled"....about.

Then I got to thinking, where in the world would I go where a Texas CHL is not honored? I didn't have to think hard, because I can count on one hand the states I've been to since 1980. All of our vacationing is done in the 5 state area, and primarily 2 states: OK & LA. So for me(like Beriuty), my Texas CHL is the only one I need and want...and have.

[tomc]

Larry is a good friend of mine and an excellent instructor. You will not regret taking the class from Larry. Larry and Crossfire are two of the best instructors in the business and I highly recommend either.

[Cooper]

Larry is a good friend of mine and an excellent instructor. You will not regret taking the class from Larry. Larry and Crossfire are two of the best instructors in the business and I highly recommend either.

I hope he calls me sometime soon , because I know his classes are limited and only once a month.

[Cooper]

Larry is a good friend of mine and an excellent instructor. You will not regret taking the class from Larry. Larry and Crossfire are two of the best instructors in the business and I highly recommend either.

He called me and and now im setup for the class on the 6th of July. Im glad im getting my CHL through him . He is a great guy .

[Cooper]

I would like everyone to know that I got my money back from Larry Bockman , and he was very nice about it.

[Purplehood]

I would like everyone to know that I got my money back from Larry Bockman , and he was very nice about it.

I must extend Kudos to Larry on your behalf.

[03Lightningrocks]

Funny thing.... it seems to me that the posts we make concerning concealed carry should have something to do with what a crock of doo it is that we need the governments permision to exercise a right garunteed us by the constitution of the United States. But nope.... we get wrapped up in which Government entity provides this permission.... which I should not have to ask for in the first place...... BY GAWD!

Just a personal observation. No offense meant to any of ya'll who feel the RKBA should come with qualifications and testing only. It just tickles the American side of me at times.

PS... sounds like Larry B. turned out to be a stand up guy after all. glad it worked out for you.