CONVERSATION WITH LIBERAL BUDDY ON CHL

[cbucher]

My buddy over in California who I served with

With this comment I would assume you are speaking of military or law enforcement. I guess I just don't understand how someone with a background in either cannot at least appreciate the right of someone to choose to protect themselves. In most cities or nations, however you choose to look at it, citizens outnumber police and military by thousands to one. This is putting a heavy burden on those that choose to serve and protect. In the Dallas area alone there are several hundred thousand people living here. The police dept. (last I heard) employed around 3500. Of those there are only 700 to 800 on duty a any given time. Given these kinds of numbers I don't understand the opposition to someone who can legally own a firearm and carry a firearm doing so. The police and military simply cannot be everywhere all the time. Some of the 5-7 minute response times are longer in some areas. At one time my wife and I lived in Decatur Tx. and the response time was 20 minutes or longer for sheriff or ambulance. I don't blame your friend for choosing to not protect himself, but please don't think ill of us that choose the other side. I have had the same discussion with alot of my friends and some we just have to agree to disagree, but I will still try to protect them if they are with me and the need come up.

[Dragonfighter]

<SNIP>
I'm not much on back handing my wife though... I'm fond of keeping All of my parts attached, and she knows where I sleep and where we keep the good knives.

Edit: Edited because on second thought I felt I might be getting close to rules violations.

Your wife may know where the good knives are but mine carries AND is a good shot.

[chasfm11]

Slowplay makes an excellent point. There is a significant difference between a "leftist" and what is referred to as a "classical liberal" in the Locke-ian mold. There is a similar difference between a conservative and a "right winger." If we use the classical definition, then a self-identified conservative is a John Locke liberal, and therefore has much in common with some self-identified liberals. I have been guilty of carelessness in terminology myself, but let me make it clear that in my thinking, a hard core leftist is one who espouses class warfare and socialism and a fundamental remaking of America into something the founders never intended. As such they are no better than either National Socialists or Communists. I am not naive enough to think that describes the majority of self-identified liberals. Neither am I naive enough to think that their favored policies are correct. That is why we have politics.

The problem with any terminology is in trying to apply it to a diverse group of people. There are people who some would could be classified as Liberals who favor Communism and class warfare. There are others that I classify as Liberals because they are Statists and believe that the government is the answer to everything. This is the opposite of what I believe to be a Conservative position that the government has a limited role in our lives. Some of the Statists are not advocates of class warfare.

I'm smiling. I remember one of my high school teachers asking me if I was a Communist. I didn't answer but asked him why he thought to ask me the question. He had heard from one of my classmates that I was. What he didn't hear was that my classmate's view of the world was that anyone who didn't support Barry Goldwater was a Communist. It would have been funny if the teacher hadn't used the power of his position to attempt to publicly humiliate me afterward.

I've always believed what I label the Conservative approach but labels tend to get applied by where someone else's position is relative to yours. There are people who call themselves Conservatives (some of them Evangelicals) who, for whatever reason, are anti-RKBA. It is only on this forum where I've found people who identified themselves as Liberals and supported RKBA. It makes it really difficult to make distinctions among groups when positions shift from topic to topic. I consider myself relatively environmentally conscious but there is no way that I'm going where PETA and some of the environmental loons go. You'll pry my cold dead fingers off my leaf blower before I give it up.

[glbedd53]

Nothin wrong with leaf blowers , as long as they're electric.

[nyj]

I got into a heated debate with who I consider the most ignorant woman on this planet when it comes to guns. It basically ended with me telling her "I hope you never get put into a situation where you are a fish in a bucket to a gunman," explaining how a classroom only has one entrance/exit, her response was "well, I'll never put myself in that situation." I laughed and said, "so that was your excuse for not going to college?"

[warhorse10_9]

LoL @ Veggie. Eloquent :)

Angelo State University, thats where all the is at. And if that isn't bad enough, teaches a class on campus on how to people. All the booze makes a daily occurence, so imagine if they had guns instead of just fists! I hope your because i'm no ...I the constitution, and it plainly says that guns kill people... that whole "bear arms" thing is a huge misinterpretation. It was referring to the animal's arms. The right to keep Bears' arms to hang on our wall... too bad PETA doesn't like us to enlighten folks on that.

Don't you mean: a "hug" misinterpretation.

I couldn't resist.

[Jasonw560]

I got into a heated debate with who I consider the most ignorant woman on this planet when it comes to guns. It basically ended with me telling her "I hope you never get put into a situation where you are a fish in a bucket to a gunman," explaining how a classroom only has one entrance/exit, her response was "well, I'll never put myself in that situation." I laughed and said, "so that was your excuse for not going to college?"

Wow...she can control other people's actions? I will do everything in my power to not get into a car wreck, but I can't control what someone else does while driving.

[Apophis]

All this discussion on liberals and conservatives. Where does libertarian tend to fall into place here? We seem to be hated by both.

[clarionite]

All this discussion on liberals and conservatives. Where does libertarian tend to fall into place here? We seem to be hated by both.

Fence straddler....

[kjolly]

I used to be an anarchist but they had too many rules.
To keep and bear arms.

Keep means you own the gun and not limited to which days of the week you can pocess it!
To bear means to carry. It's simple.

[fulano]

I got into a heated debate with who I consider the most ignorant woman on this planet when it comes to guns. It basically ended with me telling her "I hope you never get put into a situation where you are a fish in a bucket to a gunman," explaining how a classroom only has one entrance/exit, her response was "well, I'll never put myself in that situation." I laughed and said, "so that was your excuse for not going to college?"

This link has been posted many times but its still the best example of an ignorant woman...IMFMO
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[VMI77]

I have a reformed buddy who always questioned the need for guns, the last conversation before he purchased his first gun was about 2 days after he had his first daughter.

Non Gun Buddy: I can't see having guns in the house, especially now that I have kids.

Steveincowtown: Really...what is the average response time of the police in (his town).

Non Gun Buddy: Oh, pretty decent. I think they say like 5 minutes or something.

Steveincowtown: Well that seems like a long time to watch a bad guy attack your wife and daughter before the cops get there.

He bought a gun 2 days later and then I took him to the gun show to get a safe that weekend.

One big problem with this --and I doubt the 5 minute average, the national average is something more like 10 minutes-- is that is assumes you're able to call the police in the first place. The assumption that in every situation you're going to be able to get a call out to the police is a very big assumption.