17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

[Oldgringo]

This thread is goin' on 60 pages. If nothing else, we should have learned that shootin' somebody, whether they needed it or not, is gonna' draw a lot of attention and cost a lot of $$$$$. Choose your targets and placement well.

Anybody catchin' any fish and where?

[Originalist]

This thread is goin' on 60 pages. If nothing else, we should have learned that shootin' somebody, whether they needed it or not, is gonna' draw a lot of attention and cost a lot of $$$$$. Choose your targets and placement well.

Anybody catchin' any fish and where?

but would like to add that this is a prime example of where a good shoot could be percieved as a bad shoot given your actions and mistruths presented by the media and spokesmen on certain other peoples behalf.

[FishInTx]

Zimmerman is trying to get bodyguard protection to help him from getting shot, by the people that have been so upset about somebody getting shot. How may death threats has George gotten so far? I hope he lives long enough to see his whole trial. Even if found innocent somebody will try and get him. He'll never have a normal life He'll go into hiding......Bahamas,peru, rio de janero

[Beiruty]

Zimmerman is trying to get bodyguard protection to help him from getting shot, by the people that have been so upset about somebody getting shot. How may death threats has George gotten so far? I hope he lives long enough to see his whole trial. Even if found innocent somebody will try and get him. He'll never have a normal life He'll go into hiding......Bahamas,peru, rio de janero

If killed by a mob, I would expect "actions" being taken by other side of the extreme. Not good!

[mamabearCali]

If he is killed by a mob, then I imagine the actions taken by the other end of the extreme will be to add a bug and an extra magazine to their carry repertoire. Gun owners as a whole are law abiding people even in the most trying of circumstances. Not that everyone one either side fits into this category, but it is the difference between the tea party rallies and the people protesting the world bank. Those who think Zimmerman likely had a stupid moment, but not a criminal one, will shake our heads say the world is going to a hot place in a fast way, and add another magazine to what we already carry.

[Dragonfighter]

If he is killed by a mob, then I imagine the actions taken by the other end of the extreme will be to add a bug and an extra magazine to their carry repertoire. Gun owners as a whole are law abiding people even in the most trying of circumstances. Not that everyone one either side fits into this category, but it is the difference between the tea party rallies and the people protesting the world bank. Those who think Zimmerman likely had a stupid moment, but not a criminal one, will shake our heads say the world is going to a hot place in a fast way, and add another magazine to what we already carry.

I used to carry extra, then didn't. The last gun show bought two more mags for my carry weapon. Now all I need is some decent leather for them or endure, "Is that a magazine in your pocket...?"

[RoyGBiv]

Fallout...
http://www2.wkrg.com/news/2012/apr/23/m ... r-3659891/

http://www.myfoxchicago.com/dpp/news/cr ... b-20120420

http://ironicsurrealism.com/2012/04/14/ ... lion-bond/

Our President's comments ("If I had a son, he would look like Travon") are providing justification for this.
"Unworthy" is the only word I can use here to describe him.

[RottenApple]

"Unworthy" is the only word I can use here to describe him.

I can think of several others but they'd get the mods mad at me.

[clarionite]

It's not his first time to jump into a situation...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Loui ... ontroversy" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He called Sgt. Crowley stupid for arresting Henry Gates.

[sjfcontrol]

It's not his first time to jump into a situation...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Loui ... ontroversy" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He called Sgt. Crowley stupid for arresting Henry Gates.

Stupid is as stupid does...

[VMI77]

...you'd have to debate that with my Momma...who's a whole lot wiser than you or I...she'd tell me "if you hadn't have been where you shouldn't have been, you wouldn't be in trouble"...seems pretty wise to me...if you can't admit that if he'd done either what his NW training/regulations said to do(and not do) or not done what the dispatcher told him not to do (and he said OK to)...there would have been no opportunity for EITHER to "first break the law"...it's pointless to continue...so I won't...

I think you're trying to make a rational argument, and by doing so, you're ignoring the real motivations in this case --spelled out in the Sultan Knish article linked to above-- and they have nothing to do with the facts of the incident and what really happened.

[VMI77]

It's interesting that when the media wanted to portray him as a vigilante, they stated many times that he was a "self-appointed neighborhood watch leader".

That is a core part of the left's mantra --that only "professionals" can be entrusted with weapons and only "professionals" are capable of defending themselves. Us common people are supposed to be passive victims and wait for the 'properly trained professionals." We must simply accept our fate, be it a beating, rape, or death. It's not "safe" to defend yourself...much safer just to be beaten to death or shot....and anyway, self-defense is immoral: that is the message the MSM and the lefties seek to convey. Some people actually believe it.

[Beiruty]

It's interesting that when the media wanted to portray him as a vigilante, they stated many times that he was a "self-appointed neighborhood watch leader".

That is a core part of the left's mantra --that only "professionals" can be entrusted with weapons and only "professionals" are capable of defending themselves. Us common people are supposed to be passive victims and wait for the 'properly trained professionals." We must simply accept our fate, be it a beating, rape, or death. It's not "safe" to defend yourself...much safer just to be beaten to death or shot....and anyway, self-defense is immoral: that is the message the MSM and the lefties seek to convey. Some people actually believe it.

What is immoral? Someone running at me with a butcher-sized knife, what do you expect me to do? At home I will run for my AK! Take that MSM and lefties. And, I am properly trained, we are the professionals.

[VMI77]

Since this thread has died down a bit this fine Saturday morning, as many of us head outside to do some overdue yard work, I thought I might send something out to our volunteer jurors, and invite comment when they come back in exhausted.

The Houston Chronicle has an OpEd this morning by a Texas law professor. It raises some interesting points, regardless of what your position might be on the difficult issues we have near worn out here on the forum. What think?

http://www.chron.com/opinion/outlook/ar ... 498736.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Jim

I think that article is EXTREMELY biased and wears it political viewpoint right out in the open. I've already been chastised for being dogmatic, but I am too old to change, so I'll just let it fly. I think this world would be a LOT better off, in general, if everyone just left everyone else alone...but mostly the bad guys don't do that...they usually seek others out to cause problems and do harm, unprovoked, for their own gain and enjoyment. And the mighty, wise, and elite legal scholar who wrote that missive seems to think that its quite okay for the bad guys to be able to do that and that any citizen who defends themselves better have tried to run away at top speed first, or already be in the process of bleeding from having their backsides whooped before they THINK about using force or deadly force to defend themselves and then they better use JUST THE RIGHT AMOUNT of force or they are the in the wrong...instead of the bad guy (or gal, I wouldn't want to discriminate) who started it having to be the one to worry. I guess I'm just living in the wrong era.

He should move to the UK....there grandma can't legally shoot a 6'4" 240 lbs muscle thug who is wielding a knife --that wouldn't be self-defense because she'd be using "more force," but she can engage him in a knife fight. Or a fist fight if he's punching her and he doesn't have a knife. That is exactly what the left wants for us.

[VMI77]

Since this thread has died down a bit this fine Saturday morning, as many of us head outside to do some overdue yard work, I thought I might send something out to our volunteer jurors, and invite comment when they come back in exhausted.

The Houston Chronicle has an OpEd this morning by a Texas law professor. It raises some interesting points, regardless of what your position might be on the difficult issues we have near worn out here on the forum. What think?

http://www.chron.com/opinion/outlook/ar ... 498736.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Jim

The picture was kind of cool with the state of Florida as the trigger of the gun. For being biased at the conclusion is was fairly neutral in the beginning. Compared to Nancy Grace it was extremely neutral.

Here are some things I think all of us have learned at Trayvon and Zimmerman's expense.

1. Don't be batman.

2. Neighborhood watch captain is a job you don't want.

3. If you shoot someone outside your house or property, you will probably be charged with a crime.

4. If you shoot someone, and the police do not take lots of photos of you and your injuries, and do not take your blood, ask them to do it, and if they refuse, have it done on your own. Ask for copies and make sure you don't hide them from the press.

5. Everything else we have talked about over the years: Calling 911, retreating, only shooting if our life was truly in danger, shooting only if the BG was very close,
waiting for the police to arrive, saying I was the one who called 911, saying I was in fear of my life, saying I will sign a complaint. All of this will not keep you out of jail, if: the BG is not armed with a weapon, and has determined supporters.

6. Better to be tried by 12 than killed by one.

I'd submit we all probably knew those things already.......but I'd add this: if there is any room to manipulate an act of self-defense to serve the left's political agenda, then you may be randomly subject to a media and political lynching, regardless of the law.