Doctors asking if you own a gun

[JP171]

Remember that HIPAA does not apply to government agencies, not Medicare , not Medicaid , not the VA nor the military. HIPAA is a false curtain and its transparent. My answer to the weapons question is always no and it's none of your business. The federal law enforcement community always has access to any federal records and LEO can always get a subpoena to access any medical record you ever had then BOOM it's passed around as they see fit and it doesn't violate HIPAA or even the privacy acts

[sailor2000]

sailor2000,

Do you also ask if they have large, sharp kitchen knives, hammers, axes, screwdrivers, etc.?

Color me skeptical regarding the need to know about firearms...

I said we DON"T routinely ask.

[VMI77]

I have been asked by the pediatrician but not any other doctors.

That's because the AAP is openly anti-gun (just check out their website) and actively pushing pediatricians to ask if there is a gun in the house. And if you let your child see the doctor without a parent present, they will ask the child.

[VMI77]

It's been years now, but I did have a Peds doc ask about guns in the house once when I had our youngest son at the doc. I responded by asking her if she participated in a very personal sexual act.. she declined to respond, and understood at that point why I asked.. I said I apologize for asking a personal question I had no right to ask.
She was actually a good doc, and we were happy to have her.... This was in Oregon, 2002..

In 2002 the CDC released several studies that had to do with gun ownership and children. I understand why a pediatrician might try to educate parents. If everyone practiced appropriate safety around children, we wouldn't have such statistics.

Course, trampolines are dangerous to kids too. I'm not offended by a discussion about them.

Doctors can ask me whatever they want that might facilitate a reasonable discussion. I can choose to not answer if I don't want to.

Instead of just believing that there are no nefarious intentions, why don't you check out the AAP website? They are openly anti-gun and and use their professional association to advance the gun control agenda. The AAP is run by left-wing extremists. Their policy paper is downright scary....they advocate gun confiscation, among other things:

The AAP continues to support a number of specific measures to reduce the destructive effects of guns in the lives of children and adolescents through the
implementation of the following recommendations.

-Enact a strong, effective assault weapon ban;

-Eliminate the gun show loophole and require mandatory background checks and
waiting periods before all firearm purchases;

-Ban on high-capacity magazines;

-Enact strong handgun regulations; and

-Require safe firearm storage under federal law.

Here's what they say about an assault weapons ban: they seek confiscation.

It should ban possession, manufacture, transfer, sale, and import of assault weapons. Current assault weapons should not be excluded
from the ban by “grandfathering” them. The ban should include stiff penalties for violating the statute. Civil and criminal sanctions should be included. The ban should also include a prohibition on the purchase, sale, or possession of detachable ammunition magazines with a capacity of greater than 10 rounds.

Here's what they say about firearm storage: they want to make guns useless for self-defense.

Safe Gun Storage
Safe gun storage (guns unloaded and locked, ammunition locked separately) reduces unintentional injury and suicide risk for children and adolescents. In addition, a number of design options have been proposed to decrease the likelihood of unintentional injury by a firearm, as well as limiting access by unauthorized users. The AAP urges that guns be subject to consumer product regulations regarding child access, safety, and design. These include trigger locks, lock boxes, personalized safety mechanisms, and trigger pressures that are too high for young children.

Child access prevention (CAP) laws establish criminal penalties for owners who do not store their firearms appropriately (e.g., unloaded, in a locked compartment). The best CAP laws make it a felony offense for a gun owner if an injury results from a child accessing an unsecured gun.

So, have a gun ready for self-defense, go to prison.

And on their spying activities:

As noted in a request for information (RFI) letter dated December 27, pediatricians should have no deterrents to ask whether a gun is in the home. In fact, Section 2713 of the ACA requires that insurers offer Bright Futures services for no copay in all non-grandfathered plans. The Bright Futures guidelines for well -child visits include anticipatory guidance regarding whether firearms are in the home.

On anti-gun propaganda and censorship:

The AAP policy statement on media violence recommends the development of quality, violence -free programming and constructive dialogue among child health and education advocates, the 7 Federal Communications Commission, and the television and motion picture industries, as well as toy, video game, and other software manufactures and designers, in an effort to reduce the romanticization of guns in the popular media as a means of resolving conflict.

There's a lot more to see there. These are not people who are open to rational discussion, these are anti-gun extremists exploiting professional credibility to advance a political agenda. They also use the current left-wing trope of "firearm safety" when what they really mean is the total elimination of the private ownership of firearms:

The absence of guns in homes and communities is the most reliable and effective measure to prevent firearm-related injuries in children and adolescents.

[gthaustex]

It's been years now, but I did have a Peds doc ask about guns in the house once when I had our youngest son at the doc. I responded by asking her if she participated in a very personal sexual act.. she declined to respond, and understood at that point why I asked.. I said I apologize for asking a personal question I had no right to ask.
She was actually a good doc, and we were happy to have her.... This was in Oregon, 2002..

In 2002 the CDC released several studies that had to do with gun ownership and children. I understand why a pediatrician might try to educate parents. If everyone practiced appropriate safety around children, we wouldn't have such statistics.

Course, trampolines are dangerous to kids too. I'm not offended by a discussion about them.

Doctors can ask me whatever they want that might facilitate a reasonable discussion. I can choose to not answer if I don't want to.

Instead of just believing that there are no nefarious intentions, why don't you check out the AAP website? They are openly anti-gun and and use their professional association to advance the gun control agenda. The AAP is run by left-wing extremists. Their policy paper is downright scary....they advocate gun confiscation, among other things:

The AAP continues to support a number of specific measures to reduce the destructive effects of guns in the lives of children and adolescents through the
implementation of the following recommendations.

-Enact a strong, effective assault weapon ban;

-Eliminate the gun show loophole and require mandatory background checks and
waiting periods before all firearm purchases;

-Ban on high-capacity magazines;

-Enact strong handgun regulations; and

-Require safe firearm storage under federal law.

Here's what they say about an assault weapons ban: they seek confiscation.

It should ban possession, manufacture, transfer, sale, and import of assault weapons. Current assault weapons should not be excluded
from the ban by “grandfathering” them. The ban should include stiff penalties for violating the statute. Civil and criminal sanctions should be included. The ban should also include a prohibition on the purchase, sale, or possession of detachable ammunition magazines with a capacity of greater than 10 rounds.

Here's what they say about firearm storage: they want to make guns useless for self-defense.

Safe Gun Storage
Safe gun storage (guns unloaded and locked, ammunition locked separately) reduces unintentional injury and suicide risk for children and adolescents. In addition, a number of design options have been proposed to decrease the likelihood of unintentional injury by a firearm, as well as limiting access by unauthorized users. The AAP urges that guns be subject to consumer product regulations regarding child access, safety, and design. These include trigger locks, lock boxes, personalized safety mechanisms, and trigger pressures that are too high for young children.

Child access prevention (CAP) laws establish criminal penalties for owners who do not store their firearms appropriately (e.g., unloaded, in a locked compartment). The best CAP laws make it a felony offense for a gun owner if an injury results from a child accessing an unsecured gun.

So, have a gun ready for self-defense, go to prison.

And on their spying activities:

As noted in a request for information (RFI) letter dated December 27, pediatricians should have no deterrents to ask whether a gun is in the home. In fact, Section 2713 of the ACA requires that insurers offer Bright Futures services for no copay in all non-grandfathered plans. The Bright Futures guidelines for well -child visits include anticipatory guidance regarding whether firearms are in the home.

On anti-gun propaganda and censorship:

The AAP policy statement on media violence recommends the development of quality, violence -free programming and constructive dialogue among child health and education advocates, the 7 Federal Communications Commission, and the television and motion picture industries, as well as toy, video game, and other software manufactures and designers, in an effort to reduce the romanticization of guns in the popular media as a means of resolving conflict.

There's a lot more to see there. These are not people who are open to rational discussion, these are anti-gun extremists exploiting professional credibility to advance a political agenda. They also use the current left-wing trope of "firearm safety" when what they really mean is the total elimination of the private ownership of firearms:

The absence of guns in homes and communities is the most reliable and effective measure to prevent firearm-related injuries in children and adolescents.

Gee, do they as zealously pursue chemicals in the house, swimming pools and other household hazards??? Busybodies...

Once again, it is "for the children"...

[cb1000rider]

cb1000rider, your trust in the HIPAA laws to protect medical information assumes that the government won't access the information. The questions about gun ownership are part of the medical record mandated by ???. Doctors don't automatically start adding these questions to their templates. The HIPAA laws fine you or private companies for releasing medical information. But when the IRS can pull off release of info to "friends" what makes you think that your medical info won't be scanned by the government and what would you do if they did scan it? Have you heard of Edward Snowden? The fact that your electronic records are all stored in house means nothing if you are part of a "portal" that shares records with other providers and if you are not yet doing this you will in the future. Everything will be on the internet and reachable by the same people that now read all of your emails, track all of your cell phone useage, etc. Sure, there are easier ways to find out if you own a gun but eventually they will just have internet "bots" tracking the records. When it come to HIPAA fines, have you ever heard of the government being fined?

Rotor,
HIPAA laws show intent. If complied with, they prevent your generic hacker from stealing your health records off a compromised server. There is no encryption level requirement that I know of.. And they won't stop someone with a dedicated super computer and determination.

With enough computing power - with the kind of computing power that the NSA has - they can certainly bypass common encryption.

As I illustrated before, questions about gun ownership are not mandated... People are blaming Obamacare and Medicare for those questions, but that's just misinformation. Your doctor may or may not ask. It might be part of a standard software template. I'm indicating that it's a "risk factor" that may be applicable to pediatric doctors. In no way am I saying that it's required. I'm simply saying that it may be interesting information to some professionals in light of certain statistics.

I think that there is no reason for a government agency to invade my medical records that might be stored on private server somewhere. What purpose would it serve? If there was DNA information there, I might believe you. The NSA is spying with purpose. If they want to count the guns, there are easier ways. Much easier ways.


I think if you're talking about common "portals" that you perhaps don't entirely understand how things work. If I store data in house, I can make sure it's inaccessible. I know a lot about it. It's what I do for a living.


I believe our government is spying... That's fairly common knowledge. Do I think our government is hacking into private medical databases and decrypting them? No.

BTW, my primary care physician still uses paper. I digitize his records.

[MotherBear]

The absence of guns in homes and communities is the most reliable and effective measure to prevent firearm-related injuries in children and adolescents.

Well, you can't fault their logic -- if there were no firearms anywhere there would be no firearms-related injuries. Of course, that assumes that you could actually ensure the total absence of firearms, as opposed to just the absence of those owned by law-abiding, decent people. And that you don't mind other sorts of injuries. Details, right?

[cb1000rider]

Well, you can't fault their logic -- if there were no firearms anywhere there would be no firearms-related injuries. Of course, that assumes that you could actually ensure the total absence of firearms, as opposed to just the absence of those owned by law-abiding, decent people. And that you don't mind other sorts of injuries. Details, right?

Yea, but it's a different subject with kids. We can talk about what removing firearms does to crime rates, but firearms injuries and children aren't typically criminal. They're accidental and avoidable. It's easy to see how owning a gun is a risk factor to children over not owning one at all. As a parent, I'm acutely aware of it and it requires a level of discipline that not everyone may have.

I think the statistics are why some pediatricians choose to ask.

[StewNTexas]

I usually enter the following in the blank space provided "NOYFB".

I have never been questioned regarding this answer. I think texting has taught many people to decode messages easily.

[lfinsr]

Oh boy. I'll help. Or try to. I don't know if this will make it better or worse:
Doctors are encouraged to go to electronic records by 2015. That's true.
To the best of my knowledge, there is no "universal" means for storing patient data. That is, there are many many different providers of software, but no universal standard. There is no central database on everyone. There are lots of little databases in different forms.

Yes, questions can be personal and may offend some people. Many of the personal questions such as ethnicity and sexuality may actually have a bearing on your health. After all, if you're American Indian, you're more predisposed to certain conditions than other parts of the population. And yea, your sexual lifestyle plays a part in your health risks too. Offended? Yea, we don't like to talk about it. Relevant medical information? Absolutely. Do you have to answer? No.

Records can be stored in many forms. They can be stored on local storage in doctors offices, they can be stored on remote storage, they can be stored on cloud storage. Personally, the loss of my paper medical records could be a problem and I'd be happy if my doctor would choose to store them digitally with a secure remote backup.. Yes, even cloud-based! I keep electronic copies of my dogs vet records as well as my own. It's massively useful when visiting a new vet or doctor to have it all with you in one shot.

There is substantial and significant legislation around how your electronic health data can be stored by companies. It's non-trivial. You can't just pump it to the cloud and be HIPAA compliant. Our legislators have shown good faith there. Course, we know that anything that is electronic can be accessed... Just like paper records.

Look I think.. well... I know that the NSA is listening. If the federal government really wanted to know my ethnicity, sexuality, or if I own a gun - there are much easier ways to obtain that information than from covertly stealing electronic health records. When those records start containing DNA tracing - or other information that can be used for national security, I'll wear the tin-foil hat with you, but until then, it's just not something that I'm going to worry about.

Three sayings come to mind...

1)If there is a potential for abuse, it will be abused.
2)Today's conspiracy theory is tomorrows headlines.
3)There are 2 kinds of data. Data that has been compromised and data that will be compromised.

That said, if there's no records there's no danger of them being used against you. It doesn't stop the many other potential methods for those that have the ability to find out what they want to know, however, I'm not going to hand it to them no questions asked.

Larry

[VoiceofReason]

If mine were young I would tell them “if a doctor asks if there is a gun at home, say no”.

They can enact 573 anti gun laws and I will not register or turn mine in.

Have the gun grabbers considered the possibility the people might not comply?

[mojo84]

Yes. That may be one reason they are staging military armored vehicles around the country with local law enforcement agencies.

[E.Marquez]

Yes. That may be one reason they are staging military armored vehicles around the country with local law enforcement agencies.

[mojo84]

[cb1000rider]

1)If there is a potential for abuse, it will be abused.
2)Today's conspiracy theory is tomorrows headlines.
3)There are 2 kinds of data. Data that has been compromised and data that will be compromised.

Larry:

1) I completely agree with you on number one. It's why I think the LA trooper that opened the CHL'ers glovebox (thread reference to be added) is a really bad idea.
2) Some of them will be headlines. There are more conspiracy theories than available headlines.
3) I agree. Data can be compromised and most of it will. Compromising encrypted data doesn't give you much unless you're really really motivated and have a lot of power or time. That's part of why HIPAA is important.

I'll buy in to the conspiracy theory here when there is a reason or motivation for the government to want to steal that data. Right now, I don't see one.