WOULD YOU SHOOT???????????

[WildBill]

You guys who are so ready to shoot someone need to sit and talk to a few people who have. The financial, emotional and psychological impacts on you AND your family are not minor nor a joke. A realize that everybody wants to be a tough guy, but there seriously needs some thought put into these types of statements.

I couldn't agree more with TXI's statement. Those of you unlucky enough to get caught up in the criminal justice system will slowly get ground up and spit out. If you are arrested, even if you are completely innocent, you will become involved in an all-consuming ordeal that will drain you emotionally, adversely effect your health, deplete your savings, strain your family relationships and cause problems at work or school. The whole thing can drag on for years - it's not like a TV show where it all gets wrapped up at the end of the hour. Please, do everything in your power to avoid having to go through it.

Enough, now off of my soapbox.

[WildBill]

That suggests we need to enact laws to protect victims who defend themselves from criminals.

Some victims rights laws have been enacted. The problem is that sometimes your rights don't mean too much unless you go to court to protect them - which means time, stress, and lots of money. The criminals have the right to a free attorney if they can't afford one - unfortunately, the victim doesn't.

[LedJedi]

Heck yes.

We have been burgularized enough times to loose our insurance. I've experienced the criminal court system several times with criminals. I will shoot without hesitation.

I agree.

My property is worth something to me. I work hard to earn enough money to buy what I have. I'm willing to spend a few bullets to keep it.

When a criminal tries to victimize me, I believe they're expressing their desire to be shot.

It'll cost you a lot more than the price of a few bullets.

You guys who are so ready to shoot someone need to sit and talk to a few people who have. The financial, emotional and psychological impacts on you AND your family are not minor nor a joke. A realize that everybody wants to be a tough guy, but there seriously needs some thought put into these types of statements.

I would not lose a wink of sleep defending myself, my family or my property (or my neighbor's property) by use of DF. I have probably thought about it more than most which is why i have made a point to closely study the laws dealing with this issue. Legality should not be an issue as I intend to be 100% within my rights in such a scenario.

The life of a criminal who has chosen his own path is worthless imo. He has sentenced himself to the causality of his path by virtue of his own actions. I have no sympathy for those who do not respect the rights and liberties of others. They're not worth my time, definitely not worthy of sucking my oxygen and barely worth the expense of my bullets.

Human life does have value but individuals who slink about under cover of night to steal a man's livelihood or his life piece by piece by stealing misc property (the money used to acquire property was earned at the expense of great portions of my time earing said money and is therefore a representation of a proportionate portion of my life) is not a human individual. He/She is a goblin and deserving of a goblin's fate, whatever that may be. I have no sympathy for goblins. They are not human.

Perhaps you should recline and meditate on the fact that some of us are tired of worrying about evils of the criminal element and will gladly stand our ground within the confines of the law to do what is morally right (take back our streets from said goblins). If that makes me and those like me a "tough-guy" in your book then so be it. I consider myself an American Citizen. Nothing more, nothing less. I think you might be surprised at the number of American Citizens who share that perspective.

[txinvestigator]

I would not lose a wink of sleep defending myself, my family or my property (or my neighbor's property) by use of DF. I have probably thought about it more than most which is why i have made a point to closely study the laws dealing with this issue. Legality should not be an issue as I intend to be 100% within my rights in such a scenario.

The life of a criminal who has chosen his own path is worthless imo. He has sentenced himself to the causality of his path by virtue of his own actions. I have no sympathy for those who do not respect the rights and liberties of others. They're not worth my time, definitely not worthy of sucking my oxygen and barely worth the expense of my bullets.

Human life does have value but individuals who slink about under cover of night to steal a man's livelihood or his life piece by piece by stealing misc property (the money used to acquire property was earned at the expense of great portions of my time earing said money and is therefore a representation of a proportionate portion of my life) is not a human individual. He/She is a goblin and deserving of a goblin's fate, whatever that may be. I have no sympathy for goblins. They are not human.

Perhaps you should recline and meditate on the fact that some of us are tired of worrying about evils of the criminal element and will gladly stand our ground within the confines of the law to do what is morally right (take back our streets from said goblins). If that makes me and those like me a "tough-guy" in your book then so be it. I consider myself an American Citizen. Nothing more, nothing less. I think you might be surprised at the number of American Citizens who share that perspective.

I guarantee you will lose more than a wink of sleep. But whatever you need to say publicly to get ya through there.

[WildBill]

I would not lose a wink of sleep defending myself, my family or my property (or my neighbor's property) by use of DF. I have probably thought about it more than most which is why i have made a point to closely study the laws dealing with this issue. Legality should not be an issue as I intend to be 100% within my rights in such a scenario.

LedJedi - I hear your frustration, but we are not disagreeing that we have a right to defend ourselves and our property. That is one reason I got my CHL. My point [and TXI's] is that shooting someone is not something to be taken lightly - even if the shooting is lawful.

Lately, there have been several discussions on this forum about the Harris County DA and his attitude about CHLs. He is the type of person that you would have to deal with, not the members of this forum. And I guarantee if he went after you, you would lose some sleep. I also guarantee that the DAs and their assistants have spent a lot more time studying the DF laws that you or me.

Off my soapbox, again.

[GrillKing]

You guys who are so ready to shoot someone need to sit and talk to a few people who have. The financial, emotional and psychological impacts on you AND your family are not minor nor a joke. A realize that everybody wants to be a tough guy, but there seriously needs some thought put into these types of statements.

I couldn't agree more with TXI's statement. Those of you unlucky enough to get caught up in the criminal justice system will slowly get ground up and spit out. If you are arrested, even if you are completely innocent, you will become involved in an all-consuming ordeal that will drain you emotionally, adversely effect your health, deplete your savings, strain your family relationships and cause problems at work or school. The whole thing can drag on for years - it's not like a TV show where it all gets wrapped up at the end of the hour. Please, do everything in your power to avoid having to go through it.

Enough, now off of my soapbox.

with WildBill and TXI. Even a justifed shooting over property alone isn't worth weeks / months / years of my life fighting the legal system, the financial cost, the emotional cost. Even if the shooter can 'handle it' what about the shooters spouse and kids? It's a practical matter to me. Plus, even some shootings, even though legally justified aren't morally so in my view. According to the law as I understand it, criminal mischief at night (say egging a car or stealing a bicycle??) would legally justify deadly force. There is no way that deadly force is morally justifed however. IMHO.

[LedJedi]

with WildBill and TXI. Even a justifed shooting over property alone isn't worth weeks / months / years of my life fighting the legal system, the financial cost, the emotional cost. Even if the shooter can 'handle it' what about the shooters spouse and kids? It's a practical matter to me. Plus, even some shootings, even though legally justified aren't morally so in my view. According to the law as I understand it, criminal mischief at night (say egging a car or stealing a bicycle??) would legally justify deadly force. There is no way that deadly force is morally justifed however. IMHO.

I dont want to hijack this whole thread for this subject, but I can certainly envision some criminal mischief scenarios I would use DF over. Probably not egging my car, but there certainly are some. My wife and kid know how I feel on the subject and agree with me. Sometimes standing up for yourself and what is yours is more important than taking the easy way out of a situation.

[WildBill]

I dont want to hijack this whole thread for this subject, but I can certainly envision some criminal mischief scenarios I would use DF over. Probably not egging my car, but there certainly are some. My wife and kid know how I feel on the subject and agree with me.

LedJedi - You're not hijacking the thread. The original question was "Would You Shoot?" and you gave your answer.

Sometimes standing up for yourself and what is yours is more important than taking the easy way out of a situation.

Amen to that!

[phddan]

"WOULD YOU SHOOT???????????"

I would stop the thief, legally.

Look, everyone is different. Everyone will handle a situation differently. Some people are total pacifists, some are way too ready to throw down. Some will only act to defend themselves, while others will defend total strangers. Some will stand up for what is right, and others will do nothing but moan and groan that something needs to be done.
Everyone is different.

Some of us are willing to stand up to scum bags, and do it legally and lawfully, and morrally. You do have a right to defend yourself and your property. Some will, some won't.

Dan

[hoss4570]

I;m tellin yall, this HURT when they stole my welder. It has cost me 10.000 dollars in the last month and still have more to go. I WILL shoot next time given a chance. Yall do whatever you think is best. At least they won't do it to other innocent people, asleep in their own homes. I WILL NOT roll over and play dead and let these scum steal my stuff if I can help it.

[lawrnk]

I;m tellin yall, this HURT when they stole my welder. It has cost me 10.000 dollars in the last month and still have more to go. I WILL shoot next time given a chance. Yall do whatever you think is best. At least they won't do it to other innocent people, asleep in their own homes. I WILL NOT roll over and play dead and let these scum steal my stuff if I can help it.

If it were a bike, it is theirs and I'll call 9/11. If its 10k worth of stuff, what I use to make a living and support my family, I would shoot to maintain possession of that equipment.

[lawrnk]

I would not lose a wink of sleep defending myself, my family or my property (or my neighbor's property) by use of DF. I have probably thought about it more than most which is why i have made a point to closely study the laws dealing with this issue. Legality should not be an issue as I intend to be 100% within my rights in such a scenario.

LedJedi - I hear your frustration, but we are not disagreeing that we have a right to defend ourselves and our property. That is one reason I got my CHL. My point [and TXI's] is that shooting someone is not something to be taken lightly - even if the shooting is lawful.

Lately, there have been several discussions on this forum about the Harris County DA and his attitude about CHLs. He is the type of person that you would have to deal with, not the members of this forum. And I guarantee if he went after you, you would lose some sleep. I also guarantee that the DAs and their assistants have spent a lot more time studying the DF laws that you or me.

Off my soapbox, again.

I understoof that the HC DA is on his way out?

[WildBill]

I understoof that the HC DA is on his way out?

Yeah, he is, but you never know who his replacement is going to be. There are alot of overzealous DAs out there - Look at what Mike Nifong did to those students at Duke University. If it weren't for the intense national news coverage and the fact that the student's parents are fairly affluent, I believe he would still be the DA.

That said, I feel fortunate to be in Texas where there is a deeply ingrained tradition of the right to self defense and protection of private property.

[Liberty]

I understoof that the HC DA is on his way out?

Chucky still has a year left to his term. He will still have many opportunities to screw up peoples lives.

[NguyenVanDon]

"WOULD YOU SHOOT???????????"

I would stop the thief, legally.

Look, everyone is different. Everyone will handle a situation differently. Some people are total pacifists, some are way too ready to throw down. Some will only act to defend themselves, while others will defend total strangers. Some will stand up for what is right, and others will do nothing but moan and groan that something needs to be done.
Everyone is different.

Some of us are willing to stand up to scum bags, and do it legally and lawfully, and morrally. You do have a right to defend yourself and your property. Some will, some won't.

Dan

This man speaks the truth...