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Certainly there is such a thing as collateral damage, but "collateral" means "indirect." For instance, an officer takes a shot at a BG, and his bullet goes through a wall and injures someone innocent, or if a hostage is injured during a rescue attempt. But this one in Phoenix is different from that. In this case, the innocent person was deliberately shot. In the back. Six times. Twice after he was already down.

This is not a righteous shoot, and the Phoenix PD and city council saying it is doesn't make it so. When this gets to court, I predict the department will lose. Big time. And even though that would probably be the right outcome, it would be a shame that this will further taint the department, making it that much harder for those honest cops still working in the PD.

"If Brian would have known there was a homeowner in there, he probably would have hesitated," Gannon said, "but if he had hesitated, and it was the (suspect), the outcome could have been tragic."

It sounds like this Gannon guy doesn't believe the the what happened wasn't very tragic. But if a cop got hurt then it would be tragic indeed.

I have a gut feeling that any shooting of a Hispanic is a good shoot in that neck of the woods.

casingpoint wrote:I have a gut feeling that any shooting of a Hispanic is a good shoot in that neck of the woods.

you'd be surprised. prolly more hispanics on the police force than not.

Phoenix PD is not getting a x-mas card from me. They stilll won't let my family have back the gun my uncle used to protect himself from a home invader with a baseball bat. Uncle died and they are claiming it's still evidence...

Well, after reading this... I don't think I'll be moving to Arizona anytime soon. Never... to be exact.

There are probably some good cops out there, but unless you have time to sort them all out, just don't turn your back on any of them..

Six hits and the guy lived to sue?

Purplehood wrote:Six hits and the guy lived to sue?

Another testament to the PD's (lack of) training?

dicion wrote:

Purplehood wrote:Six hits and the guy lived to sue?

Another testament to the PD's (lack of) training?

More testament that a bullet or even 6 bullets isn't always gonna be an an instant kill. Sometimes they even get to survive even a .45ACP

I AM disabled with an amputated leg, I would give anything to not have to be in this position, but I am coping with it..

Kevinf2349 wrote:IF the facts are as stated, and they have the 911 tape then I would imagine that those LEO's need to become inmates at Sherrif Joe's tent city. (including the sargent) To me it would have been much better if they admitted they made a mistake in the heat of the moment and man up about it.

As for IA, they need firing too. What is needed is an independent review team to police the police, while they are allowed to investigate their own, they are always going to be open to favoritism and bias.

As I learned during my studies for US citizenship ....... The law applies to everyone, no one is above the law.....that includes LEOs.

It's incredible that this isn't the case. It should be changed. I see more and more of this kind of stuff on the news.

Kevinf2349 wrote:IF . . .
As for IA, they need firing too. What is needed is an independent review team to police the police, while they are allowed to investigate their own, they are always going to be open to favoritism and bias.

This statement is not true. Many times they are harder on their own.

I guess your opinion is going to depend upon which side of the "thin blue line" you are on.

Police officers frequently are found justified in shooting people who reach for their waistband or have something shiny in their hand, who are later found to be unarmed. See Amadou Diallo. I don't see a lot of non-LEOs coming away from that sort of incident without huge legal bills.

- Jim

carlson1 wrote:

Kevinf2349 wrote:IF . . .
As for IA, they need firing too. What is needed is an independent review team to police the police, while they are allowed to investigate their own, they are always going to be open to favoritism and bias.

This statement is not true. Many times they are harder on their own.

Any examples you can think of?

Maybe a lot of the cases we see on these forums are the bad examples. :)

I want to make one thing clear: I posted this incident because the question of taking bad guys prisoner comes up frequently on this forum. This is an illustration of how badly such a move can go.

I do not intend to bash the police. However, I have seen too many incidents like this whitewashed over the years.

LEOs are disciplined or lose their jobs quite often without fanfare. That is the system working as it should.

- Jim