Where do you buy your guns?

[silverbear]

Store: Academy or Bachman Pawn ( Just started buying from these guys, they're cheap and very business oriented. Get in get what you need and get you on your way quickly. I like that. )

Also, I browse all the local gun shows and once in awhile find a good deal. Never on firearms yet but with accessories.

Bachman Pawn at the gun shows - great deals!

[cougartex]

Academy, Gun Shows, sometimes Gander Mountain, internet.

[A-R]

There are also a few people that seem to snatch up any bargin to resell them without a FFL. Hardly kosher or legal.

Just curious, what particular law or statute is being broken in this scenario? Or is this just sour grapes?

Please don't take this question as a slam or calling you out, I'd honestly like to know the answer. I've heard these types of things before, even heard of ATF types hassling people about it. But what law exactly are you breaking if you buy a gun, decide you don't like it, and sell it/trade it to the next guy (as long as you don't KNOW beforehand that the buyer is not legal etc).

It's not like you can test drive a gun before you buy it the way you can test drive a car. Sure you can rent a similar model from a range IF the range has that model available for rent. But you can't test fire the particular gun you're planning to buy.

So is there a law making buy, try, resell illegal without an FFL?

[Keith B]

There are also a few people that seem to snatch up any bargin to resell them without a FFL. Hardly kosher or legal.

Just curious, what particular law or statute is being broken in this scenario? Or is this just sour grapes?

Please don't take this question as a slam or calling you out, I'd honestly like to know the answer. I've heard these types of things before, even heard of ATF types hassling people about it. But what law exactly are you breaking if you buy a gun, decide you don't like it, and sell it/trade it to the next guy (as long as you don't KNOW beforehand that the buyer is not legal etc).

It's not like you can test drive a gun before you buy it the way you can test drive a car. Sure you can rent a similar model from a range IF the range has that model available for rent. But you can't test fire the particular gun you're planning to buy.

So is there a law making buy, try, resell illegal without an FFL?

Yes, if you are buying it because it is a bargain with the intent of reselling only to make a profit, then you are in violation of the law without an FFL. Buying it for yourself, but then deciding it is not what you wanted, and then selling it is not illegal. Can they tell the difference? Probably not, but by the law, that is the way it works.

[Baba Brad]

I like to check out Pawn shops. Yesterday I stumbled across a Bersa Thunder with the all nickle finish for $189.
I put it on layaway.

I'm jealous.

That's been my usual route also. Local pawn shop has some of the best deals I've come across. Picked up my first Bersa Thunder (the fancy, pimped out gold trim one) for $199. I've seen a few more there I want, but can't afford right now. On the other hand, his ammo prices are ridiculous.

Try your pawn shops. Do your research before going and have an idea what you are looking for. Not all pawn shop employess are actually gun smart. Some are, but not all.

[USA1]

I like to check out Pawn shops. Yesterday I stumbled across a Bersa Thunder with the all nickle finish for $189.
I put it on layaway.

I'm jealous.

That's been my usual route also. Local pawn shop has some of the best deals I've come across. Picked up my first Bersa Thunder (the fancy, pimped out gold trim one) for $199. I've seen a few more there I want, but can't afford right now. On the other hand, his ammo prices are ridiculous.

Try your pawn shops. Do your research before going and have an idea what you are looking for. Not all pawn shop employess are actually gun smart. Some are, but not all.

I stopped at another today to look at their guns.
The prices were ridiculously high.
For example..they wanted $350 for a beat up Keltec .380 with hardly any finish left on it.

[gregthehand]

I frequent:

Champion Firearms in College Station

Tomball Pawn in Tomball

Academy

Also i have bought online but it just seems like such a hassle. Plus Tomball Pawn and Champion both sale for what I can get online. I also like SOG Armory here in Houston for certain accesories but their gun prices are high. I haven't tried to talk them down though so they may have wiggle room there.

[Bonc_CHL]

Pretty much agree with everyone on here, I hit the local pawn shops about every two weeks or so and look for deals.
There are a few local gun stores I will hit on occasion I am in the Austin area so if you ever need a list let me know.
I just ordered (about 5 min ago) a P-64 from J&g sales online, so we shall see how that goes!

[A-R]

I haven't had luck buying a gun at a good price at a pawn shop since I bought a Charter Arms .38 Undercover at Doc Hollidays in Cedar Park about 10 years ago (never should've sold that little gun).

Bonc .... which pawn shops around CP/L have you found deals?

[A-R]

There are also a few people that seem to snatch up any bargin to resell them without a FFL. Hardly kosher or legal.

Just curious, what particular law or statute is being broken in this scenario? Or is this just sour grapes?

Please don't take this question as a slam or calling you out, I'd honestly like to know the answer. I've heard these types of things before, even heard of ATF types hassling people about it. But what law exactly are you breaking if you buy a gun, decide you don't like it, and sell it/trade it to the next guy (as long as you don't KNOW beforehand that the buyer is not legal etc).

It's not like you can test drive a gun before you buy it the way you can test drive a car. Sure you can rent a similar model from a range IF the range has that model available for rent. But you can't test fire the particular gun you're planning to buy.

So is there a law making buy, try, resell illegal without an FFL?

Yes, if you are buying it because it is a bargain with the intent of reselling only to make a profit, then you are in violation of the law without an FFL. Buying it for yourself, but then deciding it is not what you wanted, and then selling it is not illegal. Can they tell the difference? Probably not, but by the law, that is the way it works.

Anyone happen to know the Federal law(s) to this effect? I'd like to read them but don't feel like wading through the entire Federal code.

[cbr600]

Yes, if you are buying it because it is a bargain with the intent of reselling only to make a profit, then you are in violation of the law without an FFL. Buying it for yourself, but then deciding it is not what you wanted, and then selling it is not illegal. Can they tell the difference? Probably not, but by the law, that is the way it works.

Anyone happen to know the Federal law(s) to this effect? I'd like to read them but don't feel like wading through the entire Federal code.

Start here but the short answer is one needs an FFL to be in the business.

[Bonc_CHL]

There is a Best Pawn over by the Walmart in CP that I have seen a few pretty good prices at. Also I saw XD in the olive drab at the Cash America over by Duval for a pretty good price, I think it was like 420 or so, it looked brand new!! I just go and hit all of them on a weekend when I have not much going on, you never know when you might find a deal

[A-R]

OK, ATF site was little help. But did some Google-foo and I believe these are the two relevant sections:

(a) It shall be unlawful -
(1) for any person -
(A) except a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or
licensed dealer, to engage in the business of importing,
manufacturing, or dealing in firearms, or in the course of such
business to ship, transport, or receive any firearm in
interstate or foreign commerce; or

http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/18/I/44/922" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(a) As used in this chapter -
(21) The term "engaged in the business" means -
(C) as applied to a dealer in firearms, as defined in section
921(a)(11)(A), a person who devotes time, attention, and labor to
dealing in firearms as a regular course of trade or business with
the principal objective of livelihood and profit through the
repetitive purchase and resale of firearms, but such term shall
not include a person who makes occasional sales, exchanges, or
purchases of firearms for the enhancement of a personal
collection or for a hobby, or who sells all or part of his
personal collection of firearms;

http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/uscode/18/I/44/921" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


So I guess the key here would be the legal definition of "occasional" in 18 U.S.C. 921(a)(21)(c) above. If a person holds one or more other jobs that generate the bulk of his "livelihood" and income as demonstrated on Federal tax returns, but buys and sells 52 guns per year (one per week) for a profit of less than $100 each, is that person an unlicensed (thus "illegal") firearms dealer? What about 1 gun per month for profit? What about 1 gun per week, but all at a loss? what about 1 gun per year, but at a $50,000 profit?

We can obviously get carried away with thousands of hypothetical situations. I just propose that it's not quite as clear cut as Keith B's definition above, though agree that if you admitted to the intent to "flip" a firearm, as it were, you're probably going to be prosecuted:

Yes, if you are buying it because it is a bargain with the intent of reselling only to make a profit, then you are in violation of the law without an FFL. Buying it for yourself, but then deciding it is not what you wanted, and then selling it is not illegal. Can they tell the difference? Probably not, but by the law, that is the way it works.

[A-R]

There is a Best Pawn over by the Walmart in CP that I have seen a few pretty good prices at. Also I saw XD in the olive drab at the Cash America over by Duval for a pretty good price, I think it was like 420 or so, it looked brand new!! I just go and hit all of them on a weekend when I have not much going on, you never know when you might find a deal

I thought Cash America doesn't sell guns? Or am I thinking of a different pawn chain?

Been into Best Pawn a few times and never found much, but that was back during the Obama rush, so maybe it's getting better. Used to see some at least reasonable prices, though not really "deals" at that pawn shop just south of Anderson Mill on the southbound US183 feeder road before it burned a year or so ago. Haven't been back in since they rebuilt it.

[Bonc_CHL]

The one that burned down usually only has one or two guns in the store, they are a sister property to the one in CP now. Last time I was at the Best in CP the guy said they have more guns then they know what to do with right now, a lot of people pawned and never picked up so they have a lot still in the back and not all on the floor. They seem to have the most changing selection I have seen.
This Cash America does I just googled and made sure it was the one I was thinking of. Now the CASH PAWN across 183 does not sell guns, I don think any of the CASH PAWNS do.