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Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 10:43 am
by The Annoyed Man
jamisjockey wrote:Katygunnut wrote:The Annoyed Man wrote:flechero wrote:How can the barber not give you permission to OC inside his own shop?
Because it isn't
your place of employment?
I learn new things every day. So can an owner of private property give permission to OC, but just not if there is a business that is open to the public on that private property?
I'm pretty sure that I can allow someone to handle a handgun and otherwise OC in my house, and on my land. Is this correct? If so, then is the distinction in this case solely related to the fact that there is a business operating on that private property which is open to the public?
Do I understand this correctly?
No.
Here is what I meant....
I believe that a business owner can give his/her
employees permission to open carry on the premises. Witness some gunstores and shooting ranges where the employees open carry. But that same business owner can't give his
customers permission to open carry. At least, that is how I understand it.
I could be wrong.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 10:55 am
by texanron
I have to remove my rig when I get a haircut......I shave my head in the shower.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 11:10 am
by LittleGun
My barber is gun-friendly and knows that I carry. My gun remains concealed while I am there. I don't want other customers knowing that I carry.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 11:12 am
by USA1
texanron wrote:I have to remove my rig when I get a haircut......I shave my head in the shower.
I've been doing my own hair since 1997.
A clipper with a #2 guard and the wife cleans up the edges.
As for the original post...Every red blooded, God fearin Texan should be able
to open carry in a barber shop if he wants to IMO.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 11:15 am
by Katygunnut
The Annoyed Man wrote:jamisjockey wrote:Katygunnut wrote:The Annoyed Man wrote:flechero wrote:How can the barber not give you permission to OC inside his own shop?
Because it isn't
your place of employment?
I learn new things every day. So can an owner of private property give permission to OC, but just not if there is a business that is open to the public on that private property?
I'm pretty sure that I can allow someone to handle a handgun and otherwise OC in my house, and on my land. Is this correct? If so, then is the distinction in this case solely related to the fact that there is a business operating on that private property which is open to the public?
Do I understand this correctly?
No.
Here is what I meant....
I believe that a business owner can give his/her
employees permission to open carry on the premises. Witness some gunstores and shooting ranges where the employees open carry. But that same business owner can't give his
customers permission to open carry. At least, that is how I understand it.
I could be wrong.
I am trying to understand the distinction between a business owner giving customers the right to OC on premises and a home owner giving a visitor the right to OC in his house. If the latter is against the law, then that would seem to be very intrusive to me.
Certain businesses obviously do give customers the right to OC. Namely shooting ranges (while on the actual range) and hunting outfitters that operate on private property. I'm assuming that these fall under specific exemptions.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 11:58 am
by Keith B
Katygunnut wrote:I am trying to understand the distinction between a business owner giving customers the right to OC on premises and a home owner giving a visitor the right to OC in his house. If the latter is against the law, then that would seem to be very intrusive to me.
Certain businesses obviously do give customers the right to OC. Namely shooting ranges (while on the actual range) and hunting outfitters that operate on private property. I'm assuming that these fall under specific exemptions.
Neither can give you permission to open carry per the statutes. You can only do it on property you are in control of.
The exemption for displaying your firearm per TPC 46.02 is in TPC 46.15 which nullifies 46.02 if you are engaged in a sporting activity (shooting at a range) or hunting
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 12:01 pm
by jamisjockey
Here's how I see it:
As a homeowner, business owner or employee, you have the right to ask people to leave. You are responsible and have control over the premises. I would then presume the only time the provisions of PC 46.02 can be waived, then, are when you are responsible for and have control over the premises. Paid employee is a no brainer, as you are a paid representative of the business owner.
As a customer, you're not a representative of the business owner.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 1:02 pm
by Katygunnut
Keith B wrote:Katygunnut wrote:I am trying to understand the distinction between a business owner giving customers the right to OC on premises and a home owner giving a visitor the right to OC in his house. If the latter is against the law, then that would seem to be very intrusive to me.
Certain businesses obviously do give customers the right to OC. Namely shooting ranges (while on the actual range) and hunting outfitters that operate on private property. I'm assuming that these fall under specific exemptions.
Neither can give you permission to open carry per the statutes. You can only do it on property you are in control of.
The exemption for displaying your firearm per TPC 46.02 is in TPC 46.15 which nullifies 46.02 if you are engaged in a sporting activity (shooting at a range) or hunting
Thanks. So if I understand this correctly, I cannot have a friend come to my house, and have him show me his new gun (assuming he would actually handle the gun in doing so). By the same token, I cannot let him hold my new gun. Is this correct? Its hard to believe that we are really this restricted in what we can do within our own home.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 3:56 pm
by jamisjockey
Not if he's carrying it concealed under the authority of his CHL. He could bring it over in a case for you to look at.
Now, its a technicality. The odds are that there is no way on god's green earth that someone will know your friend showed you his concealed firearm in your private residience.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 5:45 pm
by Katygunnut
jamisjockey wrote:Not if he's carrying it concealed under the authority of his CHL. He could bring it over in a case for you to look at.
Now, its a technicality. The odds are that there is no way on god's green earth that someone will know your friend showed you his concealed firearm in your private residience.
I'd say highly unlikely, but not impossible. For example, I have windows next to my front door that allow you to see into my living room. Maybe a sales person peers inside and sees 2 guys walking around with guns. He could think it was a robbery in progress and report it to the police. When they arrive and figure out that one person doesn't live there, you have a pretty clear case of illegal OC, I believe.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 7:00 pm
by jamisjockey
Yep. But, like Mr. Cotton says, you gotta have a whole lotta unicorns for this scenerio to play out.
First, you gotta have a reason for the police to even find out about it. Then, you have to have a cop who thinks that there is enough of an issue to contact the DA to press charges. Then, a DA who wants to press charges. Then, a judge who thinks its worth allowing it to go to trial, and lastly, a jury that thinks its not a joke.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 8:42 pm
by NEB
Well, it may be technically illegal OC, but it sounds like a crock of stinky brown to me. I guess it just comes down to how much I want to become case law or not, huh
. As was previously suggested, a whole lot of what-ifs would have to occur for anything to ever come of it. Personally, I would have absolutely no problem with someone uncovering in my own home.
--NEB
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 8:44 pm
by C-dub
And long guns are okay to OC just about anywhere. One will get quite a bit of attention, but it is still legal.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 8:49 pm
by Beiruty
Most of you are taken this extreme serious. Just relax.
When my next door ex-LEO knew I was carrying, he asked me to bring my carry piece to have a look at it. So, I openly brought my P30 over and went from my Garage to his Garage where he was having a hot morning coffee. We enjoyed hot coffee while I was going over the features of my P30. No harm is done and no one called the cops. Just act normally and do not stress it nor try to extend your chances.
Re: Getting a haircut
Posted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:04 pm
by apostate
Katygunnut wrote:Certain businesses obviously do give customers the right to OC. Namely shooting ranges (while on the actual range) and hunting outfitters that operate on private property. I'm assuming that these fall under specific exemptions.
Those fall under Sec. 46.15. NONAPPLICABILITY.
An individual or company can not give you permission to break the law. (Well, I suppose they could, but it has no legal weight.)