TexasCHLforum.com

It's legal to ignore their signs but don't fool yourself into thinking they're gun-friendly.

Shoot Straight wrote:It's legal to ignore their signs but don't fool yourself into thinking they're gun-friendly.

As far as CHLs are concerned, no 30.06 in Texas means gun friendly. Let remember that CHL is about legally carrying in as many places as possible; not about the personal feelings and opinions of business owners.

Embalmo

Like I said, it's legal. If you want to financially reward businesses for posting those signs, that's your choice.

Shoot Straight wrote:Like I said, it's legal. If you want to financially reward businesses for posting those signs, that's your choice.

I'm happy to reward any business that supports my legal right to protect myself and family. And since BWW has chosen to support that legal right by choosing to not post a 30.06 sign, then BWW certainly falls under that category. It is the sign that decides gun-friendliness and this company has consciously chosen to not post 30.06.

Guys, we really need to stop rattling the cages of businesses that allow us to carry in their establishments. CHL is not about personal feelings, it is about the law. And we are fortunate to live in a state where non-30.06 signs don't apply to us. Let's not bother theses businesses to the point that we're banned from them.

Embalmo

I rattled no cage and just walked by it to enjoy a lunch with the fam. Doesn't mean I'll go back to that location any time soon however.

e-bil wrote:I rattled no cage and just walked by it to enjoy a lunch with the fam. Doesn't mean I'll go back to that location any time soon however.

Oh I know-That was directed to the forum in general, and especially to a handful of members who I like to refer to as signage missionaries. These individuals write threatening letters to businesses and rejoice when a gunbuster sign is replaced with a 30.06. Their rationale is that, "They didn't like guns anyway, so it's good that CHLs can no longer go there.

I'm not real keen on these folks who like to make decisions for all of us. I just rejoice in the fact that 30.06 exists in Texas. If there's no 30.06, then my rights aren't being infringed upon. I actually enjoy seeing non-30.06 signs because without them, there might be more compliant signs. The more gunbusters the better!!

Oh I won't go to BWW, but that is only because they wanted to charge me and my wife a $5 cover each for whatever was on the TV on a Saturday night. I would have spent at least $40 on wings that night with my wife, but they wanted to pretend that they had live entertainment. Wings N More is MUCH better in Pflugerville!

Embalmo

BWW gets a big thumbs up in that area.

So you like their wings enough to ignore their policies. No issues with that here. That is your right. I don't like either, so I won't. And that, is my right.

IMO, if they don't know the law, that's not our fault. If it's a corporation, and their attorneys (who couldn't find their noses with both hands and a flashlight) can't get things straight, then so be it. Under Texas law, unless the wording is 30.06 compliant, then CHL holders are able to protect themselves and their families.

Griz44 wrote:

BWW gets a big thumbs up in that area.

So you like their wings enough to ignore their policies. No issues with that here. That is your right. I don't like either, so I won't. And that, is my right.

What policies have I ignored? Their policy is to allow legal concealed carry in their restaurants by purposefully neglecting to post a 30.06 signs. Why should I or any other CHL have a problem with restaurants that allow legal carry?

Embalmo

Embalmo wrote:

Griz44 wrote:

BWW gets a big thumbs up in that area.

So you like their wings enough to ignore their policies. No issues with that here. That is your right. I don't like either, so I won't. And that, is my right.

What policies have I ignored? Their policy is to allow legal concealed carry in their restaurants by purposefully neglecting to post a 30.06 signs. Why should I or any other CHL have a problem with restaurants that allow legal carry?

Embalmo

You really can't make that statement, they may be posting according to company policy and the company may be ignorant of the law in Texas. IMHO just do what the law allows if you choose to patronize there, if not then don't make waves for others

Their policy is to allow legal concealed carry in their restaurants by purposefully neglecting to post a 30.06 signs.

I think this is the point of disagreement between the two sides of this issue. The company is posting a non-compliant sign. Everyone agrees on this point. The question then becomes if they are posting it deliberately to allow people with a CHL to enter or posting it because they don't know any better and it expresses their wishes to ban guns.

Given that there is no reason to post any sign at all unless you wish to ban guns (well, except for that bank sign welcoming CHLs), I personally choose to believe the second. It appears that some choose to believe the first.

I think we can all agree the sign has no legal effect, and that reasonable people can disagree about the intent of the owners. I generally avoid shopping in places with no guns sign when I can, but I don't bother complaining or letting the store know why they lost my business. I don't mind if someone does shop there, as that is their choice.

I also don't mind if someone lets the company know why they won't shop there, as that is also their choice. The only thing I ask is to not tell the company their sign is not valid. You can tell them they are banning the best people in the world, and you can point out how their sign alienates the potential customers with disposable income (as shown by the cost of getting a CHL). None of this will cause them to change the sign, though it might help convince them to stop posting. But if you tell themt he sign is invalid, it might convert it to a legal 30.06 sing, which is NEVER a good thing (IMHO).

Other than the last point, I really don't see this issue as worth us arguing about. Reasonable people can have different opinions.

JP171 wrote:

Embalmo wrote:

Griz44 wrote:

BWW gets a big thumbs up in that area.

So you like their wings enough to ignore their policies. No issues with that here. That is your right. I don't like either, so I won't. And that, is my right.

What policies have I ignored? Their policy is to allow legal concealed carry in their restaurants by purposefully neglecting to post a 30.06 signs. Why should I or any other CHL have a problem with restaurants that allow legal carry?

Embalmo

You really can't make that statement, they may be posting according to company policy and the company may be ignorant of the law in Texas. IMHO just do what the law allows if you choose to patronize there, if not then don't make waves for others

They purposely put up a sign that doesn't say "30.06". The cool thing about intent is that it is perfectly irrelevant in the state of Texas. No 30.06 as far as the law and we are concerned, means "come on in with your legally concealed handgun." How can you get any more pro-2nd amendment than that?

Embalmo wrote:They purposely put up a sign that doesn't say "30.06". The cool thing about intent is that it is perfectly irrelevant in the state of Texas. No 30.06 as far as the law and we are concerned, means "come on in with your legally concealed handgun." How can you get any more pro-2nd amendment than that?

Actually, they purposely put up a sign trying to stop you. They unintentionally failed to stop you.
This argument is like saying that someone who tries to shoots you and misses is your friend.

MasterOfNone wrote:

Embalmo wrote:They purposely put up a sign that doesn't say "30.06". The cool thing about intent is that it is perfectly irrelevant in the state of Texas. No 30.06 as far as the law and we are concerned, means "come on in with your legally concealed handgun." How can you get any more pro-2nd amendment than that?

Actually, they purposely put up a sign trying to stop you. They unintentionally failed to stop you.
This argument is like saying that someone who tries to shoots you and misses is your friend.

These aren't friends. I have no personal feelings for them nor do I care what their personal feelings are for me or the 2nd amendment. The only possible way that they can tread on my right as a CHL is with a 30.06 sign.

What happens when Wal Mart chooses a chairman that is anti-gun and says so publicly? What happens when campus carry passes, but we know that the university president and 99% of the faculty are anti-2nd amendment. What if your wife likes fresh hummus, but you happen to know that the dope smoking hippy manager at Whole Foods doesn't like guns? Should we just all stop carrying guns and stop going places out of general principle.

All I care about is legally carrying a firearm in as many places as the law will allow; I certainly won't let someone else's opinion or personal feelings get in the way. When a business puts up a non-30.06 sign and it keeps CHLs out, it certainly isn't a victory for us. And contrary to the belief of some members, a removed non-30.06 sign can't help us in any way.

Legal carry has nothing to do with opinions or personal feelings. It has to do with the law.

Embalmo

MasterOfNone wrote:

Embalmo wrote:They purposely put up a sign that doesn't say "30.06". The cool thing about intent is that it is perfectly irrelevant in the state of Texas. No 30.06 as far as the law and we are concerned, means "come on in with your legally concealed handgun." How can you get any more pro-2nd amendment than that?

Actually, they purposely put up a sign trying to stop you. They unintentionally failed to stop you.
This argument is like saying that someone who tries to shoots you and misses is your friend.

Since a non-30.06 can never affect me, I think a better analogy would be that someone is shooting at me with a plastic light up Clone Wars blaster and yelling, "Pow pow!" I find that more amusing than offensive.

Embalmo