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Handling and "playing with it" are two wholly different things.
“". Most accidents happen from handling a gun too much”
Strongly disagree, as in completely.
ALL negligent discharges hap[pen from IMPROPER handling a gun… There is no danger or concern at all from properly handling a gun.
“". Most accidents happen from handling a gun too much” is straight up Brady Hand Gun violence and anti gunner talk.

if concerned you may have an ND while handling your weapon, please, unload and clear it, and leave it that way until your trained and confident in your ability to handle your gun.

I assuming, what you wrote and how it came across to me is not what you intended But alas, that is what I read and understood from the words as posted.

My range has the same "all firearms must be unloaded" sign. Because I shoot there often, I respect the rules, I unload before I walk in. That is the most safe parking lot on the planet so I have no problem complying with the rules.

Teamless wrote:

apostate wrote:If he told you orally that's valid 30.06 notice.

I have to disagree with this statement.
Saying that "all guns must be unloaded" is not 30.06.
As 30.06 says you cannot have a gun there, it does not say you can have an "unloaded gun" as the law does not specify loaded or unloaded.

Saying "all guns must be unloaded" to me, when I walk in a gun shop, is that any weapon that I am carrying concealed (not in a range bag, carrying case, etc) will remain concealed and I will take out my range gun(s) and he can do his due diligence to flag the weapon as empty.

Are you saying it's 30.05 notice because it prohibits loaded firearms, not concealed handguns?

...I'm not handling/manipulating my carry weapon in the car/on the parking lot of a gunstore or range...both have been robbed, and I won't give a would-be "hero" anything to misunderstand...if the range has a problem with my carry gun being concealed and loaded till I am at the firing station, I'll find another range...when I try a new holster within the store...I tell the clerk I'm going to try my gun with this holster and do so, back to any other customers...also for the reason of not having any room for a misunderstanding...I was in there one day when an individual came in the door, most definitely casing the place, asking silly questions...he instantly had the attention of all three clerks and me, and I moved behind the counter to get a better angle on him...we believe he was armed...and after he saw the level of alertness, he mumbled out the door...common sense says where guns are...robberies will be...another reason to be armed when going in AND coming out...the parking lot would be an excellent place to relieve someone of his guns...if they're unloaded and he's defenseless...if you choose to give a range your business who demands to see that your gun is unloaded, carry a BUG and DON'T declare it...

tacticool wrote:

Teamless wrote:

apostate wrote:If he told you orally that's valid 30.06 notice.

I have to disagree with this statement.
Saying that "all guns must be unloaded" is not 30.06.
As 30.06 says you cannot have a gun there, it does not say you can have an "unloaded gun" as the law does not specify loaded or unloaded.

Saying "all guns must be unloaded" to me, when I walk in a gun shop, is that any weapon that I am carrying concealed (not in a range bag, carrying case, etc) will remain concealed and I will take out my range gun(s) and he can do his due diligence to flag the weapon as empty.

Are you saying it's 30.05 notice because it prohibits loaded firearms, not concealed handguns?

Looking at 30.05 (from a quick Texas Penal Code google search, the only mention of "firearm" is in the following quote

(A) has firearm proficiency requirements for peace officers

If you are generally saying "trespassing", well, if he said to me, if you have a loaded weapon, leave. then I leave.
if he is saying only unloaded firearms allowed, then as I said, if I am carrying concealed and range bag style, my concealed will stay concealed and loaded, the range bag will be cleared.
Am I correct? Well, I believe so, or I wouldn't have this point.
Could I be a test case, well, sure, but only if this really happened with me, and they caught me carrying concealed and only then if they asked me to leave and I did not.

I admit I have an ulterior motive to my question. They way I see it, a sign prohibiting loaded guns on private property is at least as valid for CHL as a 30.06 sign at a gun show on government property. If it's acceptable for us to ignore the first, it's definitely acceptable to ignore the second, both legally and ethically. At least that's the way I see it.

tacticool wrote: a sign prohibiting loaded guns on private property is at least as valid for CHL

Possibly, but it is not a 30.06 sign, and a sign saying "all guns must be unloaded" is no different than a gun busters sign, walk right by on the way in.

I think he makes a valid point that the unloaded sign is likewise no different from a 30.06 sign at the GRB or Reliant gun shows on property "owned or leased by a governmental entity and" not someplace prohibited "under Section 46.03 or 46.035."

One big difference is oral notice at the gun shop/range would be valid under 30.06 because it's not gov't property.

The range I use has the Men's room between the door out of the showroom and the door into the range. Pretty handy for un-concealing and re-concealing...

mikeintexas wrote:The range I use has the Men's room between the door out of the showroom and the door into the range. Pretty handy for un-concealing and re-concealing...

I'm sure I know that range. The staff will tell you that they don't intend for the sign to apply to CHL holders. And they have never had a problem with unholstering on the line, as long as you're not drawing.

The indoor range I shoot at has the same sort of sign. I raised my eyebrows at it and was quickly assured it had nothing to do with CHLer's. I guess they just don't want the potentially less aware coming into the area with loaded guns and empty heads.

40khammer wrote:As other's have said, that sign is just for idiots that bring guns into the store loaded and play with them. Champions in College Station has a similar sign except that it includes another line something along the lines of "Concealed handguns must stay concealed."

Basically means you did fine right up till you pulled the gun out and showed it to him. Should have just told him the model and let him find a fit. If he's working in a gun store he should be able to tell you what you need.

...should be...but in my range, there're 4 dunnos and one don't care...they just don't exert themselves like folks used to, don't know what's in stock..."Just keep lookin' and if it's there you'll find it"...I know I know, but they're the only show in town...I go 25 miles when I buy a gun just to get a real gunshop...and he's a pawnshop...times have changed!!!

CHLNewbie wrote:I don't believe that orally qualifies under any of the 30.06 definitions that I encountered in my class. Maybe that's something that my class neglected.

[ ETA: OK, I see the oral subsection of 30.06 and how it works. Thanks.]

He saw it because I was shopping for an accessory and he asked whether I had the gun with me, and to see it to look for a fit. But that's also an area I'm also unclear on - the transition from concealed to unconcealed and back.

I have never had any issues with Gun Stores when I decide that the person behind the counter needs to see my carry for some reason (I don't think I would do such a thing at Gander Mountain or Academy). I ask them if I can unload, and if they give consent I pull out the weapon, drop the magazine and eject the round from the chamber and hand it to them. If I ever come across someone not wanting me to do it, I suppose that I will not.
The person behind the counter controls the premises as far as I am concerned, and I personally feel that I am on private property and have permission to unconceal at that point...just like you would do at any gun-show when you first come in and encounter whoever is checking weapons.

...I don't give my weapon to ANYONE but an LEO in public...NEVER my BUG...never can tell when the ball will drop...if I have to hand it off...it'll already be unloaded and I'll be armed with others...you would be rightly acting under his permission...but you'd be vulnerable till you got it back and reloaded...I don't wanna go there...

Same here... I shoot at the range where I took my CHL class. That sign was posted, so I asked the guys behind the counter. Their reply was "Is that a 30.06 sign" & "If it is concealed (as it is suppose to be) , no one will ever know, will they??"
Common sense... a commodity in short supply. When in doubt - ASK!!