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Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 7:12 pm
by flintknapper
cloudcroft wrote:Intense, passionate sermons by Protestant preachers (not sure of Catholic priests) on assorted social/political issues of the day in the early 1770s helped, among other things, both to inform and to motivate American colonists for the Revolutionary War.
Preachers should do that today, too...LOTS of it! The Church has become so timid and emasculated nowadays.
flintknapper,
The Bible doesn't come out AGAINST self-defense, either!
That's the problem with the Bible...it's not CLEAR about a number of important everyday life issues!
So as serious Christians, we each make the call...to be a sheep or a lion.
Your choice, too.
-- John D.
Yes sir, I do believe that was my point.
But, I don't want this to digress from the subject and become a religious debate.
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 10:58 pm
by racer32
KBCraig wrote:I have a few friends who are Christian pacifists. They believe it is always, 100% of the time, against the teachings of Jesus to use force against another person, no matter what the circumstances. They would even reject anyone using force on their behalf in their defense (whether it's me, the Army, or the police).
If I am to be martyred for my faith, I would gladly go to the arms of God. However, laying down my life to a mugger or burglar is not going to spread the Gospel through my blood.
For those friends who reject violence even in self defense, I'm reminded of the tale of the "faithful" person who drowned in a flood waiting for God to save him. God said, "I sent you a truck, and a boat, and a helicopter! What did you want?!"
God gave us tools, the brains to create and use them, and His Spirit to tell us right from wrong. Sometimes, you just gotta trust the voice in your heart.
Kevin
KBC, email them these links, or print them out for them:
http://www.macro-inc.com/ChristiansAndGuns.htm
http://www.seark.net/~jlove/biblebasis.htm
Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2007 12:03 pm
by Popshot
You need to live at peace with everyone, but be prepared to protect yourselves and your family. God didn't call us to be a bunch of sissies.
No ambiguity. No political correctness. Using direct words to make the point crystal clear. How refreshing!
Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2007 2:20 pm
by longtooth
Another one liner that I use often. David was a man after God's own heart but he carried a sword & used it well.
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:05 am
by PWK
Venus Pax wrote:
The passage we were reading was (I think) in Genesis about how Abram took his armed servants and went to Lot's rescue when he was kidnapped by the Sodomites.
It bothers me when someone who should know the Word of God does not know or at least check his facts before using the Bible to make claims. While I agree with the statements in this post, it needs to be pointed out that in Genesis 14 Lot dwelled in Sodom. Sodom fell and its possessions, food and inhabitants were taken by Chedorlaomer and the kings who were with him.
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:08 am
by casselthief
really?
I don't think she meant to start a biblical theology debate.
I see this the same as someone saying, "I believe the law states this"
if they aren't copy+pasting from the PenalCode website, I think they have the right to surmise, and/or paraphrase.
sure, be all about someone misquoting the bible.
what's that phrase, forgive me, I may be a little off, but here goes:
"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."
I'll leave the real religious zealotry to those who are better at it.
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:30 am
by nemesis
35 And He said to them, “When I sent you without money bag, knapsack, and sandals, did you lack anything?�
So they said, “Nothing.�
36 Then He said to them, “But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a knapsack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one.
37 For I say to you that this which is written must still be accomplished in Me: ‘And He was numbered with the transgressors.’[d] For the things concerning Me have an end.�
38 So they said, “Lord, look, here are two swords.�
And He said to them, “It is enough.�
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:58 am
by casselthief
soooo, I should go get a sword?
actually, I have a katana, does that count?
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 1:00 pm
by kw5kw
casselthief wrote:really?
I don't think she meant to start a biblical theology debate.
I see this the same as someone saying, "I believe the law states this"
if they aren't copy+pasting from the PenalCode website, I think they have the right to surmise, and/or paraphrase.
sure, be all about someone misquoting the bible.
what's that phrase, forgive me, I may be a little off, but here goes:
"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."
I'll leave the real religious zealotry to those who are better at it.
Here is the verse you were looking for:
John viii:7b ..., and [He] said unto them,
He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 1:11 pm
by casselthief
I think the point was made, but k'thx.
Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 6:16 pm
by Venus Pax
Although I was paraphrasing, I do like to get it straight.
I did not say, nor did I mean to indicate, that Abram took over Sodom. He simply went down with trained soldiers to rescue a relative.
You can rescue someone in danger without involving yourself in a full take-over.