TexasCHLforum.com

Teamless wrote:

Keith B wrote:One student was being shown how to hold the weapon

So in SC, its normal to teach gun handling during the CHL class, not for someone to learn it BEFORE attempting their qualification?

*sigh*
I suspect every seasoned instructor in Texas has, at one time or another, shown a student or two how to {handle, etc.} a firearm.

Teamless wrote:

Keith B wrote:One student was being shown how to hold the weapon

So in SC, its normal to teach gun handling during the CHL class, not for someone to learn it BEFORE attempting their qualification?

Nothing new, even here in TX. When I took the class there was a couple that were taking the class who had never owned or handled a gun before. They both passed the shooting test. That is all that is required. The instructor however made it a point to make sure everyone was pointing their guns in a safe direction at ALL times and to make sure everyone kept their finger off the bang stick until they were pointed to the target and were ready to fire.

From the latest update:

The instructor said he was unaware the pistol was loaded and accidentally shot Smith in the arm and into her side.

What's rule #1 again?

...don't eat the paste...

Oldgringo wrote:

Teamless wrote:

Keith B wrote:One student was being shown how to hold the weapon

So in SC, its normal to teach gun handling during the CHL class, not for someone to learn it BEFORE attempting their qualification?

*sigh*
I suspect every seasoned instructor in Texas has, at one time or another, shown a student or two how to {handle, etc.} a firearm.

Yeah, but hopefully they remember the firearms safety rules they are SUPPOSED to be teaching and following. If you do that, you may get a bang, but no blood.

As a certified pistol instructor and RSO, it is my responsiblty to keep them from doing something stupid.

Teamless wrote:

Keith B wrote:One student was being shown how to hold the weapon

So in SC, its normal to teach gun handling during the CHL class, not for someone to learn it BEFORE attempting their qualification?

Can't speak to SC, but that is one huge difference I noticed between CHL training here versus CHL training in some other states.

In Texas, the range portion is simply a competency test. You are not there to learn how to shoot, you are there to prove your are competent at doing so.

Many other states accept the NRA Basic Pistol course as meeting the CHL requirements. That course is designed -- precisely -- to teach someone who has never held a handgun how to safety operate one, including their first shots on a range.

Everywhere you go, you will find both good examples and poor examples of instruction quality. In my experience, the better instructors teaching NRA Basic Pistol courses are very pro-active about keeping a good student-instructor ratio for the range portion. They either bring in some extra instructors while on the range to keep it to about 2 students per instructor, or they limit the number of students shooting simultaneously so that it is still 2 students per instructor.

One instructor can easily teach the classroom portion of a course to 15-20 people, but there is no way in heck one instructor can safely supervise 15-20 newbies simultaneously handling a firearm for the first time. That requires much closer supervision -- being close enough to physically reach out and stop a student from performing an unsafe act immediately, if necessary.

That is why I am interested in the original story. It was taught by a deputy, and I am curious about how the newbies were supervised on the range.

The instructor (Deputy) accidentally (negligently) shot the student.
I hope they pull his teaching credentials and suspend him at minimum from the department.

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Teamless wrote:

Keith B wrote:One student was being shown how to hold the weapon

So in SC, its normal to teach gun handling during the CHL class, not for someone to learn it BEFORE attempting their qualification?

This is the case everywhere.
When I took my NC class, I specifically took the firing position at the left end of the line (so I wold be facing the other shooters), since there were several people in the class I absolutely did not trust to handle a weapon safely and the whole class was shooting simultaneously. When I took the TX class, I was quite relieved to find out that each shooter was tested separately, as there were two (out of only 5 in the class including myself) people that clearly did not know how to safely handle a weapon. Watching their hands shaking standing in the waiting room before shooting was not confidence-inspiring.

Lots of inexperienced people get licenses. I'm ok with that. Just don't ask me to line up next to or near them.

JJVP wrote:

Keith B wrote:Updated info here http://www.wyff4.com/r/30491738/detail.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Was a ND during the live fire portion of the class. One student was being shown how to hold the weapon and it discharged striking another student.

The injured student (a female) was driven to the convenience store and flown by helicopter to the hospital. She is reported to be out of surgery and in stable condition. The class was being taught by an off-duty Spartanburg County Deputy, who is a certified to teach the classes by South Carolina Law Enforcement Division.

Deputies said an investigation showed that the student's weapon was not put in a safe condition prior to the instructor helping the student with the proper grip of the weapon.

So pointing the gun, in safe condition, towards another person is right? It was the instructors responsibility to ensure the gun was pointed in a safe direction while instructing the student on the proper grip technique.

Here is EXACTLY the reason I would never teach a gun class as an unincorporated individual "DBA", without having the protection of a corporation. Never, never, NEVER.

You can bet that instructor will be held liable, and if their insurance (assuming they have insurance) doesn't cover the damages awarded and they don't have corporate protection, they could lose everything they've worked for their entire life.

n5wd wrote:From the latest update:

The instructor said he was unaware the pistol was loaded and accidentally shot Smith in the arm and into her side.

What's rule #1 again?

Whoa! Back up a second. It wasn't another student who shot them?

The instructor shot them?

Lambda Force wrote:

n5wd wrote:From the latest update:

The instructor said he was unaware the pistol was loaded and accidentally shot Smith in the arm and into her side.

What's rule #1 again?

Whoa! Back up a second. It wasn't another student who shot them?

The instructor shot them?

student who was having trouble with the grip of her .22 caliber pistol.

A.22 caliber? They allow .22's to qualify for CHL?

Both of my classes at The Bullet Trap emphasized that each student would have to demonstrate the safe operation of their weapon including the safety's. It's a little funny because at my last renewal after the instructor said this he asked if anyone was using a Glock. It was a big class, 30+, and I was shocked that I was the only one that was. When he asked me how to activate my safety some smartypants in the back chimed in that Glocks don't have safety's. The class laughed and the instructor just starred at me until I said to keep your finger off the trigger. He said, "Fine. Now for the rest of you ..."

They related a story of a guy that came in the day before his "first" class to practice up a bit and brought in a fully loaded gun and whipped it out right there at the counter. Whoever it was behind the counter, who had just been swept, asked if he could see the gun and it was handed over. The BT employee checked and sure enough, there was a round chambered. According to the story the BT employee, also an instructor, then asked if the guy had any of his paperwork with him and if he could see it. The guy fished everything out and handed it over. The BT employee found the qualification form, I don't know the number, and put FAILED on it and told the guy he didn't need to come back for the class.

JJVP wrote:

Lambda Force wrote: student who was having trouble with the grip of her .22 caliber pistol.

A.22 caliber? They allow .22's to qualify for CHL?

There is no minimum caliber requirement for SC like there is in Texas. The main thing they are looking for is that you are aware of handling and firring it safely (which apparently their instructor doesn't know how to do. )

JJVP wrote:A.22 caliber? They allow .22's to qualify for CHL?

Nothing about minimum caliber in the second amendment.