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Beiruty, quick question.....

Were you more concerned about the non-compliant sign, or the obviousness of the fannypack? Another way to ask the question would be: if you had been carrying by a less obvious means which better concealed your handgun, would you have been more likely to just walk right past the non-compliant sign?

Here is why I ask: I will respect a lawful sign and not carry past it. When confronted with an unlawful sign, I make a mental calculus.......(Is my method of concealment likely to betray that I am carrying a gun?) + (Am I likely to be arrested if found out, or just asked to leave?) = (Do I leave my gun in the car or carry it inside with me?). If my method of concealment pretty much guarantees that nobody is going to notice my gun, then I would be perfectly comfortable carrying past a non-compliant sign, and I have done so a number of times.

The point of all this is that maybe a fannypack is not the best EDC method. I own one, and I even occasionally use it (or my "Fatboy-S Versipack), but I only use it in very specific and limited circumstances because, like Shinesintx pointed out, a fannypack pretty much screams "GUN!" to anybody likely to notice these things.

The Annoyed Man wrote:
....a fannypack pretty much screams "GUN!" to anybody likely to notice these things.

Granted, it's been many, many moons since we lived in the Orlando area and visited DisneyWorld, Sea World or other Orlando attractions but if what TAM says above is true, nearly every tourist there had a GUN.

Maybe they don't wear fanny packs anymore at DisneyWorld? Somebody'll have to tell me as I have no plans to revisit those places.

this subject has got me thinking and wondering about 2 scenarios . and since i see some senior posters here id like to jump on this

1 ) lets say he did carry in a fanny pack knowing the sign is incorrect . management is suspicious, could management simply call the police on you without ever asking or warning you ? if so would the police have a reason to search you if the sign is incorrect from the start . ( i guess i know the police can and will search ) but why ? its a carry state and the business is not posted correctly and you have done nothing wrong to warrant suspicion except wear a particular article of clothing. Can i just call the police and say i think that someone is committing No crime and making No threats but has a gun , search them ?

2) worse case , you Do carry . the sign is 100% unenforceable and you end up shooting someone in a legitimate self defense act . at what point is the 30.06 clarified ? after you sit in jail for god knows how long ? is is this a matter that would be recognized immediately ?

sorry for all the what if's but how hard is it for local authorities to discover who is right in this case . it almost sounds not worth being hard headed and just avoiding the place all together but i know its hard sometimes , you dont want to be the party pooper just because you wont disarm , im sure most outside this forum would say just dont carry your gun but that's ridiculous to most on this forum

The Annoyed Man wrote:Beiruty, quick question.....

Were you more concerned about the non-compliant sign, or the obviousness of the fannypack? Another way to ask the question would be: if you had been carrying by a less obvious means which better concealed your handgun, would you have been more likely to just walk right past the non-compliant sign?

Here is why I ask: I will respect a lawful sign and not carry past it. When confronted with an unlawful sign, I make a mental calculus.......(Is my method of concealment likely to betray that I am carrying a gun?) + (Am I likely to be arrested if found out, or just asked to leave?) = (Do I leave my gun in the car or carry it inside with me?). If my method of concealment pretty much guarantees that nobody is going to notice my gun, then I would be perfectly comfortable carrying past a non-compliant sign, and I have done so a number of times.

The point of all this is that maybe a fannypack is not the best EDC method. I own one, and I even occasionally use it (or my "Fatboy-S Versipack), but I only use it in very specific and limited circumstances because, like Shinesintx pointed out, a fannypack pretty much screams "GUN!" to anybody likely to notice these things.

Great analysis. On this trip. I only carried my P30 in the fannypack. I wanted to bring along my PX4SC that rides deep in a smartcarry (worn out good and still holding). If I had my EDC in samrtcarry, I would walked past that sign.
TAM, your analysis is spot on. Thanks for sharing.

rcasady wrote:this subject has got me thinking and wondering about 2 scenarios . and since i see some senior posters here id like to jump on this

1 ) lets say he did carry in a fanny pack knowing the sign is incorrect . management is suspicious, could management simply call the police on you without ever asking or warning you ? if so would the police have a reason to search you if the sign is incorrect from the start . ( i guess i know the police can and will search ) but why ? its a carry state and the business is not posted correctly and you have done nothing wrong to warrant suspicion except wear a particular article of clothing. Can i just call the police and say i think that someone is committing No crime and making No threats but has a gun , search them ?

2) worse case , you Do carry . the sign is 100% unenforceable and you end up shooting someone in a legitimate self defense act . at what point is the 30.06 clarified ? after you sit in jail for god knows how long ? is is this a matter that would be recognized immediately ?

sorry for all the what if's but how hard is it for local authorities to discover who is right in this case . it almost sounds not worth being hard headed and just avoiding the place all together but i know its hard sometimes , you dont want to be the party pooper just because you wont disarm , im sure most outside this forum would say just dont carry your gun but that's ridiculous to most on this forum

1) I guess, if no crime is committed, one would not be searched. However, a gun post an valid or invalid 30.06 is enough reason to search the suspect. And, yes anyone can call 911 for a man with a gun.
2) If the 30.06 is valid or otherwise, if justified shooting happened on the premise. You are covered and 30.06 posted premises is no more off limits.

This is why I like to always have a BUG in my car (either my S&W 642 or a pocket 9). I am prepared just in case I need to make an unexpected stop somewhere it would be uncomfortable if people spotted me, but where it is still legal to carry.

On another note, it really irritates me when people observe non-compliant 30.06 signs because they are worried about being arrested despite fully obeying the law. LEO's have the power to arrest people and they can and do sometimes arrest people who are clearly following all laws. However, this is a rare occurence and the only way to completely eliminate the small likelihood of this happening would be to completely avoid all possibility of interacting with LEO's, by hiding out in your house, etc.

This is kind of like saying that there is a small chance that someone might decide to seriously beat me in an unprovoked attack, and even though I might be able to sue them, I would have to spend time in a hospital, and would likely have to miss work and pay out of pocket medical costs, etc. Since I don't want to be "a test case" I instead choose to avoid all contact with other human beings unless it is absolutely essential.

Bad things happen. People (including LEO's) sometimes violate our rights and otherwise hurt us. I accept this as a reality and choose not to forego my rights just to eliminate the small likelihood that someone may do something bad to me.

Beiruty wrote:

C-dub wrote:I'm confused. I don't want your HR to go up again, but if you know the sign is not compliant why did you disarm?

I was carrying in tommy's gun pack. a one like this:



And as I explained above I could be arrested for a non-compliant 30.06 notice.

Why would you think that anyone would believe that just because you have a fanny pack, that it automatically calls for a Man with a Gun? I believe that for the place you were in it is the optimal concealment option. Allows you full movement ( pocket carry could hinder bending over) and unlikely to have your gun accidentally exposed (you shirt could creep up exposing your gun on IWB or OWB carry). The pack you posted has two compartments. A "private" one in the back for the gun and a "public" one in the front. Just put your cell phone or a small camera in the "public" compartment. Make it point of removing the camera or cell phone from the "public" compartment in front of everyone and the only thing people will think is "there is a guy with a camera or cell phone fanny pack. That looks great. Maybe I should get one". That is, if they are even paying attention at all about what you have strapped around you waist.

JJVP wrote: That is, if they are even paying attention at all about what you have strapped around you waist.

If there were some way to anonymously query folks without pointing attention to the fanny pack (which is, of course, impossible), I'd wager that most folks never gave it a second thought. Here on the forum where everyone is familiar with places to conceal a weapon, is not the reality of "publicland Texas".

n5wd wrote:

JJVP wrote: That is, if they are even paying attention at all about what you have strapped around you waist.

If there were some way to anonymously query folks without pointing attention to the fanny pack (which is, of course, impossible), I'd wager that most folks never gave it a second thought. Here on the forum where everyone is familiar with places to conceal a weapon, is not the reality of "publicland Texas".

Back when I lived in California, as far back as the mid-1980s, long before I ever got my first gun or became interested in owning one, and LOOOOONG before I ever moved to Texas and got a CHL, I knew that some people carried guns in fannypacks, and I would sometimes wonder if "that guy over there with the fannypack" was carrying or not.........of course I assumed (silly me) that if he were, it was because he was a cop.

Why? Because I had a lot of cop friends from my days of working in an ER, and most of them used fannypacks to carry when they were off-duty.

I'm just sayin'....