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I'm not sure about California, or even Texas for that matter, but I would imagine there is no legal authority for a company to force a person to pay a "fine" for attempting to steal something and getting caught. But I don't blame them for trying as a way to prevent repeat offenders.

I'm assuming the worst the company could do is refuse to do business with that person in the future. I don't think it is something they could send to collections or get a court to enforce. I suppose they could sue the offender in civil small claims court....

Petty dirty thieves.

drumbdummer wrote:

Oldgringo wrote:Don't steal....

I seem to recall something along these lines in the book of Exodus!

Both my wife and I remember with crystal clarity our early childhoods. We had both stolen something small, IDRC what hers was but mine was a roll of lifesavers (if I had only known all I needed was to order a Crossbreed holster). Both of our respective parents whooped us and then marched us back to the stores where we had to speak to the store manager and admit to stealing (yes we had to use that word) and apologize for our actions. I am not sure how deeply the whooping affected me, but the humiliation of admitting the theft burns to this day. Neither of us strayed into that realm again.

You can develop your own theories why it happens so much today but I suspect it has a lot to do with the infrequency of similar disciplinary tacks.

The Texas Theft Liability Act Texas is a civil statute which allows suit to be brought against someone in civil court for money losses (Tex.Civ.Prac.&Rem.C. Chapter 134). Section 134.003 says, “a person who commits theft is liable for the damages resulting from the theft.” Section 134.005(a)(1) states, “the amount of actual damages found by the trier of fact and, in addition to actual damages awarded by the trier of fact in a sum not to exceed $1,000.” "Corporate" will say they had the cost of anti-shoplifting expenses as damages and will come up with some wild number as their actual "damages".

airbornecpa wrote:The Texas Theft Liability Act Texas is a civil statute which allows suit to be brought against someone in civil court for money losses (Tex.Civ.Prac.&Rem.C. Chapter 134). Section 134.003 says, “a person who commits theft is liable for the damages resulting from the theft.” Section 134.005(a)(1) states, “the amount of actual damages found by the trier of fact and, in addition to actual damages awarded by the trier of fact in a sum not to exceed $1,000.” "Corporate" will say they had the cost of anti-shoplifting expenses as damages and will come up with some wild number as their actual "damages".

Don't steal...

JALLEN wrote:Does someone ever walk out forgetting to pay for something? Probably. As my short term memory becomes less and less reliable, I can see something like this happening, and hopefully, these can be sorted out accurately as they infrequently occur.

Been there, done that. Something gets hidden in the bottom of the cart behind the diaper bag or under the baby carrier or whatever. Every time it's happened to me, I've turned around and paid for it. I think *once* I didn't immediately go back in -- kids were screaming and crazy and I was going nuts and cold food in the trunk and so on. But I went back the next day and took care of it.

The worst I've ever done was when my son (2 or 3 at the time) knocked a glass jar off a low shelf. It broke and salsa was everywhere. I tried to pay for it but they wouldn't let me, and I really felt bad about it. I made my son apologize to the manager and to the employee who had to clean it up (it was a small store, so they weren't strangers to him). I wasn't too hard on him because it was an accident, but I made sure he saw that someone had to work to clean up his mess and explained to him that the store lost money when he broke their things.

MotherBear wrote:

JALLEN wrote:Does someone ever walk out forgetting to pay for something? Probably. As my short term memory becomes less and less reliable, I can see something like this happening, and hopefully, these can be sorted out accurately as they infrequently occur.

Been there, done that. Something gets hidden in the bottom of the cart behind the diaper bag or under the baby carrier or whatever. Every time it's happened to me, I've turned around and paid for it. I think *once* I didn't immediately go back in -- kids were screaming and crazy and I was going nuts and cold food in the trunk and so on. But I went back the next day and took care of it.

The worst I've ever done was when my son (2 or 3 at the time) knocked a glass jar off a low shelf. It broke and salsa was everywhere. I tried to pay for it but they wouldn't let me, and I really felt bad about it. I made my son apologize to the manager and to the employee who had to clean it up (it was a small store, so they weren't strangers to him). I wasn't too hard on him because it was an accident, but I made sure he saw that someone had to work to clean up his mess and explained to him that the store lost money when he broke their things.

I had a real estate broker get nailed for petty theft when he was in a store absentmindly thumbing through some paperbacks, put one in a pocket to buy then kept on perusing, and walked out of the store having forgotten about the book he had pocketed. Unfortunately, he tended towards hot-headedness and when accosted got belligerent and defensive instead of admitting and trying to smooth it over. He had the cash to have paid for it. Anyway, then without getting advice, he pled guilty. That cost him his RE license, at least for awhile.

I've almost forgotten to pay for something before. I ran in to pick up a few items quickly which ended up turning into a few more things than I had planned. However, since I had not been planning to buy much, I hadn't taken a cart. I ended up juggling a few small objects and placed something in my jacket pocket while walking to the cashiers so I would stop dropping it (it kept sliding off the stack of other things I was carrying). Fortunately, when I put my hand in my pocket for my wallet, I discovered it before trying to leave the store.

I usually end up on the other end of things. I pay for my groceries, and forget to load a bag in the cart!

JSThane wrote:I usually end up on the other end of things. I pay for my groceries, and forget to load a bag in the cart!

yep left $20 in the cash pickup once after we went back the people there said nope we see nothing 2 young guys.

We've been fortunate, I guess, in that all our cashiers are older ladies that take a liking to my wife and I.

And because she's looking over my shoulder and specifically requested his appearance, here is a dancing banana.

My wife and her mother, bless her heart, were grazers. Always went to the market on Wednesday at 10:30 am. They checked everything in the produce dept. to "make sure it's fresh", asked for 10 samples of cheese and meats in the deli dept. then bought 1/2 pound of American cheese and 1/2 pound of roast beef, The open bin Brach's candy needed to be sampled. They didn't open packages, but just about anything sold by the pound was fair game. The first time I went to the market with her I was shocked and surprised, she hadn't thought she'd done anything wrong. She'd learned the behavior from her mom(general officers wife, R)
They finally got their comeuppance at a Smitty's market. "Nana" had come to visit her little angels and had accompanied her daughter to the market. They weren't arrested, but the manager let it be known that our custom was no longer welcome.
The wife has never been able to break the habit of nibbling at the market. Now though, she'll open a bag of the little powdered donuts and place the remaining product on the checkout stand belt and pay for them.

tiviti wrote:I've almost forgotten to pay for something before. I ran in to pick up a few items quickly which ended up turning into a few more things than I had planned. However, since I had not been planning to buy much, I hadn't taken a cart. I ended up juggling a few small objects and placed something in my jacket pocket while walking to the cashiers so I would stop dropping it (it kept sliding off the stack of other things I was carrying). Fortunately, when I put my hand in my pocket for my wallet, I discovered it before trying to leave the store.

I got clear out to my car and realized I'd forgotten to pay once. Fortunately the cashier thanked me for my honesty when I went back in all embarrassed.

mewalke wrote:I'm not sure about California, or even Texas for that matter, but I would imagine there is no legal authority for a company to force a person to pay a "fine" for attempting to steal something and getting caught. But I don't blame them for trying as a way to prevent repeat offenders.

I'm assuming the worst the company could do is refuse to do business with that person in the future. I don't think it is something they could send to collections or get a court to enforce. I suppose they could sue the offender in civil small claims court....

Petty dirty thieves.

It would be characterized as "damages", not a fine.

Article indicated to me one approach is to cut a deal with a legal firm to write the letters and include the "legal expenses" as part of the damages.

OT Grazers: Joe Almonza was the heir apparent to a huge cocaine cartel until he started using and ended up in prison where he was baptized into Christ and is now a dynamic preacher and prison ministry leader. He tells a story of his early days as a new Christian where he and his wife were shopping and he eats a grape. His wife tells him that he can't do that as he has not paid for it and sends him straight to the cashier. Here is the exchange as closely as I can remember his telling of the story:

Joe, "How much for a grape?"
Cashier (shocked expression), "Excuse me?"
Joe, "How much for a grape? I ate one and so I need to pay for it."
Cashier, "Uh, sir, we don't have anyway of figuring that out?"
Joe, "Can you estimate?"
Cashier, "Sir I really have no idea, they are sold by the pound. Just a few cents I guess."
Joe, "Here's a dollar, that ought to cover a few of my friends who may come in later."


FWIW, I have bought so many pounds of useless grapes following this standard, I figure they owe me enough to cover the occasional sampling before I buy. Yup, I can rationalize just about anything.