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The problem is time...you don't have any. By the time he/she announced they were LEO I hope this thing would be done. By that I mean BG's down or gone or myself and family gone.

I carry my gun for the survivability of myself, my family or in rare cases a third person.

"Or must you step in to defend him and everyone else and remain in control of your weapon?"

Must?

No.

JALLEN wrote:You wouldn't want a cop to lose his job for shooting someone with a weapon he had not qualified on, would you?

The local LEO's carry Glock .40's or whatever, you hand him a Sig 9mm. He hasn't qualified with that weapon, there is no paperwork.... Good Grief!

I'd hate to think what would happen if I handed this guy my P7M8, a type he likely has never seen or handled! Talk about a monkey with a saxophone, under pressure!!!

That wouldn't be an issue. All policies I have ever read allow an officer to use any weapon in an emergency.

WildBill wrote:

Excaliber wrote:The downed officer replied that if he was a real cop, he'd have his own gun and told him to get away from him pronto.

That's exactly what the rest of us said when he recounted what happened.

So - did anything change after that incident?

Yes.

The officer in question carried a .44 Magnum in a shoulder holster for 2 weeks, after which he.......wait for it:

went back to not carrying a gun off duty.

It's further proof that, while ignorance is unfortunate, it can be cured by education....but....stupid is forever.

If they are not comfortable carrying a gun they know in their daily life, i am not at all comfortable with them handling my gun in a high stress situation. I sure wouldn't volunteer to give my handgun to some stranger who claims to be a cop.

Excaliber wrote:It's further proof that, while ignorance is unfortunate, it can be cured by education....but....stupid is forever.

I would use the "banghead" smilie, but it would just give me a headache.

CHLLady wrote:Consider an off duty officer (unarmed) faces down several BG's either in a convenience store or restaurant situation are you allowed to pass him your weapon to control the situation?

Yes it's allowed but several people including retired LEO have explained why it's probably a bad idea.

CHLLady wrote:Or must you step in to defend him and everyone else and remain in control of your weapon?

I don't think you have that duty under the law. Whether you have a personal obligation to rescue somebody who leaps out of a plane without a parachute is something you have to decide for yourself.

texanjoker wrote:

JALLEN wrote:You wouldn't want a cop to lose his job for shooting someone with a weapon he had not qualified on, would you?

The local LEO's carry Glock .40's or whatever, you hand him a Sig 9mm. He hasn't qualified with that weapon, there is no paperwork.... Good Grief!

I'd hate to think what would happen if I handed this guy my P7M8, a type he likely has never seen or handled! Talk about a monkey with a saxophone, under pressure!!!

That wouldn't be an issue. All policies I have ever read allow an officer to use any weapon in an emergency.

Never underestimate the stupidity of a lawyer employed by a bureaucracy. I can quite easily envision this scenario with my employer. They're so "particular" about what we are and aren't allowed to do that if we wear out / break our issued pistol, and get issued an identical pistol to replace it, we are considered "decertified" to carry until we requalify with the new gun, because "every gun is different, and you don't know how it will handle or react."

Yes, in exigent circumstances, the exigency of the circumstance is its own justification, but that does not and will not keep (and has not kept) the lawyers from attempting to hang the officer out to dry.

Shoot Straight wrote:

CHLLady wrote:Consider an off duty officer (unarmed) faces down several BG's either in a convenience store or restaurant situation are you allowed to pass him your weapon to control the situation?

Yes it's allowed but several people including retired LEO have explained why it's probably a bad idea.

CHLLady wrote:Or must you step in to defend him and everyone else and remain in control of your weapon?

I don't think you have that duty under the law. Whether you have a personal obligation to rescue somebody who leaps out of a plane without a parachute is something you have to decide for yourself.

I wouldn't. Odds are, a cop that refuses to carry off-duty is going to be playing "mental catch-up" the entire time. I don't want that covering my six, thankyouverymuch. I know several who won't carry off-duty, because it "won't happen to them." (You'd think they know better - we've had thugs target off-duty cops and cops' houses more than once, but it never sinks in). Those cops who have thought about it, realized that not only can it happen, but if the perp is someone they know, they're MORE of a target, they're already going to be carrying.

Fortunately, an unarmed off-duty cop will probably have the same reaction sequence as an unarmed non-cop: stay out of the way, comply, and/or run away. They're not likely to go demanding someone's back up gun.

As for LEO being unarmed, I associate that with one of us being unarmed, WHY? I know of LEO's that do not carry when off duty and I also know of license holders that don't carry all of the time. Again, WHY? As one of our long time members, moderator, and good friend has in his signature line "carry 24/7 or guess right". That hold true for everyone, not just those with a CHL. (Thanks LT)

I spent the money to be able to arm myself to protect my family and myself, so do the LEO's. So why not carry when you can.

Now, if an off duty LEO is unarmed, in or out of uniform and tries to confront a BG with a weapon drawn, then he is on his own as far as I am concerned. If out of uniform, how am I to know he is actually the LEO?. Now if said BG with a weapon turns toward me or my family before we can exit, then I will attempt to draw and fire but I will not pass anyone my weapon, PERIOD, unless ordered to by a uniformed officer.

After being disarmed during a traffic stop for a burned out bulb, I decided my guns are for me and mine, not for people who disarm me and mine.

Give up my weapon? You have better odds of winning every lottery from this day forward. If you want to use a weapon, you should have brought your own..

WildBill wrote:

Excaliber wrote:The downed officer replied that if he was a real cop, he'd have his own gun and told him to get away from him pronto.

If I ever find myself in that situation, I just might use that same line.

NavAir wrote:In addition to all the other points so ably made already, I am a better shot with my weapon than he/she is...

I can't think of a better way to make us both liable to civil litigation than to hand him/her a weapon.
I'll observe. Call me a coward. Welcome to the litigious USA.

I would no sooner give up a gun to an off duty cop than I would to a circus a clown.