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Posted: **Wed Feb 08, 2017 11:08 pm**

I agree with the recommendations for the M&P 15. I think it is a good value. I have the plain Jane M4gery with an Acog on top. (The Acog cost more than the rifle.)

One thing to consider is rifling twist rate. Most OTC AR's have a nine inch twist. That is good for bullets up to 69 grains. If you want to shoot heavier bullets or tracers, get a rifle with a seven inch twist, I.e., a Colt.

Posted: **Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:06 am**

Lynyrd wrote:
Odiferous wrote:
Lynyrd wrote:...don't settle for one without a forward assist...
Not wanting to start the forward assist religious debate, but just thought your phrasing was interesting. I usually see the lack of a FA called a feature (often costing more) rather than something to settle for.
There is a reason for the forward assist. I have needed it, and wouldn't want to be without it.

Yes, the reason for the forward assist is that the Army couldn't let go of the design of the M1 and M14 with operating rods. While the military still trains SPORTS for stoppages, many shooting schools no longer do. For a battle field rifle that may not get proper cleaning and maintenance regularly, it has it's place. For a civilian rifle that is used at the range, I would rather clear the round than force it into the chamber.

Have a M&P 15 Sport (the original one) and a BCM rilfe... have not needed forward assist on either.

To the OP, for a range rilfe, plinker, HD... the M&P Sport 2 is hard to beat IF you like how it comes and are going to leave it mostly stock.

Posted: **Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:32 am**

We all have our favorite AR's and not so favorites: Favorites - Colt LE6920 / Noveske / Daniel Defense / BCM to name a new.

Not so favorite: Bushmaster / DPMS / Windham Weaponry

Here's a rule of thumb when buying an AR: A couple of hundred dollars more will get you a "Much Higher Quality" AR. Why get a Bushmaster when you can get a Colt LE6920 or another higher quality AR for just a few hundred dollars more? In the long run, you'll save money if you become an avid shooter. Higher quality means fewer break downs or poor performance.

For further information look at m4Carbine.net - The members there have strong opinions regarding AR's generally backed with first hand knowledge.

Posted: **Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:17 am**

JRG wrote:I have finally decided to enter the AR-15 arena and purchase one. This being my initial rifle purchase, I am seeking out the wisdom of this group.

I would like to keep this purchase under $1000. This would primarily be a range toy, home defense gun. I don't go hunting ever, however, I would like a scope or red dot or some such on it.

I don't necessarily want one with all the bells and whistles, but also do not want one that is so cheap that some parts need to be replaced to make it function properly.

I am not skilled enough to build my own so am concentrating on completely built guns only.

Any brands stand out? Any brands to stay away from? Sorry for all the questions, but I want to do this right.

Joe

Given that budget, pick the parts and build your own...you won't regret it...

Posted: **Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:39 am**

I don't own one, but I've been looking at the Ruger AR 223 It's going for $600 and change, It has pretty good reviews, It has dust covers and forward assist, a reputation for being very reliable and trouble free. It is a Ruger and so it can be expected to be rugged reliable and that the company will stand behind their product.

Posted: **Thu Feb 09, 2017 1:44 pm**

JRG wrote:I have finally decided to enter the AR-15 arena and purchase one. This being my initial rifle purchase, I am seeking out the wisdom of this group.

I would like to keep this purchase under $1000. This would primarily be a range toy, home defense gun. I don't go hunting ever, however, I would like a scope or red dot or some such on it.

I don't necessarily want one with all the bells and whistles, but also do not want one that is so cheap that some parts need to be replaced to make it function properly.

I am not skilled enough to build my own so am concentrating on completely built guns only.

Any brands stand out? Any brands to stay away from? Sorry for all the questions, but I want to do this right.

Joe

Review of the S&W M&P 15 Sport 2:
https://www.full30.com/video/cda84c0419 ... 318db9af0d

Posted: **Thu Feb 09, 2017 3:04 pm**

Liberty wrote:I don't own one, but I've been looking at the Ruger AR 223 It's going for $600 and change, It has pretty good reviews, It has dust covers and forward assist, a reputation for being very reliable and trouble free. It is a Ruger and so it can be expected to be rugged reliable and that the company will stand behind their product.

I wouldn't recommend the Ruger just because of their non-standard parts... especially the use of an non-shrouded firing pin.

Posted: **Thu Feb 09, 2017 3:33 pm**

cyphertext makes an excellent point.

You definitely don't want a non-shrouded firing pin. This is the kind of thing that can be avoided buying a higher quality AR.

Plus, the OP stated he doesn't care to assemble his AR. For you that insist he assemble his own AR, why not honor his wish?

Posted: **Thu Feb 09, 2017 3:55 pm**

Abraham wrote:the OP stated he doesn't care to assemble his AR. For you that insist he assemble his own AR, why not honor his wish?

Another option is this, you only have to add handguard and buttstock of your choosing:
http://www.brownells.com/firearms/rifle ... 81838.aspx

That's about the comfort level I'd have of "assembling" my own.

Posted: **Thu Feb 09, 2017 4:44 pm**

cyphertext wrote:Yes, the reason for the forward assist is that the Army couldn't let go of the design of the M1 and M14 with operating rods. While the military still trains SPORTS for stoppages, many shooting schools no longer do. For a battle field rifle that may not get proper cleaning and maintenance regularly, it has it's place. For a civilian rifle that is used at the range, I would rather clear the round than force it into the chamber.

Yep. Although I do use forward assists regularly. I store most of my guns loaded, and when I pull one out of the safe I always do a chamber check to make there's a cartridge happily nestled in there. May not need to, but since I've eased the round out a bit, I always give the forward assist a bump afterward. If I didn't have a forward assist on one, I'd probably high-five empty air every time.

And I agree with you about SPORTS. Didn't know that was still being taught.

Posted: **Thu Feb 09, 2017 7:39 pm**

cyphertext wrote:I wouldn't recommend the Ruger just because of their non-standard parts... especially the use of an non-shrouded firing pin.

I have long avoided Colt because of their Clinton Pins and other non-spec garbage.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2017 12:02 am**

ninjabread wrote:
cyphertext wrote:I wouldn't recommend the Ruger just because of their non-standard parts... especially the use of an non-shrouded firing pin.
I have long avoided Colt because of their Clinton Pins and other non-spec garbage.

Colt is all back to mil-spec parts now. Strange that Ruger decided to use the old Colt semi auto carrier design that no one uses anymore.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2017 1:25 pm**

I have no idea as to the quality of the rifle, but Primary Arms has a complete AR for $399.
And another one.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2017 2:35 pm**

It still amazes me that one can now buy an AR made in the USA for less than an AK made in Eastern Europe.

Posted: **Fri Feb 10, 2017 7:41 pm**

KC5AV wrote:I have no idea as to the quality of the rifle, but Primary Arms has a complete AR for $399.
And another one.

The first is sold out now and the second has 2 stars on the Primary Arms website but it's only one review. Does anybody have experience with the Radical brand? Any company can have a lemon but some have a bushel. Google search has some drama that isn't about the build quality.

Is the second rifle worth grabbing as a truck/trunk gun or should I save my money for a famous name brand?

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