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Fists can certainly be a deadly weapon. Last week we ministered to a family right behind our church who lost their son. He was beat to death. No weapons. Fists only. The deceased was a health, big strong young man in his late 20s.
Agreed, it will be the jury that decides. That "bruise" visible in the mug shot may not be the only injury. Blows to the temple & upper cheek by fists can inflict griveous body injury & cause death for sure.

longtooth wrote:Fists can certainly be a deadly weapon. Last week we ministered to a family right behind our church who lost their son. He was beat to death. No weapons. Fists only. The deceased was a health, big strong young man in his late 20s.
Agreed, it will be the jury that decides. That "bruise" visible in the mug shot may not be the only injury. Blows to the temple & upper cheek by fists can inflict griveous body injury & cause death for sure.

longtooth wrote: Fists can certainly be a deadly weapon.

Absolutely!

longtooth wrote: Blows to the temple & upper cheek by fists can inflict griveous body injury & cause death for sure.

Blows to the temple can cause severe injury or death. Strikes to the neck can be even more dangerous.
A strike (intentional or not) to the Carotid Sinus could be fatal....and would likely result in little to no bruising (in the average healthy person).

The deceased was 22 years older than the person that stabbed him. (66 vs. 48).

Personally, I'd rather defend myself for shooting someone instead of stabbing.

Juries do not see knives as a 'gentleman's weapon'.

There will be a lot of details that we might or might not ever learn. The fact that the fight started in public and then moved to an "employees only" section tell us one of two things: either one of them was being an aggressor and pursuing the other who was retreating, or they moved there to continue "mutual combat".

The former situation leads to legitimate self defense; the latter does not.

I'm not worried about the age difference. I've known many men in their mid-60s who are strong as a mule and mean as a snake, perfectly capable of beating down an overweight guy 18 years younger. (Not 22 years, switch -- check your math.)

As for knife vs. gun, since the guy was teaching a class, he probably didn't have a loaded gun with him. Whether justified homicide or murder, he might have just used what he had at hand.

When I was in college my wife worked in a drug store with an exMarine who was in his early 70s, fifty years older than me. He was probably be the toughest man (if not for the 10 year daughter rule, I would use 3 initials instead) I have ever known personally. I played soccer in college and was in terrific shape but I would have never even thought about taking him on. Occasionally he would show my wife holds she could use to incapacitate people using me as the subject. I was always at his mercy. And then he would tell us what he would do, which always was worse, more effective and which I had no doubt he was fully capable of even at 70. Frankly, in close quarters, I would have been terrified to take him on even if I was armed, knife or gun, and he wasn't. So while usually someone who is older is in the weaker position, that doesn't always hold true.

Was it at Sharp Shooters?? Thats the only gun store in Lubbock I'm familer with.

KBCraig wrote:I'm not worried about the age difference. I've known many men in their mid-60s who are strong as a mule and mean as a snake, perfectly capable of beating down an overweight guy 18 years younger.

Yep; I was working communications for a bike race last weekend, and I was stationed at the rest stop 65mi from the starting line. There were men and women rolling through there who were in their 60s and 70s, still looking healthier than the 20-somethings. Especially impressive considering the 90+ degree heat. I was sitting in the car with the A/C on full blast and dreading the 20 yard hike to the port-a-can in that heat.

hoss4570 wrote:Was it at Sharp Shooters??

They give pictures of the place, but not the name.

A different article names it as Fred's Gun Emporium.

http://www.lubbockonline.com/stories/08 ... 7083.shtml

Story last updated at 3:27 a.m. Friday, August 17, 2007

Stabbing at gunshop proves fatal
ROBIN PYLE
AVALANCHE-JOURNAL

Lubbock police are investigating a fatal stabbing at a local gun shop Thursday evening.

At about 5:45 p.m., a person was stabbed at Fred's Gun Emporium, 3003 Slide Road. The victim was taken to University Medical Center, where the person was pronounced dead, police said.

Authorities had not made any arrests and had yet to name a suspect in the stabbing.

Investigators were questioning at least one person at the police department late Thursday.

Anyone with information about the case is encouraged to call Crime Line at 741-1000. Callers may remain anonymous.

On the local news tonight they said the guy who did it was released on $100,000 bond today. Most of the other suspects in deaths lately around here have gotten $500,000 to $1,000,000 bonds. It sounds like maybe there may be some extinuating circumstances why it was so low. But I'm no lawyer or LEO so I don't know.

stroo wrote:When I was in college my wife worked in a drug store with an exMarine who was in his early 70s, fifty years older than me. He was probably be the toughest man (if not for the 10 year daughter rule, I would use 3 initials instead) I have ever known personally. I played soccer in college and was in terrific shape but I would have never even thought about taking him on. Occasionally he would show my wife holds she could use to incapacitate people using me as the subject. I was always at his mercy. And then he would tell us what he would do, which always was worse, more effective and which I had no doubt he was fully capable of even at 70. Frankly, in close quarters, I would have been terrified to take him on even if I was armed, knife or gun, and he wasn't. So while usually someone who is older is in the weaker position, that doesn't always hold true.

Yes, and there are women that can kick my can, but the law recognizes that 'most' seniors, children and females are at a disadvantage when facing a middle-aged male attacker.

grandpatim wrote:On the local news tonight they said the guy who did it was released on $100,000 bond today. Most of the other suspects in deaths lately around here have gotten $500,000 to $1,000,000 bonds. It sounds like maybe there may be some extinuating circumstances why it was so low. But I'm no lawyer or LEO so I don't know.

Bail is only supposed to be based upon "Danger to community" and "Flight Risk". If defender is proven to be very unlikely to attack anyone else or skip bail, a lower bail amount is in order.

Lack of information and fear

Good media editor there..gonna sell ALOT of newspapers with that headline



This one is more news than over sensationalized anti-gun tripe of the 1st one

http://www.lubbockonline.com/stories/08 ... 7083.shtml

switch wrote:Yes, and there are women that can kick my can, but the law recognizes that 'most' seniors, children and females are at a disadvantage when facing a middle-aged male attacker.

I can think of several crimes that are enhanced if the victim is very young, and a few that are enhanced if the victim is very old, but could you point out somewhere that the law recognizes women as being disadvantaged?

KD5NRH wrote:

switch wrote:Yes, and there are women that can kick my can, but the law recognizes that 'most' seniors, children and females are at a disadvantage when facing a middle-aged male attacker.

I can think of several crimes that are enhanced if the victim is very young, and a few that are enhanced if the victim is very old, but could you point out somewhere that the law recognizes women as being disadvantaged?

I cannot quote a specific law, however, DPS teaches that a woman can use deadly force if attacked by a man because there is a presumed physical disadvantage. A man can only use deadly force if his attacker is way younger or way bigger.